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Eating healthy is not expensive

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,603 ✭✭✭Large bottle small glass


    Cooking is the key issue when differentiating between fats; I personally almost completely avoid using any fat with heat.

    If adding heat in order of stability generally speaking its saturated fat, monounsaturated and polyunsaturated.

    The marketing of PUFAs as "healthy" oils when they are almost entirely used for cooking is the major issue. If you are going to use a fat for cooking use coconut or beef/animal fat. Butter is more prone to damage especially at high heat.

    Almost nobody is pouring rapeseed or any other cheap vegetable oil over their salad/dipping bread into like the way olive oil/butter is used. Personally I consume about 15L of olive oil per year and none of that sees heat.

    The public health decision of 50 years ago across the west of demonising saturated fat has lead to a all sorts of issues not least of which is food companies marketing cheap junk as healthy choices to a confused public.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,420 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    our sacred 'the market' would never sell us harmful products!



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 55,565 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    i should have mentioned the flipside of this - i never learned to cook while living at home. and even after i moved out, my mother insisted on cooking for me; i'd go back to their place to visit at weekends and my mother would hand me a stack of tupperware containers of chicken curry or similar for me to bring home and freeze. and it took a good while to convince her not to do that. she wanted to look after me, was worried about me living on my own and eating well; but she should have just told me to look after myself.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 76 ✭✭Beachcomber1097


    One of the best books I ever bought was the Jamie Oliver 5 min meals. Now technically they DO NOT take 5 mins to make, but maybe 15, or if you plan some ahead of time.

    Agree though that time is a the major factor, my youngest has a lot of sports on and usually its in from work, cook and then back out the door within an hour.

    Ah to be mega rich and have a helicopter..



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,420 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    enabling would be common enough in ireland regarding cooking, similar to my own family, im only learning to properly cook now, as i started a cooking lass a few years ago, but even this can be very dysfunctional, with the class regularly defaulting to sh1t food, cooking should be mandatory for all in school



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,691 ✭✭✭yagan


    So so far on this thread the causes of obesity are….

    Trauma…. even though trauma existed before obesity.

    Confusing choice…. even though we've never had so much nutrition information compared to the past.

    Da women are working…. I don't know what to say about this other than obesity wasn't a thing when both my parents worked full time in the 70s/80s. edit to add I had an aunt drop dead around 55 in the 80s, really loved her frying pan and pig meat every single day. It did shock her husband into changing his diet and he lived til his 90s.

    Time…. even though often it takes less time to cook many different types of healthy meal than a deliveroo order that contains god knows what!

    The truth is many people don't care, they simply don't care, and many believe that eating healthily takes the joy out of their lives.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,393 ✭✭✭✭The Nal




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,711 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    I get the instinct to look after her child, but the best solution would have been to teach you to cook from a young age. That's the ultimate goal.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 714 ✭✭✭waterfaerie


    All of those causes are valid and plenty of strong points have been made for them throughout the thread. It shows a great lack of compassion to not be able to accept something as being possible just because it is / was not the case for you or your parents.

    In your last sentence, if you replace "many" with "some", I could agree with you, but to lump that judgment onto the majority of obese people is not in the least bit helpful and could be considered cruel, especially to those in the trauma / mental health category.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 33,259 ✭✭✭✭HeidiHeidi


    Wouldn't it be just lovely to live in a world where everything was so black and white?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,420 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    again, yes, trauma has always existed, but our copying strategies and mechanisms in dealing with it(maladaptively), have changed, and changed substantially, again, previous generations would have largely turned to alcohol and nicotine in dealing with their traumas, but in the modern age, not only do these copying strategies exist, we now have far greater access to substances including drugs(legal and illegal), gambling, sex(including access to porn), and of course highly addictive foods.

    a lot of the 'information' that exists in the modern age is in fact miss and dis information, primarily driven by marketing, which is now highly sophisticated, and frankly, a pack of lies, in which its main aim is to manipulate the general population into increasing consumption, and this works extremely well.

    again, the abundance of relatively cheap, and extremely unhealthy foods simply did not exist in previous generations, hence why there was less obesity, i.e. obesity has existed for a very long time, with evidence in ancient times, but was far less.

    in the modern age, less physically active jobs exist, compared to previous generations, this to is also helping to cause our obesity issues.

    the convince and speed of delivered foods, is also adding to obesity, again, a lot of these foods contain highly addictive ingredients



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 714 ✭✭✭waterfaerie


    Many people here seem to be focusing on obesity when the thread was simply about the cost of healthy vs unhealthy food. The reality is that many people who aren't obese are also unhealthy and also eating a lot of unhealthy food. A lot of people may not even know that the foods they're eating are unhealthy. Fat and calories aren't the only unhealthy things one can eat.

    And even if you could identify the healthiest food in the world and eat only that, that would be unhealthy. Plenty of skinny people have unhealthily restricted diets.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,691 ✭✭✭yagan


    Well I did say "many people don't care", which to me would be "some people".

    We probably all know that person who says they're eating healthily now, which could be just nothing but those frozen process meals with health branding and marketing.

    The only ones I feel sorry for is the kids whose parents don't care and are happy to load up with the worst diet.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 37,415 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    There's also something I heard years ago regarding food addiction;

    "If you have a drug addiction, you need to try to not have any drugs. If you have an alcohol addiction, you need to try to not have any alcohol. If you have a gambling addiction, you need to try to not gamble. If you have a food addiction, you still need to have food."

    I know for me personally, when I was at my most gluttonous, if I'd had a bad day at work I'd stop off in a petrol station on the way home from work, buy a load of sh*te and eat it on the way home before having my dinner.

    The trouble was, I hadn't really had a bad day at work (pretty much every day at work could be considered a bad day because everyone deals with loads of sh*te during their work day to the point any day could probably be considered "a bad day"), and usually even while eating all the sh*te I'd bought, I'd realise it's kind of sickening and not that enjoyable. And a few days later, I'd do the exact same thing again.

    A lot of the time, it doesn't even need to be considered something to the extent of "trauma" or "extreme mental health". People can just develop an unhealthy relationship with food. And I get it, people who don't have that relationship with food can look at people making these unhealthy choices and just see them as being gluttonous, lazy etc. But the way your mind justifies these things, compounds these things, how shame about doing these things can actually make you do them more… It can be extremely difficult to break out of these behaviours, particularly when they become so habitual that making changes to healthy choices can feel like a monumental shift in your entire behaviour.

    It's why pointing out that healthy food can be cheap makes absolutely no difference to most people. They will have a multitude of other excuses at the ready, and when they're out of excuses, will just accept that they just want to eat as they do, even if it's harming them in the long run.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,691 ✭✭✭yagan


    Well the thread's title is "eating healthy is not expensive", which we've all concluded is a fact.

    However a lot of posts seem to concentrate on excuses for people choosing to not eat healthily.

    The only group I'd absolve from personal responsibility are the children of people who eschew healthy food for more expensive bad diets.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,740 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    That’s it exactly I remember a grossly obese woman describing people she didn’t like. She said “They can’t change their personalities. I can lose my weight.” To place herself in a moral high ground and feel good about herself.

    She never did lose her weight nor had any real intention of doing so. She obviously had the problem of what you described “an unhealthy relationship with food”. But if a person is fooling themselves mentally, they are never going to change. All the phrases and sound bites (no pun intended) are ready.

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,711 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    And when those children grow up not knowing how to eat healthily, they presumably slide into your 'no sympathy' category.

    You seem incapable of imagining how it's more difficult for other people to do it, even though you've been taught how to do it and they haven't.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,691 ✭✭✭yagan


    If they emerging in being independent adults.

    There have been parents charged with manslaughter for kids dying of bad diets.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 927 ✭✭✭littlefeet


    One of the first Normans to invade Ireland was nicked named Raymond Le Gros i.e the fat/large. It's safe to assume fat people have been around for a while.

    I have never had a dilleveroo or a spice but who knows what we'd be like if we were young today.

    Children have to see parent eating normal food, parents not knowing or being interested macros or overly concerned about food in general, normal food cooked from scratch and limit the amount of fling it in the air fryer crispy chicken things. That would be a great start.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 360 ✭✭JM2300


    Researchers made the flawed conclusion in the 1970's that the cholesterol clogging people's blood vessels and causing heart attacks was due to the consumption of foods containing cholesterol.

    This is not true for the most part. Blood vessels typically become clogged with cholesterol due to the liver producing cholesterol and it being sent to "patch up" damaged blood vessels due to inflammation. Inflammation of the blood vessels has numerous causes, smoking being one and excessive consumption of sugar and other carbohydrates as well as vegetable oils and trans fats.

    As a result of the flawed conclusion, dieticians and doctors have been giving harmful advice to the public since tge 1970's. Telling people to eat margarine rather than butter, to avoid eating eggs and red meat such as steak. This meant people were eschwewing highly nutrionally valuable foods. People became obsessed with low fat unaware that sugar and carbohydrates was the problem to address. The unintended consequence was more disease and negative health outcomes.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 927 ✭✭✭littlefeet


    And a big one that's apparently creeping in cooking one dinner for the children and parents eating a different dinner at a different time themselves.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 892 ✭✭✭SodiumCooled


    This is not true Rapeseed oil is not very high in omega 6 and is considered one of the best oils to cook with. It is always suggested to use it over olive oil for example as it withstands temperatures better.


    We use rapeseed oil in all our cooking requiring oil.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 360 ✭✭JM2300


    Rapeseed is not the worst, but not great to be cooking with neither is olive oil. They're prone to oxidation at high temperatures.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,740 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    One programme that was on telly years ago (1940’s house) made in 2001 on Channel 4 is very relevant to this thread . It was an English reality tv programme where family lived the 1940’s lifestyle (for 9 weeks) food rationing, high vegetable intake etc, more manual work, no processed food etc.

    I remember one mother in particular was worried that her children wouldn’t get enough nutrients and be unhealthy. She was shocked that the children’s health actually improved. The children on the show, in particular, benefited from the reduced sugar intake. The family generally lost weight and showed improved cardiovascular markers.

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 37,415 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    In fairness the reason the thread shifted more towards discussing obesity and the causes in general was because the purpose of the OP making the thread wasn't just "God isn't the price of chickpeas fantastic", it was to make the point that the excuse some might make of healthy food being more expensive than unhealthy food isn't valid, therefore obese/unhealthy people don't have that excuse to be obese/unhealthy (as evident by their later posts regarding people sitting around looking at social media for 5 hours every day).

    The discussion has since become about discussing the other excuses regarding obesity and unhealthy eating behaviours, the validity of those excuses, what other underlying causes there may be etc. And the simple fact is there are a multitude of complicated reasons people may have for those behaviours. Some of it is learned behaviour, some of it is psychological, some of it is lack of knowledge/education, some of it is just laziness.

    To reduce it all down to "healthy food can be cheap and healthy meals might only take 15 minutes to make" is dismissive of so many underlying reasons and for a lot of people would not address the actual crux of their issue.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,085 ✭✭✭Rocket_GD


    This has been a very interesting thread to read.

    With all the responses to @John_Rambo about what he feeds his kids you'd swear it was heroin he was giving them, but no it's just plenty of fresh berries and you still have posters criticising him for it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 37,415 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    Also the swing from "Eating healthy is so simple" to "No you shouldn't use that type of cooking oil, it's practically poison compared to this cooking oil"



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,740 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    As regards people finding it “difficult” to eat healthy. I think it is a combination of laziness and/or lack of education. It is almost like a form of devolving, like that film Idiocracystarring Adam Sandler. As a lot of this issue is intergenerational among some families.

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 927 ✭✭✭littlefeet


    While I don't want to add to the fetishing food phononmin.

    I found this interesting. I have to pass a Baxter and Green numourous time recently almost everyday, massive queue of builders buying roles so big they would feed two or big pizzas and similar, all are slim and lean, probably due the physical nature of the work.

    Are they unhealthy eating that food all the time?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 360 ✭✭JM2300


    The only way to know is to review their bloodwork.



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