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Ireland vs Israel - To play or not to play, that is the question Read OP for Mod Warning

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,224 ✭✭✭Paddy_Mag


    It is important to those dependent on The games to pay their bills, put food on the table, pay mortgage/rent etc.

    Are you willing to forego your wages for the next 3 months and donate it to a charity that works in palestine so?

    Or is it important to you that you get paid?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 56,817 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Who won't get paid if the games don't go ahead and why will they not get paid ?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,224 ✭✭✭Paddy_Mag


    The FAI in 2024 had a wage bill of approx €14m

    Income from games and commercial, which are inter linked was approx €35m

    If the home game doesn't happen, thats €4-5m in income lost. But the call for a boycott is for 2 games. Not fulfilling one/both fixtures puts the FAI in breach of contract over the TV rights for the nations league and thats worth approx €10m to them. Who knows what happens there but its safe to assume some/all of that money could be withheld by UEFA.

    So, massive loss of income = financial consequences for the FAI who are not exactly flush with cash. Only 5 months ago they made a number of people redundant. Only last month the government agrees to defer a €1.5m loan repayment (from the Delaney era) indefinitely. Its basic economics.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 56,817 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,224 ✭✭✭Paddy_Mag


    If they sacrifice a significant chunk of income and are already strapped for cash, what do they pay them with? Solidarity and morals?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 56,817 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    What did they pay them with anytime we didn't qualify in the group stages ?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,224 ✭✭✭Paddy_Mag


    The group stages of what? We take part in the nations league every time it happens.

    The FAI have guaranteed participation in Euro/WC qualifiers, nations league matches and they organise some friendlies.

    This year There is an international window in late Sept/early october with 4 games, and a 2 game window in November for the nations league and there is somewhere in the region of €10m guaranteed for the FAI from the TV rights deal



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,168 ✭✭✭Pauliedragon


    If Isreal had no weapons they couldn't commit genocide. Ireland is an economic ally of Germany as part of the EU. In my opinion any country who is selling arms to a genocidal country as in Isreal is just as complicit. Germany and the US are just as responsible for Palistine genocide in my opinion but nobody mentions that. There's nothing wrong with me I'm entitled to my opinion just as you are.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 24,371 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    The title of this thread is whether or not to boycott Israel, this poster claimed not, for financial reasons, but when asked would they change their argument if the financials were overcome, they refuse to even do that. They don't care about the financials any more than they care about if underage Irish players have to share tracksuits. They are here to do one thing, defend israel.

    We've seen supporters of Israel across all sorts of media use every sort of excuse these last few years to defend the actions the state has carried out. This was another example of that.

    And that's fine, it's a free country and the poster can support who they want, but I can call them out on that given the topic that is being discussed. This isn't like much of Western media where Israeli supporters can use false narratives to defend Israel's position and not be called out on it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 24,371 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Possibly, but not definitely.

    To do that, UEFA would not only to have to keep their eyes closed and their fingers in their ears, but they would have to pay attention and then choose to side with a country that is currently fighting a war (at its choosing) against two of its neighbours, and has recently introduced a death penalty law only for some people within its population.

    It would put UEFA very much on the spot to have to look at the situation and penalize the country taking a stand against a genocidal and apartheid state.

    In that context, I don't think they'd do it. I'm not 100% sure but probably feel about 70%-30% they would act against Ireland as you suggest they might.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 24,371 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Get over yourself. That poster has been posting continuously posting focusing on the financial reasons for not boycotting.

    I put them on the spot this morning asking if that was removed, would they change their stance. They reacted by calling for moderators to come in an rescue them and throughout the day they have refused to be willing to change their stance if there was a feasible way to replace the income lost as a consequence of not playing Israel, or to take ownership of their support for Israel.

    This is a discussion board and that poster like everyone else chose to take part in it. They don't get to do so unchallenged just because they are uncomfortable with what that says about them.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 24,371 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Be great if someone had a suggestion to replace the income of not playing Israel, wouldn't it?

    You'd think it might be enough to make people support the boycott if money is their reason for not doing so?

    What do you think?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,224 ✭✭✭Paddy_Mag


    Ireland vs Israel - To play or not to play, that is the question

    This is title of the thread. The thread is NOT about boycotting Israel. Its about whether or not two UEFA drawn and scheduled football matches between Ireland and Israel should be played. When you talk about false narratives, your quite fond of them yourself when it suits your virtue signalling nonsense.

    There is even a mod warning about the discussion being kept to the football match. Screenshot below. You keep veering off into totally unrelated topics.

    Its pretty hard to change the argument supporting the games being played because the financial issues cannot be overcome. Ive seen no evidence to suggest its even remotely possible. Unlike you, I live in the real world.

    1000009646.jpg

    The 2024 report for the FAI. Debts at around €40m. Approx 250 staff although there was some recent redundancies announced. Not sure if they have come into effect yet and the 2025 report is not yet available. That probably doesn't have to be published for another few months.

    https://d2w4iw8gs9jo14.cloudfront.net/5317/6097/0574/The_Football_Association_of_Ireland_2024_-_Final.pdf



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,224 ✭✭✭Paddy_Mag


    But its not possible.

    The nations league TV deal is locked in until 2028. So unless your able to undo that deal worth 100s of millions of euros, your talking sh1te.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 24,371 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    There is even a mod warning about the discussion being kept to the football match. Screenshot below. You keep veering off into totally unrelated topics.

    You don't get to do that, my comments are specifically related to the logic around the game being boycotted and peoples motivations in that respect. You don't get to post here as much as you do and be protected from being asked to defend your position.

    Go start your own thread on the topic if you wish, but if you want to do so with your logic, then all you should have is a poll in the OP and nothing else.

    This is a discussion board and we are discussing the thread topic. You don't have to take part in it if you don't want to. I guarantee I'm not going to be following you anywhere begging you to come back.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,224 ✭✭✭Paddy_Mag


    UEFA already made their stance clear when they didn't act to ban Israel, nor did they support the FAI motion so we know where they stand. And their big cousin, FIFA fawned over DJT at the draw a few months ago, the same DJT who is president of Israels biggest ally.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 9,719 ✭✭✭Backstreet Moyes


    The only person who needs to get over themelf is you.

    You have spent the day badgering a poster to answer a question which he or she has no obligation to do.

    While at the same time you are refusing to answer that's posters question.

    I was at a children's party this morning and it pales in comparison to your behaviour.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,224 ✭✭✭Paddy_Mag


    I dont have to protect my position though. I am perfectly entitled to my opinion and clearly it grates with you that we don't all just fall in line with your virtue signalling bollox



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 24,371 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    What evidence have you that A - the Nations League TV deal is worth 100's of millions to the FAI and B, that it would be jeopardized entirely by not playing 2 fixtures?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,176 ✭✭✭c montgomery


    I'm looking forward to the game, Ireland have built momentum and its important we show our support..



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,224 ✭✭✭Paddy_Mag


    I never said the TV deal was worth 100s of millions to the FAI. Its a collective TV deal for the nations league and Google searches indicate the FAI get approx €10m.

    The same TV companies who received refunds from Premier league worth £170m etc when covid hit and games didnt get fulfilled. So common sense dictates that the FAI failing to fulfilling contractual obligations in the nations league will have consequences. The TV companies buy rights and sell advertising on that basis.

    If you hire a glazier to fit new windows , and he only did the front of the house are you going to pay him for the ones at the back they didnt fit?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 9,719 ✭✭✭Backstreet Moyes


    You don't have to qualify for the nations league.

    You clearly have no idea what you are taking about.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,224 ✭✭✭Paddy_Mag


    Me too. Can't wait. Have tickets to all 3 home games in autumn.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,224 ✭✭✭Paddy_Mag


    Yeah, smacks of tell me you're clueless about football without telling me you're clueless about football.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,622 ✭✭✭csirl


    The irony is tbat you are likely posting with a device which has Israeli parts.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 24,371 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    I made the initial proposal, that I would suggest an alternative to overcome the loss of income from the two Israeli games if the poster said they would post further with that proposal in mind.

    They refused to even countenance that but wanted me to right away suggest what I was talking about. They, or you, don't get to answer a question with a question and then spend the day getting offended because you don't get your way.

    Any time they want to answer it, I'll do what I offered.

    I've pretty much stopped asking them to answer it since this afternoon you can note, apart when they were again beating the "finance" drum to undermine support for the boycott.

    I've made my mind up about the poster, I am not interested in anything else they have to say with respect to this mornings question. But I will respond to their posts as I choose to. Welcome to the internet.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 24,371 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Oh Christ, the "yet you are part of society" meme has entered the chat. How is that ironic?

    Think it's time for bed.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 24,371 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    What are you talking about?

    I thought you were a finance guy? This post makes no sense, why mention 100's of millions in one post to now say that it's at most a 10M conversation?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,224 ✭✭✭Paddy_Mag


    Given you are discussing me, why dont your just post your bullsh1t proposal?

    I don't have to agree to anything in order to post further.

    You have a very high opinion of yourself frankly. Yet more virtue signalling Bollox.

    I am not undermining a boycott because the FAI have stated they will fulfil the fixtures. Your command if the English language is not very good is it. Its hard to undermine something which isnt actually happening. Idiot



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,224 ✭✭✭Paddy_Mag


    The TV deal is for the entire nations league is a UEFA WIDE deal worth 100s of millions of euro. Done and dusted until 2028. The FAI as best as I can see get approx €10m from it. The bigger markets such as England, Germany, Spain, Portugal, Holland, France, Italy etc get a bigger slice of the pie.

    Your mysterious suggestion would have to undo that deal in order to get the FAI out of it. Otherwise they are in breach of contract.



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