Game changing battery from Donut ?

Duine_Eigin · 06-03-2026 12:16PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124289668#Comment_124289668

This industry expert thinks otherwise. He analysed the charge curve from the VTT results and it matches exactly that of an NMC lithium-ion battery. Also the internal resistance of the Donut battery matches that of a lithium-ion battery (voltage analysis starts @ 2min 30sec). It will be interesting to see how this plays out but based on those results, I'm skeptical regarding Donut's solid state claim.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H45HXs4xXfA

evftw · 06-03-2026 12:53PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124290090#Comment_124290090

That video is old news since this Monday, in my opinion anyway, and for example 2 bit davinci somewhat changed his mind between last week and this week.

The chemistry could be sodium based but it's also not fully like other sodium based chemistries.

I suspect that the -30 Centigrade tests will be released next week, and that will give more indications on whether it's Lithium based or not.

https://youtu.be/AzIpgYi4rjM?si=uJI-yGCtpNVyMh8Q

positron · 06-03-2026 12:55PM

I would rather see some battery tech expert / industry leaders chime in with their observations than a whole lot of youtubers throwing stuff out there just for their own subscription numbers and engagement. Also wouldn't it be so much easier if everyone posted their findings as text rather that long videos!

evftw · 06-03-2026 01:00PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124290201#Comment_124290201

Sorry, it's easier to just post videos. I'm lazy. This really is either a car crash in slow motion or beginning of something great.

josip · 06-03-2026 03:01PM

I don't want it to be Orbo 2.0, but they are just as unorthodox in their marketing.

https://computer.rip/2025-10-28-the-steorn-orbo.html

celtic_oz · 06-03-2026 03:21PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124290090#Comment_124290090

Yes seen that, but the new results heating to 100 C is impossible for lithium afaik

cnocbui · 06-03-2026 04:08PM

Super-capacitors snake oil, Mk II

It's probably just silver-zinc rechargeable battery chemistry which has been around for a very long time and is fairly commonly used in spacecraft because of very high power density and ability to operate over a wide temperature regime. They are extremely reliable and expensive, but that is of little importance given the advantages.

What's affordable for satellites and spacecraft might not translate to EVs.

If this was a technology breakthrough there would be patents and those would be publicly accessible and the technology would be revealed. I doubt such exist. AI listed Donut's electric motor patents but was unable to do so for their supposed battery patents.

As one can see, Ag-Zn batteries are closest to the 400 Wh/Kg claim from Donut Labs.

evftw · 06-03-2026 05:27PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124290841#Comment_124290841

When a patent application is made in US, there is a 18 months delay called "publication delay" which will keep the competition in the dark while the applicant has time to get ready to get things moving in their end.

celtic_oz · 08-03-2026 01:18PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124290841#Comment_124290841

They are quite explicit that the matierials it was made from are plentiful and cheap.

Seems silly to make the claim and then sell a bike with one in it 2 months later and be called out as an obvious lie.

positron · 09-03-2026 10:36AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124290215#Comment_124290215

Sorry, it wasn't aimed at you but a general rant. Also, I don't understand how posting video is easier than posting text, but I understand youtube could generate income now or in future, so that's understandable.

evftw · 09-03-2026 10:54AM

No offence taken there positron, I don't like people posting random clips either without any of their own opinions.

Oh yes, the next batch of the independent test results will be out this afternoon. Will it be the cold performance tests or something else today?

cnocbui · 09-03-2026 02:40PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124295780#Comment_124295780

They claim it doesn't contain lithium. The only previously used material known to have achieved anything like the claimed energy density is silver, which would contradict the plentiful and cheap claims.

If Samsung were making this claim for their solid state battery, there would be fewer reasons for skepticism, but there still would be some.

"extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence," Carl Sagan.

While the tests are interesting, the real proof of this pudding can only come with a revelation of the 'cheap' materials used.

We have been here before, and it was even a breakthrough made here in Ireland - in 2014.

https://www.nanowerk.com/news2/newsid=34330.php

Breakthrough in battery technology with nanowire anode
(Nanowerk News) Researchers at the Materials and Surface Science Institute (MSSI), University of Limerick have made a significant breakthrough in the area of rechargeable battery technology. … The research team at UL have developed a technology that more than doubles the capacity of lithium-ion battery anodes and retains this high capacity even after being charged and discharged over 1000 times.
"This breakthrough is important for mobile computing and telecoms but also for the emerging electric vehicle market allowing for smaller and lighter batteries that can hold more charge for longer and maintain this performance over the lifetime of the product.”…
The research team have also ensured that their nanotechnology solution was scalable, low-cost and low-energy making the technology both greener and commercially viable.

So from this 'breakthrough' in 2014 we have double the capacity, long life, cheap. Sound familiar?

Have we seen this amazing tech in the real world? Where is it, given they ensured it was commercially viable?

Amazing battery tech breakthroughs are always more hopium than reality. There's is a lot more 'I want to believe' going on with battery tech announcements than with UFO sightings.

evftw · 09-03-2026 04:20PM

Today's self discharging results show is not a super capacitor (which was one of the suspects as the underlying tech).

Exiled Rebel · 09-03-2026 05:50PM

Haha bullshit or not I'm enjoying this.

celtic_oz · 10-03-2026 03:14PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124298355#Comment_124298355

Skepticism is healthy, but using it to dismiss a product that is literally weeks away from commercial release is just cynicism. If it’s a hoax, they’ve picked a very public way to self-destruct. We don't need to guess about 'exotic materials' much longer—the real-world performance and price point will prove the tech (or the lie) soon enough.

If the product is not launched or delayed indefinitely then agreed its just hoax

josip · 10-03-2026 03:52PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124301189#Comment_124301189

Not disagreeing, but what is the purpose of this slow, staged reveal?

It does nothing for getting their wonder product into the market where it can be judged on its merits. Are they looking for A-round financing?

celtic_oz · 10-03-2026 04:16PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124301341#Comment_124301341

No idea, if its not a hoax it could be a ploy to delay while they try get some sort of scale with production and draw the attention of musk et al

I think they are only supposed to produce enough for 350 bikes this year ?

So is the mysterious Donut Lab’s smoke screen beginning to clear, and are the first promises already falling short?
“Orders extend well into 2027”
We called Verge Motorcycles CEO Tuomo Lehtimäki to ask about the start of production. Lehtimäki immediately gives a clear answer regarding the information shown on the website:
“Orders currently extend well into 2027. In some countries the delivery time is shorter, such as in Finland and Estonia. In those countries, deliveries may still take place by the end of 2026.”
Lehtimäki refuses to comment on the exact number of orders received, but he does confirm that motorcycle production volumes are quite limited.
“Our production this year, at the current scale, is 350 bikes.”
The production volumes announced by Verge are not particularly large by any measure, and scaling up even to that level may pose challenges. Lehtimäki has previously told Kauppalehti that just over 100 of Verge’s earlier bikes have been manufactured.
When asked whether the timeline for the first customer deliveries in the spring still holds, the answer is, for now, yes.
“In the spring we will be able to deliver bikes,” Lehtimäki states plainly. “Most likely the first customer deliveries will take place in April. There are production-related matters involved, such as getting subcontractors on board. Starting up production. A lot depends on parts and on officials.”
Type approval still pending

https://www.reddit.com/r/electricvehicles/comments/1qvo8h5/verge_motorcycles_with_miracle_donut_lab_battery/

celtic_oz · 17-03-2026 09:55AM

Test 4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5cpYeT4VmSY

AI summary:

. Infrastructure is the New BottleneckThe battery's potential (up to 11C at the cell level and 5.7C in the pack) far exceeds current US charging infrastructure.

Scaling this to a 120 kWh pack (like a Lucid Gravity) would require a 686 kW charger to hit its peak.
Even with current 400 kW chargers, the Doughnut battery could maintain its max charging rate all the way to 70% state of charge, whereas current top-tier EVs begin to taper much earlier (around 30-40%).

2. "Gasoline-Level" ConvenienceThe most significant real-world takeaway is the shift in "quality of life" for EV owners.

A "donut-powered" car could charge to 80% in 12 minutes rather than the current 26 minutes.
This reduces the charging stop from a "full lunch break" to a "quick restroom and snack break," making it comparable to the time spent at a gas station.

3. Debunking the "Hybrid/Super-Capacitor" TheoryEarlier theories suggested the battery might be a hybrid of a super-capacitor (for speed) and a chemical battery (for capacity). However, the narrator now concludes this is unlikely. The "staircase" plateaus are attributed to early BMS (Battery Management System) tuning and thermal safety limits rather than a dual-material design.

4. Cooling is the Primary LimitThe technology has reached a point where the electrochemistry is faster than the cooling system.

The battery is currently limited by how fast the Verge motorcycle can dump heat.
In a liquid-cooled car, the performance would be even more "remarkable" because it could stay at peak power for much longer without hitting the thermal "ceiling."

5. Summary of the "Test 4" Verdict

Verified: 11C cell-level capability, 5.7C pack-level performance, and the ability to survive 100°C temperatures.
Unverified: Long-term degradation (100,000 cycle claim) and the final chemical "recipe."
The "Wild" Factor: Seeing 103 kW delivered to a tiny 18 kWh motorcycle battery with only air cooling is "unheard of" in the current industry.

brophs · 17-03-2026 11:19AM

If I had to make an uneducated guess at this stage this will play out as them saying “look at what the battery could do, now give us money to figure out how/if it can be solved/scaled”.

josip · 17-03-2026 12:29PM

Has the VTT done any testing of the battery's health after repeated (1,000) charge/discharge cycles above 5C?

cnocbui · 17-03-2026 01:02PM

With the Verge motorcycle costing €42k, the cheap and plentiful materials claim is the one I find most suspicious.

evftw · 17-03-2026 03:57PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124319299#Comment_124319299

There is no price increase over the previous battery but you do get 33 kWh of capacity now instead of the previous smaller battery. At least that was when I last checked.

celtic_oz · 17-03-2026 08:48PM

I see Matt Farrell of undecided just did a piece called "Why Donut Lab's 'Impossible' Battery Might Be Real"

His take : Donut Lab is employing a high-stakes, bold-spec strategy to generate hype for their potential battery breakthrough, planning to counter skepticism with eventual proof. Despite potential discrepancies in fundraising claims reported by Yle, the author suggests the battery may be legitimate due to the high risks of overhyping.

Game changing battery from Donut ?

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