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Fighter jets for the Air Corps?

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,887 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    The fall-back is to spend on the radar, spend on a ground based missile system, and spend on a NATO standard intel/comms system that allows a freer sharing of data and intelligence, such that NATO can look after threats using land based aircraft, carrier based aircraft, and drones.

    But the combat aircraft remain in LoA3 and the current target of LoA 2.5 by 2030 and a later move to LoA3 remains policy. So of right now, they are a longer term acquisition goal, once the defence sector is reformed and expanded, including some very basic systems and resources, without which buying jets would be utterly pointless.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,421 ✭✭✭jonnybigwallet


    Seems like the Taoiseachts trip to China went well.. Wonder was it put to him that they could cut a deal on a squadron of J17's? Damned fine plane by all accounts and did well recently in Pak India conflict. Good price point as well and probably quicker than Saab or Dassault to procurement...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,887 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    You want to insert a Chinese built fighter plane into the middle of a NATO standard environment, as our military is revitalised under a structure of bilateral and multilateral cooperation with partner countries who are major NATO alliance members and western standard defence builders?

    Jesus Jonny, even by your standards that one of the dumbest things I've ever heard, and demonstrates that either you think you're funny, but aren't, or do not actually have the first clue about what is discussed by the adults here.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,421 ✭✭✭jonnybigwallet


    Saudi lookin at buying it. And we're not aligned with any NATO infrastructure. Anyway the post was a question…not necessarily a recommendation. Prefer to wait forever for Saab / Dassault and pay through the nose? Very grown up!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,887 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    A) Who cares

    B) Yes, we are

    C) I'd rather continue operating nothing than become some sort of regional pariah for allowing ourselves become some sort of trojan horse for Chinese defence tech.

    Have you even heard the alarm bells rang over the last 10 or 15 years about Chinese made comms networks and IT components in European systems?

    Boris Johnson may be a bumbling fool that brought the UK to the brink of self-destruction, but even he wasn't stupid enough to allow a deep penetration of Huawei tech into the British 5G system, and to further order any vestiges of Chinese networking tech to be stripped out of the UK altogether by 2027, given vulnerability it might cause in UK government, defence and national security architecture.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,990 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    Some countries due to their location like to diversity their equipment between east and west in case they have to work with other supply chains or in cooperation with other countries with different equipment.

    That's not the case for Ireland, on the edge of Atlantic surrounded by NATO. "North Atlantic Treaty Organization."



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 988 ✭✭✭vswr


    He did. The Tories initially allowed widespread penetration into the FTTC/FTTP and 5G networks, even with numerous warnings from various intelligence agencies, and BT.

    They only backtracked when the American's pushed it, and threatened to pull out certain tech from USAF bases and block F-35 sales unless mobile networks ripped out Huawei kit which covered their bases.

    It setback the 5G rollout about 2-3 years (if not longer). FTTC was a somewhat accepted risk, with a slower removal, and FTTP being able to absorb some of the losses, as it not being as mature of a rollout. The UK's centre of 5G research was essentially a Huawei lab for years. All that research and intellectual property was lost overnight.

    It's still in the network and complete eradication is not due until 2027.

    edit: conversely, it may also be one of the reasons Ireland will never get certain US tech also, Huawei is heavily used in the Eir network.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,421 ✭✭✭jonnybigwallet


    Hardly worth discussing this any more. Seems unlikely anything significant will happen for at least ten years unless the government think outside the box and go for a deal with Turkey or Sth Korea.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,887 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    And why would they need to do that Jonny?

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,421 ✭✭✭jonnybigwallet


    Happy New Year Larbre me auld friend!

    Why…for speed of delivery and cost reasons.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,420 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    we were never getting fighter jets, this was pretty obvious, but we will get increased spending in defense, which is clearly good, and about bloody time to



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,815 ✭✭✭tinytobe


    This is shortsighted of Ireland.

    Ireland may have to defend the country against a US invasion at some point in the future.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,154 ✭✭✭saabsaab


    The way things are going with Trump I see the EU getting closer to China. My enemy's enemy is my friend. No harm in getting a offer for a few they might throw in a maintenance deals and training too. Say 4 and wait for the Gripens?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,216 ✭✭✭sparky42


    The US wants to invade, then we have to hope the nuclear powers of Europe stop them.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,154 ✭✭✭saabsaab


    If the US invades ireland we have nothing to deter or stop them it would be over in hours. We couldn't stop them even if we had a well equipped military. We are outside NATO and pretty much defenceless ourselves. At least if we had a well armed deterence force based on guerilla warfare a TA and regular training it might make them or anyone else think twice?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,815 ✭✭✭tinytobe


    As far as I know there is a clause in the EU for EU members that they are to aid each other in case of an attack.

    Since Greenland for instance is outside of the EU economically speaking, but defence of Greenland is still a matter of Denmark, other EU countries, neutral or not, would have to potentially come to aid. The matter has been answered by legal experts before.

    For the rest, I'd agree. If the US were to invade Ireland, and Ireland alone had to defend the island, it'll be over in a matter of less than an hour. It wouldn't surprise me if they'd all end up drinking in the pub, leaving the firearms outside….



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5 londonresident


    Well Ireland could join Nato, in a similar arrangement to Iceland.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,216 ✭✭✭sparky42


    The NATO that is currently facing its largest member deciding to annex other members… Not sure NATO is the healthiest right now.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5 londonresident


    Well Nato is multiple countries. Sure America is the primary defender, I guess Canada and a few other countries could provide some partnership cover defence, while the Irish military just does what it is trained to do, on a very small scale.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,887 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    NATO itself may not last the course here.

    And then every truism that Ireland relied on for 80 years, both in terms of not investing in defence and in basking in a benign geopolitical environment will be gone like a fart on the breeze.

    We could conscript half a million men of fighting age into service tomorrow, and spend the whole country's annual budget of €120 Billion on gear, and it wouldn't be near enough to repel a direct attack from any combination of former NATO states, or the US on its own.

    So the strategy now must be to quietly abandon military neutrality and build a series of bi-lateral defence partnerships with friends in this region; France, Spain, Portugal, the Scandis, and most vitally, the United Kingdom.

    And even France and the UK may be bitten by the zombies before 2030.

    What then? Who the **** knows. But its no accident that we are already seeking formal defensive relationships on a bilateral basis with nations like Finland.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 988 ✭✭✭vswr


    Trawlers and travellers…. the little known elite defence of Ireland.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,099 ✭✭✭CrabRevolution


    It's not just the US that our use of Chinese tech will cause trouble with; the EU is presenting legislation this week to implement a ban on using Chinese companies for "critical" sectors.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 988 ✭✭✭vswr


    In the same breath, Huawei are opening a production line in France for 5G base stations.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,887 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    Not any more they aren't.

    They are now considering 3 choices; mothball it, repurpose it, or sell it.

    Some European manufacturers have already begun assessing the site for acquisition.

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5 londonresident


    Nobody has suggested anybody is invading the Irish nation anytime soon. The government there is probably on the correct road with the investment. Supposedly Russia's security troubles may last for another fifteen years or forty years. And it could unlikely do anything, due to the small population, militarism would destroy the economy and the identity.

    Iceland faces a worst threat with no military. It can occupied, it is more strategic than any actual reason.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,887 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    Well, Donald Trump told the Prime Minister of Norway in a letter today that he no longer feels obliged to think only of peace after he did not receive the Nobel Peace Prize, from his country.

    He has also invited Vladimir Putin to join the "board of peace" for Palestine. A privilege for which he is arbitrarily charging One Billion Dollars (insert Dr Evil laugh here), having already invited Javier Milei and Alexsandr Lukashenko, among others.

    So if you think this couldn't all blow up into a massive global conflagration in a much shorter timescale than 15 years, or that the threat only comes from our east, I suggest you think again.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,216 ✭✭✭sparky42


    Now to be fair, the mandarins of the department are still totally happy with our security environment, there are no risks at all, no problems, steady as we go…



  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 16,029 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tabnabs


    Sure doesn't Ireland have an invite to the Gaza board of peace too. One billion dollar ticket price and we get to sit between Putin and Jared Kushner. Spend, baby, spend… 🙄



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,216 ✭✭✭sparky42


    Technical point, that's two different things. The Billion dollar bribe is if we want a permanent seat at this "board", otherwise the nations would be rotated off after 3 years apparently…



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  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 16,029 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tabnabs


    And you think all those guys would hang around for three years? Once the money is banked, it will quietly fold and collapse away into obscurity.



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