Advertisement
Help Keep Boards Alive. Support us by going ad free today. See here: https://subscriptions.boards.ie/.
https://www.boards.ie/group/1878-subscribers-forum

Private Group for paid up members of Boards.ie. Join the club.
Hi all, please see this major site announcement: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058427594/boards-ie-2026

2025 Nov 01 | AI's Round 1 | Ireland v New Zealand | 20:10 GMT | VM in Ire / TNT & Discovery+ in UK

12628303132

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,502 ✭✭✭FtD v2


    You cannot credibly include a post with TRK and then "removes alot of provincial crap" - he is one of the very worst offenders for that in the Irish rugby universe; a major player in what has made the Leinster-Munster rivalry quite as toxic as it's been the last few years.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,759 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    TRK's paywalled stuff is often way more measured and insightful than is occasionally painted on here tbh, but I understand why non-Munster fans wouldn't pay for his content.

    He's Boards-marmite.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 5,518 ✭✭✭budhabob


    Ya, clearly made a error in referencing, and poorly chosen phrasing re bias.

    I was listening to him last night while travelling back and felt it very well balanced view of this specific match, that tried to avoid going down the provincial route, focussing on the comparing of metrics of Ireland v's the opposition, both this match and over the last few seasons.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,759 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    Haven't listned to it yet but will give it a spin later on, hopefully. His data-driven stuff is generally really good, imo.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,693 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    Latest Tweet from TRK

    Watching late-era Johnny Sexton being reshaped into an irreplaceable, perfect rugby player who supposedly never made mistakes during games or had dud performances to explain poor Irish performances two full years after he retired is very funny, as copes go.

    There will always be a market for this sort of thing but claiming he isn't provincially biased is one of the most wide-of-the-mark things ever posted on boards. His entire business model is whipping up provincialism to get the subs flowing.

    I'm sure he has Leinster/Ulster/Connacht equivalents but I'm not aware of any of them actually charging for their "content".



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 27,172 ✭✭✭✭phog


    The ultimate problem is that we just couldn't score

    We're left to wonder what Coombes might have contributed to a game like that.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,331 ✭✭✭OldRio


    'We're' is doing a lot of heavy lifting in that sentence.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 460 ✭✭Bart97


    So irreplaceable that his loss is the reason our forwards can’t win lineouts or their own ruck ball also!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 13,874 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    Solid takes. On TOB and our wingers generally. I wonder if we have used Hansen and Lowe to paper over our poor production in the centres for too long. We shouldn't be dependent on Hansen to have another play-maker in the back-line. At their best, our centres could offer a smashing threat, where they might get an offload away (as McCloskey was trying to do). We haven't been playing with someone who can threaten a step a clean linebreak.

    Likewise, we've prioritised play-making for our wings over pace. Watching the clip of the teenage wing from Gloucester beat the whole defense on the outside, we haven't tried to nurture that talent. Baloucoune got dropped instantly, despite playing well vs SA, before his injuries. Lowry not included in this squad. Even with TOB, we're not working to put our fast guys in space. Always expecting them to come in and find work, yet not working to find them.

    You nailed it about our attack. No invention, or deception. Very linear in its motion, and the kicks weren't bad, think they were good idea but we didn't execute.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 5,705 ✭✭✭ionadnapóca


    Good points.

    The 'kicking away' aspect was needed in the game. I actually thought it was well conceived. Like most of what Ireland did it just looked bad because of bad execution.

    I really liked to see Crowley trying the dink chip to TOB.

    Ireland need to evolve well away from the multi-multi-multi-phases and attacking kicks, chips, field position is much more effective IF its executed correctly.

    Hope Prendergast starts v Japan and he sticks with Crowley for Aus and SA.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,536 ✭✭✭Yeah_Right


    Good win and a decent performance. Happy with the result as it means I'm not getting **** from the family and colleagues 😆 And now when they bring up Chicago 2016, I can reply with Chicago 2025.

    If Jordie is out for the upcoming matches, he's a big loss. The best 12 in the world and the only real world class midfielder in the ABs. Be interesting to see what they do without him. Probably Tupaea and Leicester but I think they're both better at 13. I do like Leicester at 13.

    Saw a few comments blaming Casey for Roigard's try. I think the loosies are responsible. The SH should be pushing out like Casey was and the loosies should be covering the inside step or pass. Once Roigard cut inside Casey it was on VDF and Doris to nail him but they both got beaten on the inside. Shocking effort from the 2 of them. Also, Roigard is class.

    Didn't see a replay of the final try that was ruled out for a forward pass but I thought an Irish chaser actually touched that pass knocking it back. Didn't matter in the end.

    On the red card, harsh but correct by the letter of the law. Beirne was upright, no attempt to wrap and there was head contact. No mitigation. Didn't think there was much force so would have been happy with a yellow but I can see why it was a red based on precedent. A few people mentioned the forward pass should be considered as mitigation but has that ever happened? Don't recall seeing that in the past.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 13,874 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    Watching the highlights, Ringrose was diabolical for their 1st and 3rd try. Shooting out of position and missing the tackle, giving NZ the dogleg they needed to break the line. The 3rd try was particularly poor, just no reason to go for broke in that situation.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,759 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    Congrats YR. I didn't mention any NZ players in my earlier synopsis so…

    Thought Roigard, one sliced clearance kick aside was excellent. Leicester, I think on one of his first touches of the ball, carved us open in a way you just don't see Ringrose do. Yer bench in general were absolutely superb; credit to the 2nd rows that Scott Barrett wasn't really missed. Will Jordan pure class as well on both sides of the ball.

    (I think you've a point on Casey tbh; when you see the angle from behind, he really should've been stopped tbh).

    I suppose we're destined for Chicago 2034 to close out the trilogy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,675 ✭✭✭50HX


    Might not have to wait that long.

    The plan is we play one game in the US for the next 5 years🙄



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,759 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    Heard something like that alright (tho I thought I had heard 9 years?) and I hate the idea tbh…

    We played Italy there in 2018, so I'd imagine there'll likely be a few non-All-Black games coming up.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,711 ✭✭✭leakyboots


    I was a subscriber for a while about 6 years ago and I found him a bit too one-eyed even as a Munster fan. It's why I post here instead of MFans largely, it became an echo chamber. Funnily enough, I'm sort of finding this place a bit echo-chamber-y in recent years!

    I did enjoy his analysis when you strip away the silly forcing of nicknames and trademarks/'West Cork Mafia' nonsense. It's clever to build his brand and sell a few tshirts… best of luck to him on that front but wasn't for me at all so I unsubscribed.

    I signed back up again recently for a look and he seems to have toned that down majorly compared to what was there before. He's doing some data stuff now (presumably got from Opta) that is fascinating and is less opinion-based (or at least is informing his opinion). This is a few snippets from his Ireland analysis of the other day that jumped out (hope it's okay to paste these!).

    "In Six Nations 2025, only 34.6% of Ireland’s linebreaks became tries (France 53.3, England 50.0, Italy 36.0, Scotland 29.4, Wales 19.0). That’s lower than the average and well behind the two best finishers in the Six Nations. These metrics apply to almost every other game Ireland has played in the last 18 months, bar the win over Fiji".

    Slow rucks (6s+):
    Ireland 16% vs NZ 7% — our attack hit mud more often; theirs stayed in tempo.

    • Post-contact metres per carry: Ireland 1.83 vs NZ 2.64 — collision wins tilted field position over time.

      Linebreak Rate (per-100 rucks): Ireland 2.99 vs NZ 6.67 — NZ more than doubled the break rate, driving tries and momentum.
    • by Crowley that didn't come off. Ringrose gets blocked (he probably knows he's going to be) but Osbourne really doesn't have the acceleration/speed to get closer to the ball.
      *******************************
      My own take here on that kick is you'd back TOB/Nash (or in red Kilgallen/Abrahams) to accelerate and make the defender think more there and dive on it before the line. It makes me wonder a bit about our kick chase game when our backline is generally quite pedestrian.

      Onus on the 10 to really nail them? Less margin for error when you've chasers not having that extra gear/burst off the mark? Makes it a lot harder for us to get gains/outs when we don't have a setpiece platform/win collisions elsewhere? Look how well Munster's kick chase worked for them against Leinster when Leinster had way more of the ball but it gave us an out/platform at times.
    • ********************************
      Something he doesn't mention in his analysis (which surprised me) at all is turnovers - Lowe 3, TOB 2, Ringrose 2, JGP 2, Crowley 2 and a clatter of others on 1.

      Another is missed tackles - Ringrose with 7, Lowe with 3, Casey with 3 (in that short cameo!), Porter 2. We had 9 other players on one missed tackle. Some players put in huge shifts obviously (JvdF/Ryan… Doris made 13, Kelleher 11.. Aki only made 2).

      ABs had 3 players on 2 missed tackles and only four more on 1 missed. Huge difference between the two teams - 24 missed for us, 10 for ABs.
    • Hope all that is ringrust and we tighten things up v SA and Australia. I'm sort of trying to withhold judgment as best I can until the end of November, it is a block of games and the same players we're wondering are gone off the boil and stale might shoot the lights out the next three games. But I still think it's time to experiment a little.
    • *******************************
    • Anyway, as you said about TRK, I don't expect anyone on the blue divide to ever countenance giving him money, which is fair enough, but I find some of it is good stuff from what I've seen.
    • EDIT: no idea why those bullet points are there, sorry


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 13,874 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    That kick was unfortunate, if he'd been able to angle the ball more towards the posts, there's a better chance that Osborne can at least pressure Barrett before the try line. Could argue Ringrose was obstructed there, as TOB was in 2nd half.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 719 ✭✭✭darkened_scrum


    He mentioned this clever kick

    https://streamable.com/c8kwd9  (it's not a movie trailer!)

    by Crowley that didn't come off. Ringrose gets blocked (he probably knows he's going to be) but Osbourne really doesn't have the acceleration/speed to get closer to the ball.

    What actually happens, is Crowley overcooks it. The ball shouldn't be going anywhere near the dead ball area. Because his kicking from hand is dreadful.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,759 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    It doesn’t go anywhere near the dead ball area; it just goes over the try line.

    And therein lies the issue with your repeated criticism of Crowley’s kicking from hand. It’s not based on reality.



  • Subscribers, Paid Member Posts: 44,793 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    On that kick, it's the right decision just wrong execution.

    The chase isn't faster because the angle of the kick doesn't make it s 50/50. It's always obvious barrett can cover that ground easily and get to the ball first as the angle of the kick gives him the shortest ground to cover, and he's a quick lad.

    personally I think for that kick to work you need a blindside runner and the kick needs to be more central. However due to the really short in goal area it's a high risk kick, so the kick maybe should been sighted more undercooked so as leave the ball in field.

    In the grand scheme of things it's way way down the list of errors made by Irish players that day, and as I said the decision itself is a good one.

    Our rustiness beat us, and even at that we lead the game for 60 minutes.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 754 ✭✭✭Paterson Jerins


    Your last paragraph is correct. The ref was correct. The comments in this thread were laughable during the match and even a few afterwards. The game has been like this for years. Beirne only has himself to blame. Mitigation my arsee.

    As already mentioned in the thread, the decisions have gone for Ireland in huge games. Freddie steward red card is the obvious one, it turned the game. England had 14 for 40mins. Ireland were 10-6 up when he got the red card, Ireland win by 13 points.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,693 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    Yeah, agree. During the match I was screaming at him to keep it in hand but there’s a decent bit of space to exploit there, he just overcooks the kick by five metres. If the chasers can’t get to it, you have to keep the ball alive and not give them the easy drop-out.

    But not a grievous error at all.

    Also, the state of the microscopic in-goal area. For test rugby, really not good enough.

    Post edited by Former Former Former on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 460 ✭✭Bart97


    Interesting seeing pundits like Andy Goode, for instance, who were up in arms about Freddie’s red card in 2023 are seemingly okay with the Beirne red as it’s “letter of the law”. Its letter of the law only when it suits you right Andy ;)



  • Hosted Moderators Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭fitz


    Think @aloooof and @Yeah_Right have mostly spot on summaries from the two perspectives.

    And fully agree with @sydthebeat, our execution screwed us and was the reason we didn't convert the opportunities we did create into points, and the 20 minutes of the red card really told from the 60 minute mark.

    Lineout continues to be the biggest concern, tbh.

    Would like to see some rotation for Japan. I would say stick with Crowley at 10 to start, but bring Sam on for 30 minutes. Would also like to see JOB at full back so we can bring Osbourne in at 13. Ringrose doesn't look fully right.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,331 ✭✭✭OldRio




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 754 ✭✭✭Paterson Jerins


    Thats right matt, that's right. Just a reminder for crazy Irish fans that called it a "Disgrace"

    Refs were correct both times.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,436 ✭✭✭almostover


    The very same day he was doing his thing in a red jersey burrowing over from close quarters in an exhibition game against an Argentina XV. His ability to score in close quarters in unparalleled in the Irish game. He made some super carries in that game too and made one line break that lead to a Munster try. Has to be taken in the context of the opposition but he does this too in CC games. Surely he is worth a go in the no.19/20 jersey in this AI series? Baird is ahead of him for the no.6 shirt and he was one of the few to emerge from Saturday's game with credit. But what does having Henderson on the bench achieve? Why not Coombes? Can play 4, 6 and 8 and Baird can also play at 4, we have the cover. Especially now with Izzy being injured it's the perfect chance to see what Gav can offer in a green jersey.

    On another note, Jack Conan will be 35 by the time the next WC comes around. Should we not be developing an alternative backup plan to Caelan Doris? Coombes is only 27, therefore, 29 for the WC, i.e. in his prime. Gleeson is a longer term alternative again to that.

    I fully understand that pigs have a greater chance of flying than the above happening however. There's something a miss between Andy and Coombes and he just won't pick him.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 460 ✭✭Bart97


    That’s not my point though, my issue is how come one is “letter of the law” while the other is a disgrace?



  • Subscribers, Paid Member Posts: 44,793 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    well maybe enough time has passed now, and Coombes has been given enough chances in camps…. the question should no longer be outwardly "why not coombes" but actually be inwardly "why not coombes".

    what has he done, or not done, when in camp thats has stopped him from forcing his way into test sides?

    you can hardly blame coaches for being biased when his lineout coach is an ex munster man, his scrum coach is an ex munster man, his attack coach is a kiwi, his defense coach is welsh (FAIAP) and his head coach is an english northerner.

    is the issue everyone else, or is it coombes himself?



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 5,518 ✭✭✭budhabob




This discussion has been closed.
Advertisement
Advertisement