Advertisement
Help Keep Boards Alive. Support us by going ad free today. See here: https://subscriptions.boards.ie/.
https://www.boards.ie/group/1878-subscribers-forum

Private Group for paid up members of Boards.ie. Join the club.
Hi all, please see this major site announcement: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058427594/boards-ie-2026

Ireland Team Talk XII: Farrell's First Fifteen

1178217831785178717881818

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,710 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    I specifically said Postlethwaite was an example and I don't want to get into the detail on whether he is going to be the long term replacement. The point was about the principle of accepting that an investment probably won't pay out straight away. If they paid out straight away, it wouldn't be an investment, it would be playing your strongest team.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,710 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    I'm fine with that. *i've never gone into the nasty side of it. I acknowledge they were great players and there comes a time to thank them and move on to invest in the younger prospects.

    *Not suggesting you accused me of being nasty towards players who are past their best. I'm saying there's a perfectly reasonable way to drop a player like Aki without being horrible about it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 75 ✭✭revth1990


    Ireland seem to have plenty of 12s, Gavin, Postelthwaite, Forde etc all 12's and will never have the gas to cover the 13 channel in defense at the highest level. 13 is the position I'd be more worried about we have no real competition for Ringrose. But I agree Henshaw shouldnt be remotely close to that Ireland squad atm.

    If Keenan wasnt injured I wouldve liked Osbourne to be getting minutes at 13.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 766 ✭✭✭ShineyShiney


    Totally agree, there is a time to invest. A lot of that investment doesn't involve test match places. Its training, its watching whats required to get to the level.

    Look at the investment thats being made in Darragh Murray, he isn't close to being involved on match days but he is consistently kept close to the main squad, travelling as extra man etc. Timoney and cprendergast have also had that investment over the past few years. I would suggest that postlewaite is also now being invested in.

    I think what I'm saying is that the coaches probably have reasonably developed view of what a test squad will look like in 18 months ( imjuelries aside) time and are working on making that happen but also probably keeping fingers crossed on a few of our oldies hanging in there because the quality behind isn't what they want.

    A little respect for the guys asked to go that extra mile to buy time for development isn't much to expect.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40 shinana abu


    Gavin has been playing 13 for Connacht recently until his injury....played on the wing for Ireland u20s...definitely has the pace for 13....much faster than Osborne.....whether he will be good enough is the question



  • Advertisement
  • Subscribers, Paid Member Posts: 44,924 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    Henshaw was one of ireland best players against Australia just 4 months ago, showing speed that a lot of posters thought he'd lost. he also scored a fabulous try against LAR only 2 months ago showing no lack of speed again.

    personally id have no problem with him filling the 23 shirt for the next 2 games.

    alternatives for the center position are being looked at all the time. In the last 2 years alone, there has been 11 different players wearing either 12 or 13 in green. They are being assessed all the time.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 42,758 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    This talk about moving Osbourne to centre, I just don't get it. He's been excellent at full back. We don't know if we'll ever see Keenan again. He's been out for a long time now and he's 29.

    I like the idea of Osbourne at full back, he's got all the tools to be great there. McCloskey is our 12 for the next couple of years, he's not really a 13. Leave him where he is as he's doing great.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 33,048 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    I mean by prolonged period I would settle for one full game. He has moments but that's it. He has absolutely not been better than Sam this year either.

    I suspect connacht will find this out relatively quickly.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,627 ✭✭✭Felexicon


    Keenan was a nailed on starter for the Lions last summer and is missing the 6Ns with a broken thumb.

    Wouldn't be retiring him just yet pal. He is straight back in at FB when fit.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,132 ✭✭✭Stanley 1


    Kinghorn was the nailed on starter but was late joining the tour due to non release by Toulouse.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,627 ✭✭✭Felexicon


    Is that the same Kinghorn who started the 3rd test on the wing while Keenan stayed at full back?

    Sure, he was definitely the nailed on starter there



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 42,758 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    He's never had 5 games at the position. A period to settle in to the position could make a huge difference. It might not and then all those who said he wasn't up to it will be right but with some of the performances he's put in I do think he has deserved the chance of a consistent run at the position.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 42,758 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    He's been out for a long time over the past two years. He's now 29, there's no guarantee that he comes back and reaches the level he was at before.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,132 ✭✭✭Stanley 1


    Kinghorn is the more adaptable player and has played on the wing for Toulouse, TMK Keenan has only ever played @ FB, Farrell fitted both in but IMO if it was a straight choice for Farrell, Kinghorn wins out albeit - very close.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,064 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    If Keenan is out long term, it's most likely JOB who will take his spot, at Leinster at least. Osborne is too slow for the back 3. He got torched by McCloskey, despite a headstart. Wish Lowry had been given a chance, he's in great form and offers a lot with his playmaking.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 59 ✭✭bigmac86


    I'm an Ulster fan through and through but sadly I dont think Lowry, for all his skills, has the size for test rugby. Opposition teams would land high balls on him all day, I wouldn't fancy him one on one with big wingers and he doesn't have a big boot for clearances either. Incredibly talented but his ceiling is limited by his stature



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 1,869 ✭✭✭Ben Bailey


    Keenan made his Ireland debut on the left wing vs Italy

    & also in his next game vs Georgia

    in the Autumn Internationals 2020

    (Stockdale was at 15)

    He moved to 15 in the 2021 6N and has always been selected there since.

    Post edited by Ben Bailey on


  • Subscribers, Paid Member Posts: 44,924 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    past two years??

    its only last year that Keenan has had enforced absence from the game due to injuries.

    in the 24/25 season he played 1572 minutes

    in 23/24 he played 1497 mins

    in 22/23 he played 1482 mins.

    incredibly consistent.

    hes out now due to elective hip surgery which affected him for 18 months prior, but did not lead to an absence. He would have been back for this 6 nations only that he broke a thumb in training.

    as for guarantees that any player returns to peak performance after injury?? that guarantee exists for no one.

    having watched Jamie Osbourne play for Naas, North Midlands and Leinster since the age of 15 i can say with some certainty that his best position is center, and as far as leinster and ireland goes, its much more likely that there will be a jersey for him in the center than 15 going forward.

    In the summer tour to georgia and portugal he started in the center against georgia before being called up for the lions.

    he also played in the center for the lions against the first nations, scoring a try on his debut.

    Longer term his future is 12/13, not 15



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,634 ✭✭✭Pete_Cavan


    I suspect that Keenan's recent absence will see him return stronger than before and ultimately extend his time as Ireland's first choice 15. His body will have gotten time to recover from the hip issue plus lots of general wear and tear which goes unnoticed but builds up over time. He'll be starting from a great place to build up to the WC.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 42,758 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    As has been said in this thread already, he'll never get an opportunity at 13. I think Gavin is the most likely to grab that jersey and soon.

    He's not getting the 12 jersey off McCloskey right now and how long he stays hot is anyone's guess. Personally I think Cathal Forde is a serious candidate.

    You know I'm a Connacht fan but I don't rave about all Connacht players. We've two back rows, two centres and a winger who are all really good.

    Jamie has been excellent at 15 for Ireland and I think you'll see him move there for Leinster, if he already hasn't.

    That's unless Hugo comes back as good as he ever was which is one of the best 15s in world rugby.



  • Advertisement
  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 33,048 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    What performances? People say this but I can't think of a particularly good performance by him



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 42,758 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Against South Africa? Do you not remember that one? I seen him play great against a South African side in a thumping a few years back.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,656 ✭✭✭FtD v2


    Per Gerry Thornley in the IT we’re going to see a lot of changes again:

    Jamie Osborne, Rob Baloucoune, Garry Ringrose, Stuart McCloskey, Jacob Stockdale, Jack Crowley, Jamison Gibson Park, Tom O’Toole, Ronan Kelleher, Tadhg Furlong, James Ryan, Tadhg Beirne, Jack Conan, Nick Timoney, Caelan Doris

    Reps: Tom Stewart, Michael Milne, Tom Clarkson, Joe McCarthy, Josh Van der Flier, Nathan Doak or Craig Casey, Ciaran Frawley, Tom Farrell or Bundee Aki


    I think it’s harsh on Tommy O’Brien not to start given how good he was in Twickenham. Can’t think of the last time Stockdale turned in a performance like that in green.

    Happy for Timoney to start, he’s earned it.

    Loughman unlucky to lose out too IMO, and this continued O’Toole thing at LhP is strange.

    I don’t love the Bundee or Tom Farrell inclusion in the 23 shirt either and don’t see the logic of it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 307 ✭✭big-al


    O’Brien dropped (& it is dropped) if true is a shocking call.


    Craig Casey can feel very lucky to be in the bench. I’ve yet to see him put in a decent cameo or performance in green and he is fairly one dimensional.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,779 ✭✭✭50HX


    I'm assuming Stu Mc is at 12?

    Good to see Timoney rewarded



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,656 ✭✭✭FtD v2


    Sorry, yeah omission on my part. I’ll edit now and fix.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,409 ✭✭✭✭bilston


    Murray Kinsella saying the same as GT.

    Even as an Ulster supporting Jacob Stockdale fan I'd have to say that would be a tough call on O'Brien, although perhaps Farrell is taking the view that TOB had a chance to redeem himself after Paris, maybe Stockdale should get the same, there's also the left foot aspect. But I'm still surprised if that happens.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,656 ✭✭✭FtD v2


    Murray Kinsella has largely the same team as Thornley.

    He says Loughman is struggling with an injury.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,064 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    Farrell or Aki on the bench is so maddeningly dull, really annoying tbh. Utter waste of a selection



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 307 ✭✭big-al


    Farrell fully deserves his selection if it happens. He is a good player, in fine form.


    Aki less so.



Advertisement
Advertisement