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Ireland Team Talk XII: Farrell's First Fifteen

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,790 ✭✭✭ersatz


    Yeah, Izzy for me is an X factor player, does the job in scrum and lineout but is the kind go guy who can operate as another quick back in attacking play. Rugby is definitely going in his direction.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,905 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    Certainly agree on the need for a player of Edogbo's profile. Mangan is another lad who's impressed this season, can't remember what side he slots in at. I think we need to look at moving past Conan as a starter, or at least be willing to countenance someone else ahead of him. Baird probably would've taken the shirt if he'd stayed healthy, and I think Prendergast has been in irresistible form the last few months.

    I'd disagree on Lowry's athleticism, he's looked very quick and twitchy any time I've watched him this season. He has a level of playmaking that we could do with, especially in the absence of Hansen and Lowe.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,598 ✭✭✭FtD v2


    I'd love to see Cian Prendergast get the chance to stake a claim on the 6 shirt this summer, I think he's earned the right after a really strong 2026 to date.

    Mangan, thus far, scrummages on the loose head side. Even when alongside Brian Deeny (who you'd think Mangan is more powerful than), Deeny tends to switch to TH lock. Mangan is another good player, but another one of those hybrid lock / flanker types.

    I just don't see it on Lowry - the nightmare scenario for me would be a situation where we have Lowry, Sam Prendergast and Craig Casey on the field at the same time. Three exceptionally poor defenders. You can't carry that kind of risk IMO.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,893 ✭✭✭leakyboots


    I dunno how Lowry hasn't gotten more of a look-in at 15, especially in a relatively pedestrian backline like we often put out and have been putting in wingers and centres out of position when Keenan was out.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,598 ✭✭✭FtD v2


    I do - it's because he's 5ft 5ins tall and weighs around 77kgs, and even for that, he's not exceptionally fast.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,598 ✭✭✭FtD v2


    If Leinster win on Saturday against the Stormers, the first test in Sydney against Australia is 2 weeks after the URC Grand Final.

    When you consider a sizable chunk of the squad were playing last August for the Lions, and most then played a very season in Europe, URC and internationally for Ireland, it's definitely a huge amount of rugby to be putting on the players.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,790 ✭✭✭ersatz


    I've been thinking about this and the impact for next season. An aspect of Leinster's so so form has to be the Lions disputing the Summer and players return. This Summer w the Nations thing will be just as intense for even more players.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,598 ✭✭✭FtD v2


    It can't be as intense, it's still just three games, and it's done and dusted by July 18th.

    The URC season doesn't begin until the end of September.

    The Lions tour by contrast was 5 weeks in total (plus more time in camp before that), and was a 10-game tour altogether (although granted no one played that many games).

    I definitely agree though that it's likely been a big factor this year. It's just a huge amount of big games, different tournaments etc to keep trying to get yourself up for.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 34,128 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    The irritating gap between the URC final and first Nations League game seems entirely to placate the french. If they dont send a full team after this...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,790 ✭✭✭ersatz


    Right, I misunderstood the format and thought there were more games. Basically the same as a Summer/Autumn series, but with a league table.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,124 ✭✭✭DBK1


    Something that’s never referenced when your listening to all the waffle about Leinster being “a team of internationals” that are “the most expensive club team in the world”

    The rest of the Provinces don’t know how lucky they are to have the majority of their frontline players fully rested coming into every season and under full control of their province whereas Leinster have a team of worn out Internationals that spend most of the season recovering from fatigue and injury from test matches and then when they are fit they’re following rtp protocols.

    The sooner the rest of the Provinces start doing some of the hard work to produce test level players the better for Leinster.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 72 ✭✭shinana abu


    Accurate , well stated



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 599 ✭✭✭Tommybojangles


    Cian has a great shot at nailing down the 6 shirt imo. He's really moved up a level since the 6 Nations. He can't really have any complaints after getting the start in Paris and not doing himself justice but on the other hand everyone else involved that day got another opportunity



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,401 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    I think a fit Ryan Baird is a level above any other blindside flanker Ireland can field, bar Beirne. Unfortunately, he's been hampered by two leg fractures this season. Hopefully he recovers fully and is ready for the start of next season.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,138 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    CP did get a run against England, in fairness, but I agree he deserves a decent run this summer, especially in Baird's absence. I hope Conan is limited to bench impact and Beirne stays in the second row.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,038 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    I hope he starts a couple of the games at 6, his form has been class and I think we could see him push on from here and estasbish himself as a real option.

    I think it's going to be an interesting summer selection-wise given some of the injuries etc. and off the back of a 6 Nations where we had some more newer faces getting opportunities. Certainly more so than previous seasons.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 43,033 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Leinster has a population of close to three million, Connacht has close to 600k.

    So basically Connacht should have one player for every five from Leinster. We've had Bealham, Murray, Prendergast, Aki and Hansen playing for Ireland. Have Leinster had 25 different players in Ireland squads in recent times?

    I'm not including players like Gavin and Bohan who've been part of larger squads, just those who've actually played.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,087 ✭✭✭For Petes Sake


    By my count, it's 23 - so essentially a full match-day squad.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,124 ✭✭✭DBK1


    Off the top of my head I would say yes they have.

    In the last 2 years alone they’ve had 9 front rows, 2 second rows, 4 back rows,
    4 half backs, 3 centres (I’m counting Osbourne as a centre) and 4 outside backs. That’s 26 I could name and I’ve surely left a few out as well.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 4,135 ✭✭✭50HX


    What provencial coach wouldnt want a raft front line players of international quality?

    Thats the flip side of looking at it.

    I dont see how its waffle to state that leinster have a team of internationals when factually thats correct.

    If it were a case that said internationals weren't performing at test level then fair enough there is a case to be made but they have performed & been successful.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,124 ✭✭✭DBK1


    But they’re a team of internationals that hardly ever play for Leinster due to their international commitments, return to play protocols etc.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,038 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    … which hasn't appeared to impact Leinster getting to the knock-out stages of those tournaments when said international players come back into the team.

    Look, I agree with you that there needs to be a better balance of representation in the Ireland team, for many reasons. (Imo, the introduction of the 40% will help this in the long-term).

    But arguing "the other provinces don't know how lucky they have it by….. not having all these international calibre players" just comes across more than a little tone deaf.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 4,135 ✭✭✭50HX


    Thats broadly not true.

    They are available on the most part for all of the pool stages& knockouts of CC & URC.

    Granted the return to play protocols will restrict their league games to a certain degree.

    Thats understandable & reflective of the priority the CC takes.

    I think its only now we are beginning to see the impact the Lions tour is having ( wouldnt change the UBB result imo) & as another poster stated it will show even more on the summer tests.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 43,033 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    You said all province's need to contribute more. Connacht are contributing at the same level as Leinster given the population of both provinces.



  • Subscribers, Paid Member Posts: 45,542 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    do you think provinces should be contributing on a pro rata basis compared to their annual bugets?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,138 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    The obvious problem here is that of the five Connacht players you named, only one is actually from Connacht. The pool of granny-rule players (Bealham, Hansen) is always limited, project players (Aki) are going to be a serious rarity in the future and the over-supply of Leinster schools' players (Prendergast) won't last forever.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,124 ✭✭✭DBK1


    I made no reference to population, that was yourself.

    If you do want to relate it to population then be realistic about the numbers too. The majority of foreign born or non Irish citizens in the country live in Leinster. The chances of any of them having ambitions of playing rugby for Leinster is as good as zero so eliminate them from your numbers. There are also far more Connacht, Munster and Ulster people who moved to Dublin and the surrounding for work etc. than there is vice versa so that’ll skew your figures too.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 43,033 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    It's amazing how you bring them up but don't mention JGP and Lowe

    The Leinster schools have nothing to do with Leinster rugby. If we get a player from there it's normally because he isn't wanted by Leinster. We are developing players not deemed good enough for Leinster and turning them into Ireland internationals. We deserve credit for that.

    And don't forget the Ireland captain is a Mayo man.



  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 36,506 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney


    There's only two weeks between the URC final (and the Super Rugby final) and the Australia gzme, one week between the Top14 final and their game in NZ. What's irritating or placatory about that ?



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  • Subscribers, Paid Member Posts: 45,542 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    The Leinster schools have nothing to do with Leinster rugby.

    you might want to revisit that statement.

    while its clearly incorrect, you might want to set the parameter's as to what you are referring to, because its very easy write a diatribe as what impact / effect / input Leinster Rugby has in schools rugby in the province.



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