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Israel/Palestine Thread

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 296 ✭✭Will0483


    Oh sorry, they were just murdering a mere 14,348 per day on average at the worst of the holocaust. So would have matched the entire Gazan death toll in less than a week at that rate. 100 per cent of those murdered in the holocaust would have been by definition non-combatants.

    At least some of the Gazan dead would have been active members of Hamas so legitimate targets under any legal scenario.

    I stand by my point than comparing Israel to the Nazis is lazy and morally bankrupt thinking that undermines support for the Palestinian cause.

    In August, September and October of 1942, he calculated, German forces and their allies in Poland killed at least 1.32 million Jews. That averages out to 14,348 per day, every day. Virtually all victims were from Poland and its immediate neighbors.



  • Moderators, Arts Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 11,242 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hellrazer


    At least some of the Gazan dead would have been active members of Hamas so legitimate targets under any legal scenario.

    Legal scenario my bollox!!!

    Is it ok to kill a whole family of multiple generations to kill 1 hamas member?

    Is it ok to target kids and women to kill one Hamas member?

    Is it ok to target hospitals to kill one Hamas member?

    Thats a disgraceful post - And anyone defending Israel should be ashamed of themselves.

    Ive already posted (post 51996) that according Israels own figures Hamas has been eliminated - oh yeah and then they changed the figures to suit their narrative by suddenly revising the number upwards. They dont even know how many Hamas members are left yet they will still kill and starve civilians in order to "get" that last militant - this could go on for years if they dont know how many are left under the guise of trying to "wipe out Hamas"

    Answer this question - Are Israel committing genocide??



  • Moderators, Arts Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 11,242 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hellrazer


    Id be of that opinion that the Israeli state should have been located elsewhere - not in the middle of a bunch of Arab countries - I think Alaska was one of the options - maybe they could have genocided a few bears and moose - the world would be a much better place without them in the middle east.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,132 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    Don’t accuse others of being historically ignorant and inaccurate while exaggerating by a factor of 4 to try to make a point.

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,487 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    FIFA won't be able to leave Israel in a position to qualify if they cannot play European qualifying matches. The idea of a country who was banned by UEFA being in the mix to qualify for a World Cup would be preposterous.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,448 ✭✭✭Cordell


    Why not here in Ireland? Move all the jews here and move all the Irish people to Alaska. If you're so quick to deny people the right to live on their ancestral lands see how well you would take it when it's your turn.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 56,689 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover




  • Moderators, Arts Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 11,242 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hellrazer


    But how far back do you need to go to prove that its their "ancestral" lands - maybe we can dig up a few Neanderthals with a claim to the land as well.

    Neanderthal sites in Israel include the caves of Amud, Tabun, Kebara, and Tinshemet. These sites, primarily located in the Mount Carmel region and Galilee, provide crucial evidence of Neanderthal presence, tool use, intentional burials, and the coexistence and possible interbreeding with Homo Sapiens in the region during the Paleolithic.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 321 ✭✭dannyo666


    If Netanyahu could wipe out all Palestinians this way in a secretive manner do you think he would?If media,press etc was like it was in 1933?And any Palestinian who's still alive after/if all this ends will also be considered a holocaust survivor……



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,591 ✭✭✭✭TheValeyard


    Love to see it

    Fcuk the genocide supporters.

    Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit sniffing glue



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 321 ✭✭dannyo666


    PR recycled rubbish from him….Losing the PR war now and panicking with his QR code on his jacket-Great to know Israel is fighting our fight though-Zionists like him were always looking out for others plus good to know Israel never attacks Civilians in Gaza…..Move along-Nothing to see here



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,379 ✭✭✭Spudmonkey


    To be fair to Grayson, I would say he/she are neither of those. From their posting history it would not be accurate to describe them as such. I'd also say that we (as in those alive at this point) also have a tendency towards hyperbole, ego abound when wanting to say we were alive at the worst/best time in history.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,210 ✭✭✭Joe1919


    Netanyahu speech was on rte tv news channel today while I was having my lunch so I heard it all. I am inclined to think that there is two sides to every story, so I was glad to hear his side.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,448 ✭✭✭Cordell




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 1,622 ✭✭✭Gerry T


    Look at what he does, not what he says.

    Israel is defending itself = Israel entering another country killing and occupying new territory for Israel.

    Israel helping aid getting into Palestine = Israel blocking all aid and attacking food flotillas.

    Israel are targeting Hamas = Israel shoot anyone on site, once they can move.

    Israel just wants to live in peace beside the savages = Israel warmongering with all its neighbours.



  • Moderators, Arts Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 11,242 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hellrazer


    Do you mean the Jews or the Neanderthals?

    Do the Palestinians not have as equal a right to the land as either of the above??

    In my opinion they absolutely do.

    Edit - Was editing while you must have been replying.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,448 ✭✭✭Cordell


    That right doesn't come automatically, many times that right has to be fought and defended. And the fight doesn't have to be fair and equal.



  • Moderators, Arts Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 11,242 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hellrazer


    So in your opinion civilians being starved and Genocided makes it all ok then.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,555 ✭✭✭Yeah_Right


    No offense intended here. Your response to that post comes across as bit over the top and unreasonable. I thought the other poster was making a solid point that equating what is happening in Gaza with the Holocaust is hyperbolic and actually undermines the cause.

    That is in no way saying that it isn't horrible or defending Israel's actions. It's simply pointing out that they're not at the same level from a numbers point of view. The Nazis industrialised slaughter. The only comparable situations I can think of are Stalin in the USSR, Japan in China, the Cultural Revolution under Mao and PolPot in Cambodia. I don't know enough about them to discuss them in detail but from the numbers I've read in the past, they could be comparable to the Holocaust.

    Once again I'm not justifying Israel's actions or trying to diminish what is happening to the Palestinians. I simply think it's important to keep things realistic or you risk pushing away potential supporters.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,132 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    What really convinced me was when Netenyahu said how could Israel be committing genocide. They are moving people. Who ever heard of someone committing genocide moving people.

    He actually said that. Maybe he has forgotten a lot of history too.

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



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  • Subscribers, Paid Member Posts: 44,865 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    the israeli army are an occupying force in palestine.

    when you understand that you see that everything that comes from netanyahus mouth is lies.



  • Moderators, Arts Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 11,242 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hellrazer


    No offense intended here. Your response to that post comes across as bit over the top and unreasonable. I thought the other poster was making a solid point that equating what is happening in Gaza with the Holocaust is hyperbolic and actually undermines the cause

    I dont think my post came across as unreasonable. That other poster was taking about genocide in sheer numbers. Thats not what the definition of genocide is.

    That is in no way saying that it isn't horrible or defending Israel's actions. It's simply pointing out that they're not at the same level from a numbers point of view.

    And again Ill point out that the very definition of Genocide as agreed by the UN does not include a numerical amount of people to have been killed to consider it genocide.

    Its already been proven that Israel is committing genocide by multiple agencies including the UN as defined by the UN - 1948 Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide.

    Whether Israel is killing 14,000 a day or 30 a day its irrelevant - its still genocide.

    Look at the Bosnian war - The numbers killed were way less than whats happening in Gaza yet thats classed a a genocide.

    Israeli supporters cant suddenly decide on what is and what isnt a genocide because the numbers dont match WW2.

    And for the record Israel signed the "1948 Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide" in 1950

    They cant now suddenly say that they arent "committing genocide" because it suits them.

    They should have looked at the rules of engagement and the article in question and checked to see if their indiscriminate bombing of civilians broke that convention and would amount to "genocide" and amended their attacks to fall within international laws ie not bombing hospitals, starving children , not moving mass numbers to "camps" and then bombing those camps.

    Theres no excuse for what Israel is doing - none whatsoever and anyone that supports them should be ashamed of themselves.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,132 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    He even claimed that babies were burned alive in front of their parents on October 7th.
    A lie.
    Mike Huckabee, US Zionist ambassador to Israel claimed in a recent interview all the usual debunked claims about October 7th, decapitated babies, babies in ovens, mass rapes, babies cut from wombs. He also made up an entirely knew one. People in wheelchairs set on fire!

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,487 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    The idea that genocide can only involve gas chambers and Einsatzgruppen death squads is an entirely bogus one. The Holocaust was extremely unusual in going for an industrialised form of mass killings : most genocides don't resemble it at all.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,566 ✭✭✭✭nacho libre


    As I am sure you would be if Vladimir was speaking at the UN since you are so interested in hearing both sides. You probably were keen to hear what Mladic and Slobodan had to say too back in the day.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,379 ✭✭✭Spudmonkey


    One of Occupied Palestine's biggest exports are machines of death. To say they haven't industrialised murder would be an understatement.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,566 ✭✭✭✭nacho libre


    Are you talking about the Piers Morgan interview? Talk about a softball interview.

    A charitable interpretation would be Piers didn't do his research, however the more plausible explanation is that Piers is afraid he will lose access if he challenges members of his friend's administration.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,132 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    It was the Times of Israel but he has repeated it on CBS and other places.

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,336 ✭✭✭brickster69


    Sounds like the rumours about these evil ***** getting together to complete their plan was not far from the truth after all.

    The old world is dying, and the new world struggles to be born: now is the time of monsters. — Antonio Gramsci



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,210 ✭✭✭Joe1919


    I would indeed. I think its always good to hear both sides in any dispute rather than depend on second hand opinions. Its a sort of principle of natural justice that that no one should be condemned unheard.



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