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Landlords selling 2026

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,273 ✭✭✭The Spider


    completely different situation, in reality the ARP scheme for Ukrainians is like the rental market many many years ago and tells you everything you need to know to increase supply.

    tax free payment (years ago tax rules weren’t enforced as they are today) ability to give a months notice and get your property back, people are wilfully misunderstanding this including the government, all those rentals that became available were holiday homes, granny flats, properties that people didn’t want to let out, the letting rules weren’t as severe.


    when the ARP scheme ends all those properties will disappear the people letting them out don’t want to be full time landlords and only did it because

    A. They thought they should help out in a lot of cases.

    B. They knew they could get their property back very quickly if they needed it.


    as for these new rules what’s going to happen is, HAP tenants will have nowhere to rent every landlord knows once their in you can’t get them out. Families will also have nowhere to rent or find it extremely difficult to rent somewhere, landlords know once the kids go to school the family is going nowhere.

    Couples in good jobs saving for a house they will invited to rent, weirdly the same goes for young people sharing a house, with the caveat that if one lives out they have no say over who moves in they’ll all have seperate leases the landlord will decide.

    basically tenants that look like they won’t stay six years you can add contract workers etc to the above list, so these rules will block the people they’re supposed to help.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 491 ✭✭bluedex


    Lads berating smaller (1 or 2 property) rental property owners on here, without any knowledge/experience of letting, haven't got a clue. They want their cake and eat it. A large number of independent analysts of the property market have stated that the latest measures will again exacerbate the problems. They are right, IMO, and we'll see the proof in the results over the next 12 to 18 months.

    As one article stated: "this is the seventh piece of rent sector legislation in the last decade, averaging one every 17 months. And we still don’t have a strategy"

    No wonder nobody wants to stay in the game if their control over their asset is being negatively impacted and eroded every year or 2. It's a no-brainer to get out and seek alternatives.

    Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,046 ✭✭✭Villa05


    Would a tax holiday for landlords in the below market rent trap help to stop the exodus of affordable rents from the market? Keep the rent affordable and keep the tax free rent



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,664 ✭✭✭Fol20


    That might work if the landlord owned it outright. What about if there is a mortgage,management fees, omc fees etc.

    Let’s say you have rent of 1500pm,mortgage 1000pm , management 150,omc 200pm
    market rent is 2.5k


    you can see the margins are razor thin and having all the risk for maybe 1k per year isn’t enough. It’s simpler to let landlords be taxed like everyone else at 52pc but allow them function properly.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,013 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    It wouldn't be enough to stop the general trend.

    It's needs two things. Fast track the eviction of bad tenants and make them liable for damage.

    Build more houses, especially public housing. Build basic housing that can be built fast and cheaper.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,664 ✭✭✭Fol20


    would this work to stop landlords from leaving?


    yes bad tenants offer risk, but sorting this out won’t resolve the viability discussion.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 96 ✭✭Aidensfield


    It would'nt help. All it would mean is those landlords trapped in a cycle of 30,40,50,percent or more below market rates would then for the first time in years receive the market rate but only for a brief period before the rug gets pulled again and at the same time still be expected to accept additional extra huge risks. Most folks are getting too hung up on the monthly rent amount which of course is a huge concern. The main problem is the incredible risk that is not going to go away anytime soon. The landlord haters will spin a different story. The bottom line is most landlords want tenants to have protections and security of course they should. If we had a fair system in place where non paying house wrecking tenants could be sent packing in the matter of days or weeks and a bit of common sense used landlords would be happier to accept far lower rents. The government could also offer to cover the cost of non paying tenants for several years and offer to pay for all damages if they insist we keep playing by the RPZ rules.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 172 ✭✭GalwayBmw




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 4,480 ✭✭✭TaurenDruid


    In shock news, estate agents don't want reform, and the Irish Independent will give them a platform.

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,707 ✭✭✭✭o1s1n
    Master of the Universe




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 491 ✭✭bluedex


    Viability is a huge issue.

    We should stop using terms like "landlords" and "evictions", like we're back in 1800s Ireland under British rule. They're too emotive.

    Clear heads are needed, with a clear strategy as a result.

    Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,476 ✭✭✭mrslancaster


    Not only estate agents, even people who are not landlords could be affected by the new rules. If an individual or a family inherits a rental property from a parent, grandparent, sibling, relative, friend, they will likely have tax to pay but will not be able to get vacant possession to sell until the end of a six year TMD. If they have to sell during the TMD to pay the tax, it has to be with the tenant. The value of a house with a tenant could be less, the pool of buyers will be less (cash only unless banks start to give mortgages without vacant possession), there may be no landlord buyers in some parts of the country and it’s unlikely an owner occupier would buy a house with a sitting tenant.

    It could also take a long time to sell a rental that’s 30/40/50% below market rent even to a cash buyer landlord. In the meantime, the beneficiaries need to pay inheritance tax, someone has to take on the role of landlord, deal with tenants, rtb, revenue. If CAT is not paid when due, interest and penalties are added. What could a family do if they can’t sell the property quickly, maybe get a loan? Just headaches that nobody needs after losing a loved one.

    So many families could be affected as the RTB data shows 103k+ small landlords around the country - that’s a lot of family members. Wills can cause problems anyway, wills with a rental is just extra complications and landlords are giving notice now to either sell or because their own family will use the property.

    The impact of the new rules is supposed to increase supply but I can’t see how they will benefit tenants if thousands of small landlords are leaving.

    Post edited by mrslancaster on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 96 ✭✭Aidensfield


    Very good point mrslancaster. I hadn't thought of that. What a mess. It is my understanding that CGT has to be paid in the same year of inheritance. Imagine a landlord say 5 properties dies suddenly and has an only child, The child could have a bill of several hundred thousand to pay and have no way to liquidate cash to pay it. This is just another reason to sell up or at the very least sell some property if you have a few to reduce the risk.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,479 ✭✭✭Grumpypants


    We just need one rule. If the tenant stops paying rent you can evict them. And then have a functioning mechanism to support landlords do this. If that was in place it would stop the outflow.

    I've gone through the eviction process. Had to give 9 months notice. At the end of the 9 months they just stayed another 3+ months.

    They had a new house from the council. but kept their stuff in my house for 3 months. The law says if they have a key and their belongings are there it's still their home so I can't enter it.

    I had multiple instances where they said I'm moving in the morning, I'm going on holidays and will leave the key in the letter box. I drive all the way to the house and they are still there. Nothing I can do but just drive the hour back home. I'd multiple instances like that.

    After they finally moved out and left broken windows, holes in walls, mountains of rubbish (pallets, tyres, sheds, trampoline etc.) I still had to wait two weeks before I could dump any of it to give them "reasonable time to collect their stuff"..

    7 months after they moved out I'm still getting angry voice mails because I won't do a 2 hour round trip to collect their mail and deliver it as apparently it's "easier for me to do that than for them to ring and get addresses updated".

    I can't get this house sold fast enough. If I ever go back into that market it will be short term air BnB style or rent a room where the rules aren't as toxic.

    And to think, I feel like I got lucky !!! They left after 12 months and there was only a few thousands in damage.

    Imagine that and you know why landlords are in mass exodus.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 96 ✭✭Aidensfield


    Stressfull as that was you got away very light compared to others.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,479 ✭✭✭Grumpypants


    That's the crux of the matter. I'm a "lucky one".

    It should be simple. 30 days with no rent. Give notice. Call RTB to engage the tenant. No remedy in 30 days they send a team to change the locks. Put the tenant on a register of defaulters so other landlords know to avoid them.

    There's a solicitor on YouTube that's worth a watch. He's in a similar situation trying to evict non paying tenant.

    Went to the RBT got a determination. But because the RTB made a typo in the determination ( something like they referenced article 31 when it should have been article 30) the court wouldn't hear it. Case for pushed back months. He went back to the RTB to ask them to fix the typo, and they said there is no legislation for them to redo it so they can't help.

    Months of notice, months with a useless RTB, months with a court system.

    Eventually he got lucky and they moved out leaving behind a flat soaked in cat pee.

    He is a solicitor and still found it an insanely complicated system. God help the normal Joe soap.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 325 ✭✭MadeInKerry


    I was talking to somebody yesterday who inherited their parents house a few years ago and have it rented out since. They were keeping it so their children could use it when they go to college in a few years. Its probable that they wont get it back now when they need it so have decided to give the tenants (3 couples) notice before the new rules come in and just sell it and be done with it.

    They will then pay rent for their kids while in college with the proceeds (if they can find anywhere to rent when the time comes). Which they probably would have had to do anyway if they couldnt get their property back when needed.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 4,480 ✭✭✭TaurenDruid


    What? It is literally landlords evicting tenants. What sort of Newspeak would you have us use?! 🙄

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 96 ✭✭Aidensfield


    I had a case with the (p)rtb years back. Non paying tenant 3 bed house distroyed. All furninture wrecked and skipped. Most fitted wardrobe doors and kitchen unit doors broke off or kicked in. Holes in the plaster board in most rooms. Mountains of rotton rubbish piled up in the back garden. Carpets distroyed. All curtains and blinds missing or wrecked. Living room sofa which was a good one had to be skipped aswell. The kids were let run wild and often home alone for hours without an adult. There favourite pastime was jumping off the window board onto the bed. This happened almost everyday. More often than not the kids were running around the house naked and it made it very difficult to be in the house as i had to try not to make eye contact with the kids for fear of getting into trouble later. The worst part was the smell of piss all over the sofa and the stairs carpet. Long story short i won my case with prtb. Never got a cent only (a scent). Sherrif called out to new abode to collect anything of value but i was told there was nobody home that day. End of story. 5 figure lesson learned. Even after dealing with this i am well aware that i am also one of the lucky ones!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 4,480 ✭✭✭TaurenDruid


    And, of course, also one of a tiny minority. Absolutely, there are **** tenants. Absolutely, there are **** landlords.

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,219 ✭✭✭SupaCat95


    Faster eviction yes. There is a reason why bad tenants are bad tenants and they usually dont have a fart to their name, they are either or both Welfare clients and Pharmaceutical End Users/Distributers.

    I was buying about 4 years back and gutted that I could nt get a sniff at one four bedroom house in the town but bought a house around the corner later a month or two later. Three years later it shows up in a video on Whassap that out of town drug dealers were using it.

    For those of us with long term vision the future is obvious that housing is going to be modular homes. Its going to be crap, cold and damp….. I wonder who own Portakabin?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 96 ✭✭Aidensfield


    You are quiet correct. Again you seem to be slowly coming around. Well done.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 22,115 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    By changing a few regulations regarding tenants the RTB and the government could solve a lot of issues regarding rentals

    As a LL I have to give the RTB my PPS number. There is no onus on tenant/tenants even if involved in a dispute to do the same. This small little change would stop a lot of rogue tenants as they could be tracked and if involved in similar issues in a couple of years time it would be easier to deal.with them.

    If a tenant leaves unpaid debts behind them it should limit there access to a future appeals process. Tenants should not be able to carry out any appeal unless there rent is up to date. If there us a dispute over the figure, the RTB should hold the moneys in an escrow account.

    In the case of damage to property, non payment of rent/rent arrears, there should be an expediated determination/eviction process.

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 325 ✭✭MadeInKerry


    The whole situation is really easily fixed, but there is a fear to even say out loud what everyone can see happening. Ireland is now used as an example in universities all over the world when teaching about rent controls and unintended consequences. The example used to be New York.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,013 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    Berlin used to be an example of rent controls, it's also a example of the problems of large corporate landlords. Ireland seems to want ignore the lessons others have already learned.

    Fast eviction of bad tenants is crucial. The also tenant learns its not a viable scam. The system as it is, there no reason not to game the system.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,013 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    Until that happens it will always be a high risk investment.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,476 ✭✭✭mrslancaster


    Using emotive words like eviction or evicting tenants should be dropped imo, it conjures up images of famine times when landowning absentee owners removed tenants or belongings and burned properties to prevent re-entry. The language in the 21st century legislation - Notice of Termination - is accurate language to describe the legal process to end a contract.

    Todays landlords and tenants are parties to a legal contract similar to employment contracts where both sides are obliged to follow rules and can withdraw should their circumstances change. Any issues/ disputes have a legal forum for resolution. There is no comparison to the situations that happened in the 1800s.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,476 ✭✭✭mrslancaster


    It could get very messy for some families. A big question is why the government do not inform people that this could happen if they inherit a rental property.
    How is a compulsory TIS sale for every lease not restricting a citizens right to “transfer, bequeath and inherit property”. I think it’s quite problematic that a person inheriting a property would have less rights over it than a tenant and also find themselves with responsibilities and obligations they did not contract for.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 96 ✭✭Aidensfield


    You could a case like where one sibling inherits rental properties but in the will it is requested he or she must provide other siblings with x amount of money each or maybe a requirement that he or she must look after a sibling that is unwell. Nightmare. At the same time a nursing home could have their greedy paws out looking for their cut.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,013 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    Is poorly thought out.

    They are arguing Landlord aren't leaving and its doesn't matter if they do. While moving heaven and earth to stop them leaving.

    You only need to stop them leaving because there aren't enough rentals. Go build the rentals, then you wouldn't have do all these stupid tricks.



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