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Mass shooting on Bondi Beach

191012141531

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,478 ✭✭✭Miniegg


    It is incredible the hypocrites on this page.

    Many of the people telling us that Australian Jews shouldn't be targeted over Israeli crimes in Gaza (which is totally correct) are the same crowd who have been nonstop telling us that opposition to it is antisemetic, which does nothing else but bind Jews worldwide to these crimes.

    We see Gaza on our phones, on the news, in documented reporting, we hear the declarations from human rights NGOs, UN special committees, from experts in genocide studies, on and on.

    These are Israeli crimes, not Jewish crimes, yet how many of youse have not only denied them, but accused those speaking out against them as being Jew haters for doing so?

    And now, after two years of hive-minding Jews as complicit in Israel’s actions, you hypocrites suddenly insist that Jews are not to blame when antisemitic violence occurs?

    We already know that, so stop using them and their vulnerable communities -who have no say in the policies of Israel - as shields so Netenyahu and his gang of pshycos can avoid being held accountable.

    More innocent civilians killed in yet another evil attack. Great they have people in custody so hopefully the Aussies will get some answers and bring justice to the families.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,645 ✭✭✭geographica


    amazing how you know that 🤔


    he got very lucky indeed



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,603 ✭✭✭Cyclingtourist


    Not true actually.

    Israel murdered an innocent waiter in Lillihammer Norway in 1973. Try Googling 'Lillihammer Affair'.

    It also killed a number of suspected terrorists in various European countries.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,471 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    This gentleman is also a Muslim immigrant (from Idlib in Syria).



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,148 ✭✭✭✭Mellor


    I mentioned earlier I was in the area yesterday, away from the beach, I thankfully left earlier and was unaffected. But today I’m hearing about all the people who were affected.

    A friend from Dublin and his wife on the far side of the beach at a birthday party when shooting started.

    My boss was at the beach with her two young boys and had to flee the shooting. The boys are pretty shook up.

    The people affect is a large number, the majority of whom are not related to actions in Israel.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 56,679 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,478 ✭✭✭Miniegg


    Awful stuff, so frightening people have that hatred in then to do that to crowds of innocent people.

    Bondi always full of Irish. Must have been fair frightening for them all, glad they got away without physical injury though witnessing that has to leave a mark.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,972 ✭✭✭✭Mr.Crinklewood


    Certain types of people will probably claim he was shouting "My turn,my turn" as he grabbed the gun.

    Thankfully there's an ignore option to block those with form.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 35,710 ✭✭✭✭The_Kew_Tour


    Sorry to hear

    People forget the long term damage these things can do to people.

    Its more than just people who died and who are hurt. Obviously they pay ultimate price but many will have mental scars for years to come.

    I wish the childish rubbish that goes on here can would stop too. Its pathetic.

    EVENFLOW



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 24,220 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    See, this is what we are dealing with here. You and many others would happily ban this man and many millions more like him from your country for no other reason than the religion which they practice.

    Will be interesting to see if any of the posters who have been posting on here a lot about the persecution (as they see it) of people for being Jewish have an issue with a statement like this.



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  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,653 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manic Moran


    Both statements can be accurate in general, although in detail not.

    Firearms were never removed from Australian society. It is estimated that some 2/3 of semi auto rifles banned after Port Arthur were never turned in and are still in circulation. In this case, however, its seems that most, if not all, the firearms in use were lawfully owned, which functionally disproves the premise anyway. That said, carriage for self defense was not lawful in Australia for many decades, so that other part of the argument also somewhat fails. Still, maybe one of the folks in an apartment able to film for ten minutes might have been able to grab a rifle and do something more useful. I suspect that would be more likely in Miami than Sydney.

    Regardless of the chances of such a set of circumstances occurring, once they are occurring then the only applicable question is "now what?" Charging an active shooter while unarmed is a sub-optomal course of action, which worked in this case (and then provided the gun that the citizens could shoot back with, a preferred solution to containing the problem than charging the two of them again).

    The relative firearms murder rate difference is about accurate (though a more practical comparison is the murder rate overall, the dead don't care how they died, this is still higher in the US). For those just enjoying a day at the beach, however, never involved in criminal or gang activity, or otherwise conducting themselves in a manner liable to cause conflict, the statistics are equally irrelevant.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,717 ✭✭✭Jack Daw


    So because 1 Muslim did a good thing everything is ok now with that religion/ideology

    You do know that nobody has ever argued that every muslim was bad , what they have argued is a disproportionate number appear to hate the west and yet the west tolerates this.

    Immigration policy should be about assessing risk and analyse willingness to integrate and contribute, unfortunately the muslim religion/ideology has proven to be higher risk category than say people from Bhuddism or Shintoism religion/ideologies



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,370 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,006 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    Mistaken identity of someone they thought was a terrorist though wasn't it, rather than trying to kill as many random people as possible. But you’re right I should have been more precise. I meant deliberate terror attacks on people known to be uninvolved, rather than attempted extrajudicial killings of known or suspected terrorists.

    Not that I’m justifying those either - Im not at all sure that extrajudicial killings are a great strategy myself but funny enough someone here today suggested them as an acceptable way for Israel to defend itself, rather than attack Gaza directly.

    In any case, not the sort of deliberate attempts to kill random citizens that I was talking about.

    "If a woman cannot stand in a public space and say, without fear of consequences, that men cannot be women, then women have no rights at all." Helen Joyce



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,006 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    The post you quote doesnt say that every Muslim is bad. In fact it acknowledges that Ahmad al Ahmed was heroic.

    "If a woman cannot stand in a public space and say, without fear of consequences, that men cannot be women, then women have no rights at all." Helen Joyce



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,006 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    Are you really saying you think there is any doubt that the attack in Bondi was persecution of people for being Jewish?

    "If a woman cannot stand in a public space and say, without fear of consequences, that men cannot be women, then women have no rights at all." Helen Joyce



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,148 ✭✭✭✭Mellor


    The photo shared was of the shooter. The name was accurate, the guy above just happens to have the same name, Naveed Akram.

    The older shooter was Sajid Akram. Father and son. It is believed they pledge allegiance to terrorist group, the Islamic State.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,023 ✭✭✭ceadaoin.


    Ah now, just because they were murdered for being Jewish, doesn't mean they were persecuted, its all a matter of how we "see it" apparently 🙄



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 15,471 ✭✭✭✭Igotadose


    It's not a 'problem' unless someone makes it a problem. Those that make it a 'problem' are called anti-semites.

    Considering it a 'problem' is a slippery slope. Is it a 'problem' that Vatican City is linked to the RCC? I expect Boko Haram supporters massacring Christians in Nigeria and elsewhere think it's a problem.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 15,581 ✭✭✭✭retalivity


    I see Netanyahu has stuck his nose in, blaming Albanese for "allowing antisemitism to spread by recognizing Gaza". If i was AA, id have told that genocidal prick to fcuk off



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 504 ✭✭✭briangriffin


    In the past couple of days an extremist Islamic terror plot was prevented in Germany 5 people were arrested who had planned to drive a car through a Christmas Market.

    In Paris the concert celebrations for New years eve are cancelled this year on the champs elysees because of heightened security concerns.

    If a religion has an extremist element that is responsible for the vast majoirity of terrorist attacks in the world then when a terrorist attack occurs people will firstly assume that it is that same extremism that's caused said terrorism. That's not islamaphobia its a logical conclusion based on previous experience. Blaming all of Christianity for christian priests abusing children seems to be perfectly acceptable on this forum but saying that a medieval religion which has proven itself to have an absolutely murderous, barbaric element to it is a phobia. There is no phobia there is a problem with the Muslim religion, a problem which is epitomised by the suicidal empathy of the progressive elite who cannot comprehend that some cultures are incompatible with theirs, because their own virtuosness won't allow it, just ask the people of Lebanon a majoirty Christian country recently enough how compatible all cultures are.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 1,835 ✭✭✭OscarMIlde


    What Israel has been doing in the West Bank, stealing territory piece by piece is not justified and Israel should have faced some international condemnation for it.

    What Israel has done since the October 7th attack is grossly disproportionate and morally wrong.

    What Hamas did on October 7th was disgusting and barbaric, and not in anyone justified by anything Israel has ever done. Hamas are hard-line Islamists. Even if Israel was wiped from existence Gaza would still be a repressive anti-democratic country as Islamists don't practise democracy.

    Anyone defending or explaining this atrocity as due in part to Gaza should bear in mind that Islamists have long carried out terrorist attacks against things they deem anti-Islam. Look at the protests and Fatwa against Salman Rushdie for the satanic verses. Translators and publishers of that book have been killed over the years. For a book. A book that offends Islamists. If Israel was gone and indeed if Israel had never existed there would still be terror attacks against Jewish people (just as there are against Christians) because anti-Jewish sentiment is within the Koran and fanatics can use anything in that book as justification for their actions. The war on Terror and the atrocities in Gaza are just an excuse to do what they would want to do anyway.

    when I say Islamists I mean Islamists and not anyone of the Muslim faith

    “Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.”


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,717 ✭✭✭Jack Daw


    That post didn't argue every muslim is bad.

    It pointed out the fallacy the argument some have been making , the "oh look a muslim did a good thing yesterday therefore there is no issue" argument, forgetting of course 3 did an horrific thing so their own argument in defence of the muslim religion/ideology and the people who follow it based on this heroic deed collapses instantly .



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,006 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    My suspicion that they hadn’t released the name for so long because they weren’t sure they had the right guy (even though they actually did release his name a few minutes later) have been confirmed: Benjamin Erickson has been released without charge and they have nobody.

    Meanwhile it turns out that the younger of the two men in the Bondi beach attacks had previously been investigated over his links to radical Islamists but was assessed as not being an ongoing threat.

    His father had a number of legally held guns.

    A lot of questions to answer there. Whether they’ll be answered is a different thing of course.

    "If a woman cannot stand in a public space and say, without fear of consequences, that men cannot be women, then women have no rights at all." Helen Joyce



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,399 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    I don't think there's no issue. there was an attack. But trying to use it to say that muslims are a problem when the vast majority are peaceful people is just wrong.

    I always find it ironic that Irish people can make any kinds of judgements like that. It's not that long ago we had loads of active terrorist organisations here and there were weekly bombings. But no-one ever said the irish were the problem. No-one ever wanted to put a ban on Irish people moving to their country. Those attitudes did exist back in the 1800's. We were seen as violent and stupid. Thankfully those attitudes have gone away.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,717 ✭✭✭Jack Daw


    If the British government had extra security checks on Irish people moving to the UK and on flights and boats going to the UK from Ireland during the 70s,80s and 90s when the Provos were active that would have been 100% justified and sensible policy, whether people liked it or not.

    The muslim issue is much bigger however as there are alot more of them and clearly there are a proportion who despise the west who move to the west, how many more terrorist attacks does it take before people begin to realize that although the vast majority of muslims are perfectly fine a minority are not and maybe this needs to be taken into consideration when it comes to immigration policy , maybe it needs to be taken into consideration when large numbers are allowed to claim to be refugees and move to a culture without any background checks.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,444 ✭✭✭Cordell


    Islamic immigration implies islamic terrorism, it doesn't matter how small the radicalised minority is. Saying this is not islamophobic, it's simply acknowledging the truth.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,010 ✭✭✭✭Cluedo Monopoly


    There were extra security checks between Rep of Ireland and the UK at airports and seaports during the Troubles. Some were quite intimidating. Those security checks were removed in the years after the Good Friday Agreement. I lived in the UK during the late 80s and early 90s. There was still a huge amount of anti-Irish feeling there. I was vehemently anti IRA at the time. Bunch of cowards.

    What are they doing in the Hyacinth house?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 8,632 ✭✭✭El Gato De Negocios


    Its not comparable at all tbh. The activities of the republican and loyalist terrorists, while absolutely reprehensible, were siloed primarily in the North of Ireland, occasionally bleeding into mainland England and the Republic. Attacks perpetrated by Muslims have occurred across multiple European countries, the US, Asia, Africa and now Australia.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 28,401 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    There were extra security arrangement between Ireland (whole island) and Great Britain. But they applied equally to everybody crossing the Irish Sea — Irish citizens, UK citizens, third country citizens. That's quite different from measures targeted at a particular ethnic or cultural group, as advocated by some in this thread.



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