Ireland Team Talk XII: Farrell's First Fifteen

Brief_Lives · 24-03-2026 04:40PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124337382#Comment_124337382

it wouild be easier to keep these things to the leinster thread, becasue there is no changing minds here, so why bother.

AbusesToilets · 24-03-2026 04:41PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124337505#Comment_124337505

For me, Fitzgerald was a far more complete player. Could do everything. Bowe was a very fine player and a great finisher. If I'm picking a Space Jam team, I'm taking Fitzgerald every time.

50HX · 24-03-2026 04:52PM

Nice bit of fun to have.

As always we were blessed in the back row.

Sean o b & david wallace are certs for me.

I find it hard to leave out Earls...second in the try scoring record behind BOD.

Its hard to pick even in the pro era as the game keeps evolving

FtD v2 · 24-03-2026 05:03PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124337552#Comment_124337552

Yeah, back row is really tough to pick.

12 is a tough one too - think you could make an argument for any one of Bundee, Robbie Henshaw or Gordon d'Arcy. All three had peaks where they were excellent. If McCloskey had another couple of seasons like the Championship he just had, he'd be right in there too.

I found second row tough enough - I settled very quickly on POC and Beirne, but then debated for a while for the bench option. James Ryan is worth it for me - he was invaluable in 2 Grand Slam campaigns (played every minute in 2023 and should have been nominated for player of the tournament IMO), Players' Player of the Year in 2019, etc. He hasn't been as consistent as POC or Beirne but I still think he deserves to be in here.

After him? Donncha O'Callaghan and Devin Toner had great careers, but struggle to see them ousting Ryan. Iain Henderson, despite going on two Lions' tours never really had a firm grip on the shirt for me. I'd have Donnacha Ryan ahead of Henderson, and would probably also have Malcolm O'Kelly - also a two time Lion a better shout (92 Ireland caps), but I'd still have both behind James Ryan.

Podge_irl · 24-03-2026 05:11PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124337522#Comment_124337522

Except score…

His strike rate for a winger is pretty poor.

AbusesToilets · 24-03-2026 05:17PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124337603#Comment_124337603

That's a fair criticism, no arguments there. He was better for Leinster in that respect. I think he could've been an all time great 12, if he'd been able to stay healthy.

inbloom427 · 24-03-2026 05:29PM

Fitzgerald in there is wild 😝

Podge_irl · 24-03-2026 05:33PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124337623#Comment_124337623

I feel like that argument could be made for a number of players. For whatever reason in Irish rugby it seems the glamour very much goes 10>15>13>wingers>12 and no one seems to want to be put into the 12 jersey ahead of other options.

The less said about Fitzgerald's spell at 15 the better. He certainly had no shortage of talent but I don't think he ever put it together on the international stage consistently.

big-al · 24-03-2026 05:48PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124337522#Comment_124337522

Fitzgerald couldn’t score tries.

Bowe was a significantly better player, his ability to pick and time a line in midfield was phenomenal.

OldRio · 24-03-2026 05:51PM

I'm pretty sure Dan Leavy would have been in this conversation.

AbusesToilets · 24-03-2026 06:15PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124337666#Comment_124337666

I think it's a massive shame that so many of our best players had their prime during the Kidney years. Fitzgerald and BOD as a centre partnership could've been incredible.

Fitzgerald couldn’t score tries.
Bowe was a significantly better player, his ability to pick and time a line in midfield was phenomenal.

You're more than entitled to your opinion, and I understand the basis for it. Bowe certainly had a great try scoring record, but he was middling in defense, and not particularly creative as a playmaker imo. Fitzgerald was a savage defender and had every skill as a passer and stepper. Like I said, he should've been a 12 long term, but again, this is just one arsehole's (me) view of things.

ionadnapóca · 24-03-2026 06:29PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124337581#Comment_124337581

BR is so tough to choose.

The 2010-11 options with SOB, Ferris, Heaslip and Wallace was the best yet. Then Wally was injured.

Personally I think CJ Stander > Heaslip and Doris is already a better player than both of them.

SOB, JvdF, Doris with Wally off the bench would be my favourite BRs.

2011 6N Squad

Ferris (25)

SOB (23)

Heaslip (27)

Wallace (34)

Leamy (29), Jennings, McLoughlin, Ruddock

2027 6N Squad

Baird (27)

Doris (28)

JvdF (33)

Conan (34)

Baird is a bit of a freak in what he can bring athletically. If he can come back strong and Sean Edogbo (21), Bryn Ward (21), Brian Gleeson (21) hopefully all improving; looking at REAL depth of options for RWC squad.

ionadnapóca · 24-03-2026 06:46PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124337552#Comment_124337552

Its hard to pick even in the pro era as the game keeps evolving

Very much.

Keith Wood would be an example.

A true great who played in a truly awful era for Ireland. The 90's.

I cant emphasise enough how brilliant he was and it wasn't until the Six Nations coincided with Gatland-EOS era's did he get some success.

The not straight LO law change would have suited him down to the ground!

A definite starter and Captain in my XV with Sheehan off the bench.

Ben Bailey · 24-03-2026 07:24PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124337886#Comment_124337886

Yep, Fester gotta start

eagle eye · 24-03-2026 08:00PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124337521#Comment_124337521

The Leinster fans are every bit as bad as the Munster ones, that's from someone on the outside looking in.

eagle eye · 24-03-2026 08:13PM

Looking ahead to the summer. I'd like to see half our regular 23 play against Australia and the other half against Japan and have a look at a lot of emerging talent. Then pick your best squad for the New Zealand game.

bilston · 24-03-2026 08:14PM

15. Keenan

14. Fitzgerald

13. BOD

12. Henshaw

11. Hickie

10. Sexton

9. JGP

8. Doris

7. SOB

6. Conan

5. Beirne

4. Ryan

3. Furlong

2. Wood

1. Healy

I fudged having Fitzgerald at 14, not my fault almost all of our best wingers played at 11. Expecting to be flamed for picking him over Bowe, but I think he's one of the most talented players ever. Should've been a 12

Lol, I mean putting Wood and Beirne in there makes a little less subtle

Edit - post in response to AbusesToilet team, quote didn't post for some reason!

standardg60 · 24-03-2026 08:16PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124337521#Comment_124337521

Defence is what separates Rog and Johnny by a long way.

sprucemoose · 24-03-2026 08:23PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124337784#Comment_124337784

they did play in the centre together a few times, fine but nothing amazing

standardg60 · 24-03-2026 08:38PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124337713#Comment_124337713

Yeah I'd have Bowe in there too, best part of his career was at Ospreys though 😛

standardg60 · 24-03-2026 08:46PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124337725#Comment_124337725

Definitely, unfortunately 'would' is the operative part of the sentence alas.

One of the worst injuries to have the misfortune to watch.

AbusesToilets · 24-03-2026 08:57PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124338059#Comment_124338059

Feel free to name you own 🙂 Presuming you're inplying a Leinster bias with my choices. There's a ton of close calls. Wallace and Ferris in the back row, Murray at 9. Despite his status as a "legend", I think POC was rather 1 dimensional in comparison to his peers when he was playing. For me, Ryan is a superior player, thought about putting O'Kelly there also.

bilston · 24-03-2026 09:12PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124338165#Comment_124338165

I prefer to snipe from the sidelines...

It's hard, especially the back 5 of the pack. I'm not sure about Ryan...yet...but MOK wouldn't have the mobility, Beirne could go to the row, but then who plays 6? Wallace should be in the team, but it's hard to leave out the WPOTY from 7. I ould stick Ferris at 6 and Beirne in the row, but you can't ignore Ferris's lack of longevity. Doris will likely supplant Heaslip eventually, but not yet. Backs are straightforward enough IMO.

15 Kearney, 14 Bowe, 11 Hickie

13 O'Driscoll, 12 Aki

10 Sexton, 9 Gibson Park

4 Ryan, 5 O'Connell

6 Beirne, 7 Van Der Flier, 8 Heaslip

16 D.Sheahan

17 Porter

18 Hayes

19 Wallace

20 O'Brien

21 Murray

22 O'Gara

23 Earls

accensi0n · 24-03-2026 09:51PM

Fitzgerald would have scored twice as many tries if he didn't regularly blitz and overrun the player holding the ball.

FtD v2 · 24-03-2026 10:04PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124337836#Comment_124337836

I think that 2011 was a great collection of freakish individual power athletes in the back row, but it's hard to argue they had the right balance.

We were pretty shite in that year's 6 Nations - we limped past Italy 13-11 (starting back row of Leamy, Wallace, O'Brien with Jennings on the bench), lost by three to France at home (starting O'Brien, Wallace, Heaslip with Leamy on the bench), a 3 point win over Scotland (same back row as v France) and lost to Wales by 6 (same backrow). As we tend to, we produced a performance in Round 5 to beat England comfortably though.

Ferris was back healthy for the RWC and returned to the 6 shirt, with O'Brien shifting to 7 and Heaslip at 8. We were good in the pools, beating Australia, but were then well beaten in the QF by a good Welsh side (and a great Welsh back row).

FtD v2 · 24-03-2026 10:07PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124337886#Comment_124337886

I'm not taking anything away from how great a player Keith Wood was, but I still think Dan Sheehan is better at virtually every single part of the game (maybe except kicking from hand and scrummaging).

Sheehan is materially bigger, stronger and faster than Wood. He's a better line out thrower, more dynamic in the loose and a better try scorer (and the latter two were big strengths of Wood). Possibly not quite the same leadership credentials as Wood, but hard to definitively say that.

I'm not saying Keith Wood wasn't an incredible, world class player, who would have thrived also in the modern game, I'm just saying Dan Sheehan is better.

Brief_Lives · 24-03-2026 10:11PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124338024#Comment_124338024

as a munster fan, i agree.

no changing minds here… see Sam..

visatorro · 24-03-2026 11:54PM

Ferris Wallace heaslip back row.

I could be the only one but I think Sean O'brien was a good against lesser teams but against better teams he was regularly outplayed. Touch of white line fever aswell. He was able to run threw defences at pro 12 level but at test level he didnt get through more often then not and wasted try scoring opportunities.

leakyboots · 25-03-2026 12:08AM

Wallace is probably the best athlete we've ever produced for the professional rugby pitch, could do it all.

Luke Fitz was very highly rated on here by some... but I'm not seeing it, a bit headless. Earls was a far superior left winger, Hickey too.

Keenan far better than Kearney.

JGP has hit a new level the last few years but Murray did it across most of his career.

Sheahan v Wood is a fascinating debate for sure.

Tadgh Beirne is up there with our greatest of all time for me, he's surpassed POC in all aspects bar leadership. James Ryan is a good distance behind both

Aki v Darcy is interesting too, I'd go for Darcy personally. Him and BOD were an incredible pairing

accensi0n · 25-03-2026 12:14AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124338560#Comment_124338560

Nah.

First clip here is him putting the effort in to trail for 80 metres to score against NZ. Rest of the video is him providing assists, scoring tries and smashing folks against top opposition.

https://youtu.be/lsVBibU7SsA?is=05Nwsvrp4xW0A687

Ireland Team Talk XII: Farrell's First Fifteen

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