Advertisement
Help Keep Boards Alive. Support us by going ad free today. See here: https://subscriptions.boards.ie/.
https://www.boards.ie/group/1878-subscribers-forum

Private Group for paid up members of Boards.ie. Join the club.
Hi all, please see this major site announcement: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058427594/boards-ie-2026

Energy infrastructure

1230231233235236238

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,043 ✭✭✭✭josip


    Higher off the ground would be more expensive, larger foundations and longer and stronger supports.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 20,758 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Yes, but the grazing would increase earnings, and provide employment. The extra cost would be defrayed by reduced cost of removing the weeds.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,235 ✭✭✭Markcheese


    Solar company is'nt going to make any money with low intensity grazing ,

    Dont graze goats ( or lambs ) on solar ground - think climbing and jumping 😉😂

    Slava ukraini 🇺🇦



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 20,758 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Fair point about goats, but the point of the grazing is to keep the weeds down, while making a bit as well instead of costing for someone to mow or spray.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,638 ✭✭✭✭machiavellianme


    They're for-profit companies and will have done their sums. The fact that they still pay for someone to cut/spray should tell you all you need to know about the grazing option. It's purely for greenwashing lipservice and not in line with cost effective management.

    Save boards.ie by subscribing: https://subscriptions.boards.ie/



  • Advertisement
  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 20,758 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    The sums the companies do are not necessarily that good. The sheep do not get paid, but sell for good money. While spraying and mowing is not cheep, but may not be costed that accurately. One would assume that work would be left to a contractor, which is a bit open to inflation or regulation over chemicals.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,638 ✭✭✭✭machiavellianme


    The sheep will sell for the same money grazing elsewhere.

    Unless the sheep are there anyway, there's transport costs, fencing costs, flock management costs, costs for checking them daily, dipping/dosing costs etc. It all adds up.

    VS tipping by once a month for a quick mow/spray.

    If the landowners wanted to farm sheep, they'd do so, instead of flogging their grounds to the highest bidding developers.

    Save boards.ie by subscribing: https://subscriptions.boards.ie/



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 246 ✭✭millb


    Yes and in fairness most if not all Solar farms do require an environmental management plan that that take's account of the green agenda including biodiversity, non-spraying, holistic grazing, hedgerows, etc - far more environmentally friendly that the diary & grain industry's decimation of hedgerows, hydrology balance, watershed management, run-off, GMO dominance, fertilizer & weed-killer over-use with no ongoing emissions, sewage, diesel consumption, traffic, flooding or pollution impacts



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 6,404 ✭✭✭roosterman71


    Just on the solar farm I'm tendering for the maintenance of has a) removed countless km of hedgerows, b) opened kms of drains in the bog to drain water away, c) disturbed the bog to put in new roads and solar infrastructure, d) have a requirement for no grazing animals, e) no restriction on any chemicals to be used in site maintenance



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,235 ✭✭✭Markcheese


    Thats pretty terrible - and largely unnecessary..the opposite of all of those issues could have been stipulated at planning stage with pretty minimal cost implications.. even the drainage ditches are a bit questionable, once the panels are in there doesnt really need to be much traffic on the site apart from maintainance

    Slava ukraini 🇺🇦



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 246 ✭✭millb


    Shocking - I can't believe that would be allowed by any reasonable Co Council or done by any modern contractor. You shouldn't be working for them (but obviously you want their business?) and you need to report to the EPA and Co Co. Also the HSA and the DoE. Eirgrid should also be checking their credentials.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 6,404 ✭✭✭roosterman71


    What do you mean? It's all approved. Planning was granted and all this work was planned as part of the build. There's nothing illegal or dodgy going on here around this work.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,207 ✭✭✭✭Birdnuts


    Just goes to show the types involved with much of this "Green Energy" and the failure of this state to regulate their destructive activities in any meaningful way. No wonder there is so much opposition against these developers across rural Ireland



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,043 ✭✭✭✭josip


    ACP are currently reviewing 3.8GW of Irish Sea Wind Farm applications for Oriel, North Irish Sea Array, Dublin Array, Codling and Arklow Bank II. Oriel was submitted in May 2024 and and the others in subsequent months up to Feb 2025.

    How long will it be before ACP starts reaching decisions and will Oriel will the first to be decided upon because it was submitted first?

    On the 18th of March 2026 Significant Additional Information was submitted in response to a request by ACP in June 2025, taking the full 9 months allowed to respond. So are we looking at another 18 months potentially to review this application?

    [Edit as I find out more] Could be a decision in Sep 26

    https://archive.is/FuIGK

    Considering the higher capacity factor of offshore wind, these wind projects would effectively double our wind output on low to moderate wind days were they to be approved.

    image.png
    Post edited by josip on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,256 ✭✭✭eire4


    and if the current fuel crisis has done anything it should be to focus minds on getting these projects moving and start getting rid of road blocks that are delaying things.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,462 ✭✭✭MightyMunster


    That's mad suck important infrastructure isn't top of the list for decisions. Would have thought it would be fast tracked 🙄



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,043 ✭✭✭✭josip


    If you're a naiive optimist you can email your FFG TDs https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/contact-us/ asking something like:

    "In light of the current fuel crisis and ongoing climate crisis, what plans does your government have to expedite the offshore wind projects in the Irish and Celtic Seas and to reduce our external fossil energy dependency?"

    Barry Ward got the following answer from the Minister in the Dáil

    QUESTION

    To ask the Minister for Climate; Energy and the Environment the position regarding any initiative within his Department that seeks to prioritise the fast-tracking of offshore wind energy infrastructure; and if he will make a statement on the matter.

    REPLY

    Developing Offshore Renewable Energy (ORE) is both complex and challenging, and there are many interdependent stakeholders with a role to play.

    My Department oversees the Offshore Wind Delivery Taskforce (OWDT) which brings together 16 Government Departments, agencies and industry representatives with a role in developing the sector to progress and align activity. The Department also participates in the Taoiseach’s Offshore Clearing House, which seeks to enable delivery of offshore wind projects.

    The Programme for Government commits to fast-tracking offshore wind development by prioritising publication of Designated Maritime Area Plans (DMAPs). To this end, a South Coast DMAP (SC-DMAP) implementation workstream has been established within the OWDT and a dedicated Implementation group has been established within my Department to oversee progress on the SCDMAP.

    A successful auction for development of the 900MW Tonn Nua site, the first SC-DMAP site, was held in Q4, 2025.

    In tandem with implementing the SC-DMAP, my Department is developing a National DMAP that will identify a pipeline of offshore renewable energy development sites throughout Ireland's maritime area. There are a number of engagements scheduled for 2026 as the draft National DMAP is developed for public consultation.

    The Programme for Government also commits to ensuring relevant agencies are sufficiently resourced to accommodate offshore activities. This includes consenting and permitting authorities and agencies responsible for developing the grid.

    The Government has committed to the prioritisation of renewable energy projects by consenting bodies, including applications for developments, within timelines mandated by the recently recast Renewable Energy Directive.

    Furthermore, in December 2025, I announced an unprecedented investment in grid development of up to €18 billion for the 2026-2030 period.

    The developer-led Phase One of offshore wind energy projects is well underway and, in addition to the aforementioned initiatives, will ensure that developments are expedited as quickly as possible.

    I doubt if the government will do anything that would be seen to influence ACP and could be used as the basis for the inevitable JRs. But I would like to seen them resourcing and prioritising the JR side of things so that that only takes months instead of years. I also hope anyone who takes a JR against these projects is identified and analysed to the same degree that the Charlemont JR group and motorway blockaders were.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,207 ✭✭✭✭Birdnuts


    There are legitimate concerns about the impact of these projects on the marine environment and issues like coastal erosion etc. Plus the government has failed to advance the required MPA legistlation to protect the most sensitive areas which some of these developers continue to ignore in their EIS statements. All legitimate grounds to challenge this developer led rush to clog the Irish Sea with industrial junk that has done little to shield the likes of the UK and German grid from energy price shocks



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,256 ✭✭✭eire4


    Yes you would certainly think the current dependence on foreign fossil fuels would have concentrated minds on getting those wind farms fast tracked and the road blocks holding them up removed as quickly as possible.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,097 ✭✭✭JPup


    I think challenging these offshore wind farms on environmental grounds is extremely disingenuous! As if maintaining an economy based on burning fossil fuels and watching the world go slowly up in flames over the next 50 years is the eco-friendly course of action!

    Anyway, they do seem to be make slow but steady progress on these projects. The response above from the minister is encouraging. There are a lot of stakeholders involved including the European Commission. Ireland desperately needs these offshore wind farms to be built and more like them over the next decade so we can produce abundant, clean, locally-sourced electricity and power rather than relying on dirty and volatile fossil fuel imports.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,207 ✭✭✭✭Birdnuts


    Thats simplistic in the extreme - as other countries have discovered, wind whether offshore or onshore still requires signficant fossil etc. backup. Their potential harm relating to marine biodiversity is not something you can ignore eitheir in terms of damage to already endangered seabirds and cetacean populations as has has been documented in studies from the likes of Holland, Germany etc. Birdwatch Ireland, An Taisce etc. have already flagged concerns about proposals in close proximity to the likes of Lambay and Rockabill islands. If your that concerned about our emmissions I would be far more concerned with Irelands developer driven Data centre policies in that space.



  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 99,467 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    Because renewables like solar and wind are SNSP they don't provide spinning reserve they could be backed up by batteries.

    Generation is forecast for 4.5 days ahead at 15 minute intervals so other types of backup can be planned for if needed. Renewables are intermittent but predictably so.

    Hydro and thermal generators provide spinning reserve too. So across the grid you have de-rate the total output by the size of the largest single point of failure (unpredictably intermittent and requires 75% restoration within 5 seconds, 100% within 15 seconds). This means lost income because they aren't supplying all the power they could be. It also means more fossil fuel usage because they are running less efficiently at reduced load. At present it's usually the OCGT that take that role. It's an overhead financial and emissions cost that will reduce as the grid moves to being capable of 95% SNSP.



  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 99,467 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    https://www.euronews.com/2026/04/11/two-new-studies-could-change-critics-opinions-about-how-many-birds-die-from-wind-turbines - Two new studies.

    The study found that there was not a single collision, "The results from Aberdeen Bay show that modern offshore wind farms can be operated with low risk to wildlife," says Dr Eva Julius-Philipp, Director Environment and Sustainability BU Wind at Vattenfall.

    For one and a half years, researchers analysed over four million bird movements with the help of radar and AI-based cameras. The result showed that over 99.8 per cent of migratory birds reliably avoided the wind turbines.



  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 99,467 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    image.png

    https://www.euronews.com/2026/04/01/worlds-tallest-wind-turbine-being-built-in-germanys-former-coal-mining-region

    "Winds are stronger at higher altitudes, allowing for twice as much energy to be produced."

    It's telescopic because cranes aren't tall enough. 

    "GICON say they hope for an annual electricity yield of 30-33 gigawatt hours and electricity production costs of less than five cents per kilowatt hour."

    It looks like a giant transmission tower so the NIMBYs will love it.

    But it might be an alternative to offshore wind.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,256 ✭✭✭eire4


    Interesting read that. For me I have said it before there are electricity poles and wires all over the country urban and country and not a jot said about them as spoiling the view for the simple reason that they have been there so long nobody really notices them anymore they are just background now. Wind turbines are of course a much more recent phenomenon so people notice them more readily but in time they will become background as well. Until then the nimbys can cry me a river about their views. We need to get off fossil fuels as much and as quickly as possible IMHO so that we are not put into the position we currently are at with this energy crisis and all the knock on effects it is causing as well. This of course all caused by the whims of lunatics and despots which lets face it is where much of the fossil fuels happen to be located. IMHO increasing our renewables and reducing fossil fuels is an absolute priority for our national security and needs to be treated as such.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,207 ✭✭✭✭Birdnuts


    A mere desktop study is a pretty poor indicator of risks. Actual real world studies highlight the real risks of putting these windfarms in sensitive marine areas. And its not just about collision risk - its also about the displacement affect of multiple windfarms from key feeding areas like shallow sandbanks that lower chick survival and so impact already vulnearable populations.

    https://www.semanticscholar.org/paper/Significant-effect-on-breeding-tern-colony-due-to-Everaert-Stienen/90feab782a98150c86bfe0fe2ec345d72d487764

    https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-023-31601-z

    There is also the issue of the refusal of this and the previous government to implement EU MPA's in Ireland to protect key seabird breeding and feeding areas. Presumbly due to lobbying by wind developers who are also responsible for the government deley in updating onshore setbacks for windfarms for the past 10 years!!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 442 ✭✭tppytoppy


    Captain Midnight is in the habit of bringing unsound Hypotheses to discussion and presenting them as a 100% certain path to energy transition and not troubling themselves to consider whether those proposals will result in an unreliable and unaffordable energy grid.

    There is simply not enough space onshore or off shore for their dreams. Every eco pie in the sky project is favoured be it an unproven hydrogen economy, molten salt, pumped storage without suitable sites, gas bladders, solar under cloudy skies in the north west, infinite batteries, interconnectors as altruism by our neighbours and all to cover the difference when wind isn't providing expensive power.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 442 ✭✭tppytoppy


    Not Public Infrastructure.

    BnM looking to destroy Ireland's bogland for Datacentres not yet planned contingent on the bogs being destroyed.

    If they can lie that all this is critical infrastructure there will be no stopping them.

    https://archive.is/2qTxE



  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 99,467 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    image.png

    https://www.nature.com/articles/s41560-026-02023-8

    This suggests that renewables have too much of a head start and their costs are falling too fast for fusion to catchup with the current learning curves.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 442 ✭✭tppytoppy


    Lovely Jubbly. Can't wait to see the bids for affordable wind generated electricity which we have not yet seen in Ireland



Advertisement
Advertisement