Advertisement
Help Keep Boards Alive. Support us by going ad free today. See here: https://subscriptions.boards.ie/.
https://www.boards.ie/group/1878-subscribers-forum

Private Group for paid up members of Boards.ie. Join the club.
Hi all, please see this major site announcement: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058427594/boards-ie-2026

General British politics discussion thread

1669670672674675678

Comments

  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 33,942 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    It is a piss poor argument for staying at a time when decisive leadership on the issue was needed.

    It also, clearly, leaves open that leaving might be a good thing and his reference to at least staying in the single market makes sense just parrots half the brexiteers!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,958 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    This is it. It's just blind antagonism.

    Corbyn was far from a perfect leader, MP or even person, probably. But one thing I will say for him is that he was honest. Too honest, more than likely, for the realm of politics.

    Frankly, we could do with a lot more people like Jeremy Corbyn in politics.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 45,422 ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    Of course Article 50 had to be triggered. Nobody is suggesting otherwise. However, it's fair that you let people adjust to the result before you plough on with it. Suggesting that it be done immediately suggests very, very strongly that he was happy with the result.

    I remember that day well. I remember going to work. I remember doing absolutely nothing. I remember how the new genetics team my employer had lured over from Spain were in particularly poor spirits.

    Speaking of facts, any Brexit this country got was always going to be a Tory Brexit. Any socialists who were supporting it for any reason were either malevolent or complete morons.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,958 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    The vote was cast. Withdrawal was going to happen and it was better to start an organised procedure as soon as possible than to let something fester. There would have been two years for everybody to "adjust" in any case.

    An organised process is much better than unorganised chaos.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 45,422 ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    Nobody's disagreeing that withdrawal was going to happen but Cameron won a very slender majority in 2015. He was never going to survive if Brexit won. It was always going to be a mess and Corbyn wanted to make it worse.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,958 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    Look, you have it your way. I don't care.

    Your ranting and raving about Jeremy Corbyn every few weeks when the likes of Nigel Farage is walking down the other side of the street is absolutely insane.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 45,422 ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    I didn't bring him up.

    What's insane is this type of bad faith tactic when someone asks questions or criticises. It's proper MAGA stuff, honestly. I've made criticisms and provided links, as have others. The result is this pathetic suggestion that criticising Corbyn means tolerating Farage. I suppose it's an improvement on the all criticism of Corbyn equates to support for genocide in Gaza trope.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,958 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    This is ludicrous levels of ranting. You're banging on about MAGA and Gaza now. Utterly unreasonable nonsense.

    To use a phrase you're fond of yourself…

    We're done here.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 9,986 ✭✭✭blackwhite


    As usual - any remote mention of Saint Jeremy brings out his disciples to scream down anything that might be interpreted as even slightly negative towards him.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 45,422 ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    I remember being delighted when he won the party leadership in 2015. I remember reading Owen Jones' two books (at the time) and feeling quite outraged about austerity. If anything was going to come out of another Cameron term, it would be that we'd have a real Labour government. No matter that the press were out to get him, people would have had enough of austerity and Cameron's corporate nonsense.

    Then of course came the referendum on EU membership. His office, particularly Seumas Milne, did everything possible to frustrate the Labour Remain campaign. Personally, I've always thought the Lexit case to be the height of stupidity since it was a Tory project, but we are where we are. He says he voted remain but Diane Abbott says he's a Brexiter at heart. He voted against every piece of EU legislation in Parliament and was the first to call for the triggering of Article 50.

    When the Salisbury poisonings occurred, he spouted deranged drivel about dialogue with Russia. With Trident, he wanted to build the subs without the missiles so the unions would get a nice bung. When Putin invaded Ukraine, he and the odious Stop the War group spouted their tankie drivel about NATO expansion. He'd bring constituents' letters to Parliament to read out but when Theresa May asked him to forward them to her, he never did so.

    The whole thing was a clown car and the crowning glory was Your Party, a party set up on one single issue: Gaza. Naturally, these snakes wasted no time in turning on each other. They can't even cooperate over the issue they say they care about.

    Of course if we criticise any of this, it means we support genocide in Gaza. It's like MAGA or the Confederacy Lost Cause, honestly.

    If anyone's interested, I'd recommend Gabriel Pogrund and Patrick Maguire's Left Out: The Inside Story of Labour Under Corbyn. 

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 983 ✭✭✭midlander12


    But could we not just forget about him? Apart from one appearance on Newsnight a few months ago, I never see him mentioned any more except on this thread. He's yesterday's man and Polanski's Greens have taken over that cohort of the electorate, for better or worse.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 45,422 ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    I didn't bring him up. Happy to discuss other things such as Farage's bribe.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 983 ✭✭✭midlander12


    Fair enough. This should cheer you up.

    The Campaign Diary of Robert Kenyon Aged 41 and Three-Quarters (as imagined by John Crace) | John Crace | The Guardian

    It doesn’t take me long to fix the leak. “How much do I owe you?” Jim asks; Nige chips in. “That will be £5m, please. That’s my standard rate callout charge. It’s to cover my security. I mean, it’s a donation. Actually, call it a gift. Just for the pleasure of meeting me. A chance to see Nigel being Nigel out in the wild. And, if it’s all the same, I would rather you paid me in crypto. Makes things easier all round.”

    “Actually,” I say. “You can pay me in roubles. The cash will come in handy for my next holiday in St Petersburg. I love Russia. I was gutted when Ukraine tried to invade it. It’s a tragedy Putin hasn’t yet occupied Kyiv.” A dig in the ribs from Nige. “We no longer support Russia, you halfwit,” he hisses. “We are all Ukrainians now. And watch out for your laptop. The Kremlin might be hacking it as we speak.”

    “Soz,” I laugh. That’s what I love about being the Reform candidate. You learn something new every day.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 18,071 ✭✭✭✭astrofool


    If Corbyn gets brought up his failures will follow him. It is shocking that of the last 7 leaders (think I have it correct from Cameron onwards), May looks to have been the most competent followed by Starmer and you'd probably rank Corbyn slightly above Truss in the competence stakes (Your Party hasn't been defeated by lettuce yet), but it's a time in British political history that will be known for a weak opposition which struggled to make hard decisions and let the stupidity of Brexit go ahead with barely a push back.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 983 ✭✭✭midlander12


    Agreed, a shocking calibre of politicians overall. None appear/ed to have any concept of (or care for) the world outside their own Facebook page or Twitter feed. There's little sign of that changing.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,318 ✭✭✭Good loser


    Very interesting and enlightening post. Must get my hands on that book you recommend.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,487 ✭✭✭deirdremf


    Fair enough on that point - but is it true that a catholic can be crowned monarch?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 34,831 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    You can marry one but obviously as head of the Church of England you would have to be a member. Same way you can't have a protestant pope.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,955 ✭✭✭rock22


    Well you could have a disestablished church of England and allow the monarch to be what ever religion he/she wants.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 34,831 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Well you could but when it comes to religion you could have a list of a million common sense things like for instance not having religion or keeping it as a private non political matter that you don't declare in legal documents like a census. You could have she popes and she clerics.

    Way way better than a disestablished monarchy would be no monarchy but alas people are idiots.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,487 ✭✭✭deirdremf


    So in fact this is legal discrimination. All aspirants to the monarchy must profess a specific religion?

    This clearly makes members of all other religions de facto and de lege second class citizens.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 983 ✭✭✭midlander12


    Well, James II tried it as a non-member but it didn't go so well for him.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 34,831 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    You are angry at the wrong thing.

    The existence of a monarchy makes everyone who didn't spring from a certain families sperm or egg a second class citizen.

    Its pointless to argue discrimination with a monarchy or religion. Even here in our supposedly egalitarian republic religion is allowed bar women from jobs. The British monarchy is also exempt from various laws surrounding tax status, declaration and government spending opacity.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,230 ✭✭✭Randycove


    I’m guessing here, but I bet aspirants to become Pope face similar discrimination.

    It affects one person per generation, so it isn’t exactly a massive crime against humanity. Unlike back in the day when Monarchs chopped and changed religions, resulting in literally millions of deaths across Europe.

    Now, schools having a special opt out of the human rights act so they can discriminate, that is worth getting animated about.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 983 ✭✭✭midlander12


    I think Sturgeon might have waited at least until after the upcoming byelections before she did this interview. It sounds like a low-brow version of Mailtlis and the Andrew Formerly Known as Prince. Anyway, Crace gives her the treatment here that he normally reserves for Kemi Badenoch.

    Nicola’s only crime was to love too much. And to not notice the Jaguar on the drive | John Crace | The Guardian

    Then we got to the accounts. Three people had quit the SNP executive because they felt the accounts were iffy, but Nicola, the party leader, had always been quite happy that everything was above board. Oh, that, she said. Accounts always go up and down. There’s always something no one quite understands and you just have to let it go. And the concerns had never been about the money being embezzled. They were about funds that had been given for independence being diverted to electioneering. So that was all fine, then. A completely different crime!

    “I’m not going to say sorry for a crime I didn’t commit,” Nicola said defiantly. Nor was she going to say sorry for a crime she might have been able to prevent if only she had a functioning pair of synapses



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 24,728 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    There were discussions here last week UK politics, Israel and the perception as to how much factors related to the latter influence the former.

    Over the weekend, Cenk Uygur and his nephew (who is famous in his own right) Hasan Piker both had their visas to visit the UK redacted at the direction of the current government.

    Link

    Left-wing broadcasters Cenk Uygur and Hasan Piker banned from UK
    The uncle and nephew, who were booked to appear at SXSW London, have travel authorisation revoked after concern over comments about Israel

    Cenk has gone online saying directly that his was canceled because of his criticism of Israel. If he is correct, that means tthe UK banned a US citizen because they deemed his criticism of Israel was problematic. The same Israel whose PM is wanted by the ICC for genocidal acts.


    Would those who don't think Israel has influence on the UK government maintain that position given this story?


    What do you think either of these people has said that is untrue and problematic?
    Hasan apparently was due to do separate pieces with Zach Polansky and Jeremy Corbyn while visiting.

    Separately, but not completely unrelated, this tweet passed by my feed over the weekend. The videos are not new, but seeing them side by side, the starkness of the thought process and the positioning is very obvious.
    I'm sure these two stories are entirely unrelated of course.

    For those who wont take the 45 seconds to watch the video

    Left Side - Talking about Russia in Ukraine "I think it is very important that when we see acts like this, that we call them out. They are war crimes"

    Right Side - Talking about Israel in Gaza "What I dont think is wise is for politicians to sit looking at clips on social media and on programs and forming instant judgement about whether its a breach of this law or that."

    Post edited by Tell me how on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 31,680 ✭✭✭✭looksee


    As a non-resident Brit I am very concerned about the news coming out of Cenk Uygur and Hassan Bei being refused entry to the UK. I don't know anything about Hassan Bei but I have listened to Cenk Uygur a few times and while I am not particularly a fan, I don't entirely see where the government is coming from. If he did/does criticise Israel, is this a reason for banning him? He is not (I think) preaching anti-Sematism, that is a different thing to criticising Israel, he is not, afaik inciting violence or racial hatred. If he has been doing either of these, then the decision is probably justified, but it needs a clearer explanation before an opinion can be formed, it sounds like a very suspect decision to me.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 45,422 ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    I find it impossible to believe that either of these fellas are banned from entering this country just because they criticised Israel. I've no idea who either of them are (Cenk is a Young Turk, whatever that means). Opposition to Israel's genocide is a mainstream political position here so on that basis alone, it makes no sense to block the entry of either of them.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,681 ✭✭✭✭A Dub in Glasgo


    Don't you know it is considered (by some) that Israeli influence on British politics is a conspiracy theory but the evidence demonstrates that line of closing down the argument is utter tripe.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,681 ✭✭✭✭A Dub in Glasgo


    Sturgeon and her cohort were a liability for a long time now



Advertisement
Advertisement