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Ireland vs Israel - To play or not to play, that is the question Read OP for Mod Warning

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 278 ✭✭Tacitus Kilgore DCLXVI


    Virtue signaling? 10 years ago is calling for its vapid "point".

    Post edited by Tacitus Kilgore DCLXVI on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,133 ✭✭✭keeponhurling


    Hopefully the Gardai say the game is too much hassle from a public order point of view.

    It gives the FAI an excuse to not play the game in Dublin, so no away fans need to come here. But the FAI aren't on the hook for being "political". (this happened already with Belgium who wouldn't host them)

    Play it in a neutral country and make some token protest. Maybe could wear black or something. The game not being in Dublin already gives the message that Israel are not welcome here.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,629 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    We're hosting the Euros in two year's time. Saying we are not capable of staging a match in Dublin from the point of view of security and have no choice but to move it abroad would be a very bad look for the country.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,811 ✭✭✭✭pjohnson


    I assume he was on about hosting Israel. Not all matches.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 8,445 ✭✭✭facehugger99


    So what happens if Israel qualify for the Euros and end up playing group matches in Dublin?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,629 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    It's still the exact same principle - saying we would not be capable of hosting a football match at the Aviva for security reasons and have 'no choice' but to move it abroad. We're hosting five matches in Dublin at Euro 2028, where you would expect there to be massive security for each game.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 968 ✭✭✭greyday


    Just ban away fans from Dublin and no Irish Fans go to Israel, it has already happened with Israeli fans as its known they are racist troublemakers.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 23,889 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Ireland should only consider playing them behind closed doors

    No travelling support from Israel, No Irish support in the crowd.

    There will be protests against the game, show the protests before and after the match. Leave absolutely zero doubt that Israel are not welcome as long as they are conducting a genocide (and they still are)

    Ban billionaires



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,133 ✭✭✭keeponhurling


    Well, in regular qualifying with home and away matches we could concede home advantage. Like Israel do playing in Budapest.

    In a tournament game like Euro 2028 then obviously it must take place in the host country.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 181 ✭✭Havenowt


    Maybe if fans cant bring in Palestine flags or banners, they could wear palestine jerseys under the Ireland top and display the palestine jersey at a paticular time in the game for 10 minutes.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,486 ✭✭✭trashcan


    I'd just like to mention Daniel Lamberts point, which not enough people are focussing on in my view. Israel are breaching UEFAS own statutes, in relation to having teams playing in occupied territories. The penalty for this is suspension or expulsion. We should be making this the focus of the argument, rather than putting the onus on the FAI, or the players, to not play the game. UEFA needs to enforce it's own rules. I recognise the difficulty for the FAI, and while I would applaud any player who refuses to play, I wouldn't expect it of them, or criticise them if they do play. Having said all that, my own view is that we shouldn't play the game. I wonder if one country makes the stand, would it lead to others following ? If enough countries refuse to play Israel then UEFA would be forced to act. Mind you that would require some solidarity, which seems to be in short supply these days.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,877 ✭✭✭Hoboo


    I might be anti Israeli foreign policy/genocide, but I’m not pro Palestinian either.

    You can protest one without supporting the other.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 4,230 ✭✭✭Enduro


    Where are the UEFA matches in occupied territories played? That's not something I've heard before. Which stadium?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 5,785 ✭✭✭dmcdona


    UEFA need to man up and simply ban Israel from all competitions. They did it with Russia but clearly, serious lobbying is going on here.

    Other UEFA members should support the FAI and the case of rule-breaking by Israel. That's the route to take.

    It should not have to come to the FAI contemplating playing or not playing the game. They know the result if they refuse.

    I heard today that, as it stands, the away fixture will be held in Israel. For anyone contemplating going to that game, I doubt you'd even get out of Ben Gurion airport.

    And if you did, arrive for your return flight at least 6 hours beforehand.

    As for the home fixture - peaceful protest before, during and after the game and the boys in green walloping (figuratively) the Israelis. Troy Parrott hat-trick a must.

    If the Israeli fans behave anything like the Maccabi Tel-Aviv fans, they should be hauled out and dealt with appropriately (as should anyone of course).

    Basketball Ireland have faced Israel a number of (difficult) times recently and have held heads high and been the bigger team. I applaud them.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,055 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    Good to see the match going ahead.

    Hopefully there will be no anti semitism towards the Israeli team.

    The Irish team will let the country down if they don't shake hands.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 24,348 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Do you think it's antisemitic to oppose a genocide?

    Say this conversation was about playing Russia, what word would you use to describe the collective action of not shaking the Russian players hands, were that to happen?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,055 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 24,348 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    You're stating a position pretty clearly by not answering the question.

    Why is that?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 740 ✭✭✭WindmillWarrior


    Its amazing how easily these kinds of arguments are taken apart. And most of the time the original poster then ignores a perfectly reasonable reply, as is the case again here.

    Why is that indeed?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,110 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    Anti Israel is not anti semtiisim.

    Israel is a political entity, Semitics are not, the football team is representing the political state.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 278 ✭✭Tacitus Kilgore DCLXVI


    He knows this but the edgelord persona he goes on with doesn't allow for acknowledging it.

    Mod Edit: Warned for personal abuse

    Post edited by Necro on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,668 ✭✭✭Patrick2010


    You see that on the immigration thread where a poster asked the very reasonable question as to what work skills that we need do Afghans and Somalis bring to Ireland and is their culture compatible with Irish society given their home country is anti-gay and anti-women. Response is you're a bigot to even ask that.

    Back on topic, the game has to go ahead. We'll be banned if we pull out and I wouldn't be surprised if EUFA pulled the games here. The reason Israel hasn't suffered the same ban as Russia because they know they have the backing of the US. Trump would go mad if they got a ban. Look at how FIFAs Infantino sucks up to him giving a peace prize for solving 8 (yeah right!) wars including the GAZA conflict.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 17,923 ✭✭✭✭astrofool


    There is also a "ceasefire" in place, you could possibly see UEFA taking action if that hadn't happened. We would have played in the russian world cup after Crimea and we compete against Israelis in other sports without boycotting them, best we can do here is go out and beat Israel and prevent them from being promoted and having a bigger stage to play football from.

    Most of the protests will be anti-israel, some anti-semitism will come into it and should be condemned. Some Israeli will also try and play anti-Israel protests as anti-semitism, they should be equally condemned.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,671 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    We'll be banned if we pull out

    That's not absolute. If all teams refused to play them they would have no choice but to fúck off somewhere else. There is precedent there.

    Or did you think a middle eastern team were playing in Europe because of Geography?

    UEFA and FIFA wouldn't be long getting rid if it started effecting their bottom line.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,064 ✭✭✭Ozymandius2011


    FIFA should be consistent when it comes to banning political activity at games. It should include the rightwing Israeli fans like of Macabee Tel Aviv who were involved in a riot in Amsterdam. The authorities jumped to conclusions in that situation. The fact that some fans were arrested was played down in order to present the fans as the real victims. There were genuine victims on both sides, but the underlying issue is the rightwing Israeli football hooligans, and the impunity with which Western governments treat them, in the process betraying their own nationals. The UK said it was trying to get a match ban involving Macabee Tel Aviv overturned.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 5,785 ✭✭✭dmcdona


    If IRL refuse to play, they will be sanctioned. And only IRL will be sanctioned.

    Relying on other teams (drawn against Israel) to refuse to play is a big gamble. It may or may not pay off.

    Better that IRL lobbies all other teams for UEFA to apply its rules - Israel to be banned for breaking said rules.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,228 ✭✭✭✭Cluedo Monopoly


    If you stand by your position, you should be able to answer the simple question.

    What are they doing in the Hyacinth house?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,228 ✭✭✭✭Cluedo Monopoly


    If these games go ahead I doubt either of them will be in Dublin or Israel. They will both be closed door events abroad.

    What are they doing in the Hyacinth house?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 24,348 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    There is also a "ceasefire" in place, you could possibly see UEFA taking action if that hadn't happened.

    I thought about this when starting the thread, and for a moment my own position was that given there is a ceasefire in place that refusing to play now was maybe not a necessary action.

    But, despite there being a ceasefire in place, Israel has continued to bomb and kill Palestinians (over 500 since the ceasefire came in to place) and of course it continues to control the Gaza strip entirely and prevent free movement even within it of Palestinians.

    So in fact, I think some form of resistive action against the Israeli state is appropriate.

    And unfortunately, I don't agree that if there was no ceasefire in place, that UEFA would act. They didn't act in the 2 years that Israel were actively attacking Palestine day and night so I've no confidence they would be acting if it was continuing.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 4,230 ✭✭✭Enduro


    Which UEFA rules are being broken? (Genuine question, I've tried asking similar from another poster and they have yet to reply)



This discussion has been closed.
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