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Ireland Team Talk XII: Farrell's First Fifteen

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 27,316 ✭✭✭✭phog


    Only one big screen here tonight



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 818 ✭✭✭MangleBadger


    I wouldn’t even say he missed the tap tackle. LBB went to ground. When is a tap tackle successful? The tackler is never going to complete the tackle by bringing the player to ground.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,759 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    For that one, yep, I agree (it was the JBB try).

    But do you think them having the same tackle success % means the quality of their missed tackles was the same, overall?

    That’s what was being implied here.

    And you’ll be forgive me for being a bit prickly towards a poster who’s claimed I have “a desperate desire for Prendergast to fail”.

    Post edited by aloooof on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 818 ✭✭✭MangleBadger


    Which missed tackles by Sam do you think we’re particularly bad?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,759 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    The one for the Jalibert try was very poor.

    TOB was far more at fault for the try, he shot and caught himself in no man’s land.

    But I think part of the reason he shot like he did was because he knew Prendergast was the defender on his inside.

    I’m sure there was another too.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 166 ✭✭Jelly Welly


    Post edited by Lost Ormond on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 818 ✭✭✭MangleBadger


    So the one where everybody in the studio agreed it was TOB at fault and Sam was enroute to get the outside man?
    How is that worse than Crowley’s missed tackles?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,759 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    The try can be TOB’s fault AND it can be a really poor tackle attempt from Prendergast.

    Both things can be true.

    And with regards Crowley’s, as per the screenshot above, one was a 2 on 1 where he did really well to even lay a hand on Attisogbe.

    Neither were responsible for the resultant try. But Prendergast’s was an objectively worse effort at a tackle. That’s why I think Prendergast’s was worse.

    I think that pattern will be the same if you analyse all of the missed tackles. Because Crowley is obviously a better defender.

    Now, a question in return. Do you think it’s possible TOB shot like he did because Prendergast was the player inside him?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,682 ✭✭✭FtD v2


    There’s an actual game of rugby happening and we’re still posting about who made more effort in situations that were ultimately conceded tries for Ireland.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,759 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    You’ll forgive me for defending my position after being told I “desperately want Prendergast to fail”, FTD.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,682 ✭✭✭FtD v2


    Yeah, I get that obviously, but I just don’t get the relevance of the focus on these situations.

    I do think Sam’s defence has improved a bit this season - but from a very low base. He looks a lot more willing this year IMO. He’s still obviously not a good defender though.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 818 ✭✭✭MangleBadger


    Well if he did he made the wrong choice and that isn’t on Sam. Sam was doing his job.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 731 ✭✭✭darkened_scrum


    First he shouldn't be subject to basic physics, now Prendergast is casting an aura over his teammates making them make terrible decisions and miss tackles themselves. Absolutely pathetic nonsense.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,759 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    You "get that obviously", yet you saw fit to thank a post claiming I'm desperate for him to fail… cheers FTD…

    The focus is because of this:

    Crowley and Prendergast's tackle success rate from last night is similar, if that's how you want to compare the two.

    Do you think the quality of their missed tackles was broadly comparable? I don't.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,682 ✭✭✭FtD v2


    I have less than zero interest in getting into this nonsensical debate.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 6,494 ✭✭✭P.Walnuts


    If anyone was hoping for the A team to put their hands up I'm pretty sure we are f*cked

    We are in the weeds.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,228 ✭✭✭bingobango12


    We are in for some rough rough years it looks like.



  • Subscribers, Paid Member Posts: 44,928 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    Our skills level across the board is actually worryingly poor. Basics of hooking, propping etc are really been shown up in this A game, and our ability to catch draw pass across both squads is so below the level it should be.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,656 ✭✭✭SaoPaulo41


    Worrying very worrying for Irish rugby



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,656 ✭✭✭SaoPaulo41




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 6,494 ✭✭✭P.Walnuts


    POC smiling for photos at full time.......I'm all for being fan friendly, but christ, probably the worst weekend for Irish rugby in 15 years.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,656 ✭✭✭SaoPaulo41


    Before the game, the camera panned to the Senior Irish coaches and they were all laughing and joking, didn't seem worried. I did notice though during the game when the camera panned to Farrell he didn't look happy at all. They are only snapshots of course .



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,414 ✭✭✭✭bilston


    Noticed that myself, in fairness Sexton had his serious head on too. But sure it means nothing. They are people too, they are allowed to smile every now and then!!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,101 ✭✭✭Paddy_Mag


    Ireland defence was on the back foot. France attacked at pace. A player like Jalibert stepping a defender unable to come forward is only gonna end one way.

    Ireland defence was retreating the whole night because France had immense gainline success in contact. And quick ruck ball. And their players were coming onto the ball at pace.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 597 ✭✭✭Piskin


    Spot on…skill level's have not been addressed since 2023,



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,759 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    I agree with all of that.

    And I still think drawing an equivalence between Prendergast and Crowley because their tackle success %’s were similar is flawed.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 166 ✭✭Jelly Welly


    Ireland in the doldrums for next decade



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,502 ✭✭✭almostover


    That 'A' game was a hard watch. Whatever is in the senior camp right now is the hand we have to play with. Hopefully the long term outlook isn't as bad as it seems after the last 2 evenings.

    I'll give some modicum of credit to Byrn Ward, Brian Gleeson and James Hume. After that it was dire. Cathal Forde looked decent too I suppose.

    What worries me most is the tight 5 were hopeless. Both the 5 that started and the 5 that ended the game. We'd better hope we don't ship any injuries in that area of the field over the next few weeks.

    I need an Italy or a Wales win tomorrow to rescue this weekend for me.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,759 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    “Absolutely pathetic nonsense” is indeed a good summary of this post.

    Players make different reads / decisions based on who is defending inside / outside of them, all the time. It’s part of being a good defender.

    There were occasions last night when you could see VdF and McCloskey clearly being tasked with getting closer to Prendergast, for example.

    TOB’s execution was clearly awful. But his decision, imo, was influenced because Prendergast was defending inside.

    That’s what I’m saying and is an entirely different, and far more nuanced take than “Prendergast is casting an aura over his teammates making them make terrible decisions and miss tackles

    Again, some people complain about the volume of Prendergast criticism but overlook the parts of it are in response to rubbish like this. Which is once again…. making my point for me.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,569 ✭✭✭blackcard


    French result was coming. Munster, Connacht and Leinster have been poor at URC level. Ireland peaked in 2022 and have been declining since. Sexton & O'Mahoney retiring, Furlong, Conan, Henshaw, VDF, Lowe, JGP getting older. Loss of form for Doris, Sheehan, Ringrose. Injuries to Keenan, Baird, Hansen and props.

    In some ways, Ireland are finding their real level. Given their resources, France and England should be hockeying Ireland every year. We should be in a contest with Scotland and Wales for 3rd, 4th and 5th place. The results and performance against France and England A are worrying

    Ireland got lucky with a golden crop of players. Blessed to have coaches such as Schmidt, Lancaster, Mike Catt and Farrell. Cursed to have Nienbarr who has overseen our backs going backwards

    I like Farrell but every coach has a lifespan. He needs a new attack coach.

    On a positive note, we still have a lot of good players. Every bounce of the ball and the balance of refereeing decisions went with France.



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