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Ireland Team Talk XII: Farrell's First Fifteen

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 34,874 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,010 ✭✭✭For Petes Sake


    Amazing that all of these ex pros can call it out for what it is, yet all of culprits here who are waiting for him to breath in through his mouth and out of his nose seem to think there's nothing going on.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 689 ✭✭✭CONSI


    Good analysis, question has to be asked of the coaches and what they are doing if we cant set up to defend a 5 meter scrum. C.Prendergast shouldnt have had his head buried, TO'B should have overrun his defensive line…you feel that wouldnt have happened down the other end. Really sick of this line that we didnt show intensity in the 1st half, how can you not show intensity in an awa international v france..



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 326 ✭✭Rayray98


    It’s also a natural phenomenon how an entire team walking into contact and missing 40% of their tackles in the first half can be articulated down to who was at 10….



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 326 ✭✭Rayray98


    Also it must be said that a lot of the blame lies with Stockdale there, getting sucked in before the offload leaving Crowley with too much to do.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,018 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    I mean, you recently labelled me a culprit, who "seems to think there's nothing going on." Right?

    But when you look at what I've actually said:

    Now, is some of the criticism over the top? Yes

    Once again - misrepresenting what's actually been said. That's obviously going to draw a reaction.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 27,576 ✭✭✭✭phog


    There have been and will be in the future culprits on all sides, of that there's no doubt.

    Equally, a professional player playing for their country can expect to have their performance (good, bad or indifferent) discussed and analysed online by fans. Trimble himself got a some fair stick on this very forum so maybe he's hitting out because of that, Murry too.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 843 ✭✭✭MangleBadger


    If you spend anytime on TikTok you will see dozens of videos attacking Sam. No other player gets that treatment. It is ridiculous the level it has gotten to.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 27,576 ✭✭✭✭phog


    No other player at the moment. For as long as people have access to the Internet players have been attacked. Just look at this place, the abuse one poster can throw at another in the middle of a discussion. Some people can't control themselves.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,018 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    If you spend anytime on TikTok 

    I don't doubt it, but I don't have any interest in spending any time on TikTok.

    Boards point of difference is that it isn't TikTok.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,010 ✭✭✭For Petes Sake


    And O'Gara? One of the most heralded Irish players of all time?

    I have never seen such a relentless pile on like I've seen of Prendergast, and it is being led by so-called Irish rugby fans. It's a disgrace and they should all be ashamed of themselves.

    Let's not pretend this place can hold some sort of moral high ground over TikTok either.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 326 ✭✭Rayray98


    For me it started MOD EDIT poster warned in 2023. Prendergast has a MOTM display versus the Lions, then the following week the Bulls lost by 60 points (as expected given the team sheets) and the first thing he could point amongst ALL OF THAT was “This shows that Sam isn’t ready”…you could see the vendetta from a mile away and it was a sign of what was to come.

    Post edited by Lost Ormond on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 27,576 ✭✭✭✭phog


    Let's not pretend this place can hold some sort of moral high ground over TikTok either

    At least this place is modded, but yes, we have a lot of OTT reactions here too, there are posters here who will you you hate your team or coach just because there's a difference of opinion. I just think there's a difference to how people talk online than they would to your face.

    I should have added

    The likes of Lowe stating he hates Ulster before an InterPro is helping either.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,113 ✭✭✭irelandrover


    Social media was no where near as big when O Gara was playing. That's the reason. Otherwise you would have had hundreds of videos of his tackling. Every missed kick by sexton and every missed tackle by O Gara would have been shown when they were competing. The same way as when Sexton started over o Gara the TV would pan to O Gara sitting on the bench at every kick.

    My opinion is that the 10 is the most important position in the Irish team. Both players are making mistakes they should be dropped for. Both players come from sides with very entrenched fan bases. Its happening at a time when Ireland are sliding very quickly down the list in terms of best teams in the world. Its the perfect storm of fan bitteness.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,663 ✭✭✭FACECUTTR


    The Scrum wheeled away with C Prendergast losing sight of Jalibert. It was up to the 2 turnstiles outside to stop him and they didn't.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,091 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    Social media was no where near as big when O Gara was playing. 

    I remember in the aftermath of the 2011 RWC win against Australia, when everyone was saying O'Gara came on and won it for us, some guy stitched together a YouTube video of every involvement ROG had, and it looked as though he'd actually been rubbish.

    That has always stuck with me because it was a weird thing to do after a win, but mainly because it just was not something you saw back then.

    Now, everyone is at it, and to make yourself heard among all the noise, you have to shout louder and be ever more edgy.

    It's not a great development tbh.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,018 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    Fwiw, Trimble also mentioned some of his mistakes that included, for example, his effort on Jalibert, his hospital pass to TOB and his intercept.

    Stuff that, when you point it out on here, gets you labelled as "desperately wanting Prendergast to fail" by some. It's an over-the-top correction too far in the other direction.

    That's my point on this; reasonable criticism too often is getting lumped in with unreasonable stuff. And, ironically, leads to completely unreasonable criticism of those posters.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 27,576 ✭✭✭✭phog


    This is the thing, a poster should be able to discuss errors in a players game without the name or hate calling. It does nothing for the forum.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,464 ✭✭✭FtD v2


    For someone who doesn't want Prendergast to fail, you've posted about him maybe 30 or 40 times since the game last Thursday.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,018 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    Correct.

    In response to posts ranging from accusations of desperately wanting Prendergast to fail, to posts completely mis-quoting and mis-representing what's actually been said.

    And, indeed, posts like this, implying I want him to fail.

    A lot of those post aren't criticising Prendergast. They're criticising the over-reaction I've received for criticising Prendergast.

    Way to prove my point for me, tho.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,380 ✭✭✭Paul Smeenus


    While I agree about the unpleasantness of the current pile-on, Jacob Stockdale's international-level second season syndrome involved receiving death threats. This has been an issue for some time, and I'd hope there's a robust system behind the scenes to help folk cope.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 27,576 ✭✭✭✭phog


    I wasn't aware of that but stuff like that is unacceptable

    While this is a different level from a death threat "tagging" the player/official/coach when discussing their performances is also unacceptable



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 1,119 ✭✭✭jem


    If the main stick to beat crowley is his place kicking is there a case to play him with n doak who does the place kicking for ulster. a few here will remember in Mick Doles triple crown winning team paul dean was at 10 while m Kiernan took the place kicks and that worked well. There is no reason for the 10 to be the place kicker



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,018 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    As far as I'm aware, place kicking stats for all 3 10's in the squad are broadly similar this season.

    For me, it's much more Crowley's kicking from hand, particularly when we're putting up as many contestables as we seem to be at the moment.

    In that sense, there isn't much value in pairing him with Doak, as you'd lose JGP's box-kicking, which, whatever about the rest of his game, was pretty good last week.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,010 ✭✭✭For Petes Sake


    Crowley's issue isn't his place kicking.

    Don't recall anyone saying that but if that's a narrative then it's a stupid one.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,192 ✭✭✭typhoony


    Was looking back at my comment from 2023. I remember getting a bit of criticism. I didnt include Keenan hopefully he's not going to have regular injuries.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 326 ✭✭Rayray98


    I don’t blame you for getting criticism to be honest. It’s a game of opinions I accept but what on earth and Ryan and Porter doing there…I understand Porter has injuries here or there but still far from worried about weather he’d make the next RWC…same for Ringrose tbh, he’s going through a rough patch but it was only 6 months ago that he was playing great rugby for the Lions.


    Realistically 2 or 3 of the older guys will make it (I suspect Beirne, JGP and Furlong) with 2-3 missing out (Lowe & Aki) and it’s just a question of weather VDF or Henshaw can make it.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 33,956 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    I mean, it is definitely an issue, it is just one that he shares with everyone else.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 43,002 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Let's be clear here. The majority of talk on here is about his defense and it's terrible.

    Yes there are some ridiculous bashers and haters of him but there's not many and they are probably tik tok or Facebook members as well.

    I'm a Connacht fan and I don't want either of them starting. I want Harry Byrne whose not as good on defense as Crowley and not as good offensively as Prendergast but does a semi-decent job at both. I don't think he's the answer but he's a safer bet than either of the other two.

    And I'd guess you are a Leinster fan who sees any criticism of Prendergast as over the top.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,091 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    I suppose the question is, are certain players below their best because they're old, or are they just older players not playing well?

    Was 32 year-old van der Flier any worse than 25 year-old Cian Prendergast? Was 29 year-old Stockdale any better than the 33 year-old we dropped? 33 year-old McCloskey was probably the best player in the backline.



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