Munster Team Talk Thread - Beirne After Reading

Gonna have to dig out some old copies to read that and I see MCmillan has said he feels we are light in a few positions. Well that's the headline anyway

I don’t think the comments about Rowntree are particularly surprising, it was well publicised that he’d completely fallen out with the senior players. Maybe the question is why/how he got the job in the first place.

It’s interesting to Murray talking about the signings being rubbish, you don’t often hear players talking about other players like that, even if he doesn’t name anyone specific.

As a leinster man , it really grinds your gears that we won the URC. “Not particularly good the season they won”, “basically put together an excellent run” & “winning in spite of their coach”

With the same coach We placed 1st the following season, but is that “not particularly good ” or “winning in spite of their coach”. ?

At least you’re consistent .

Maybe the question is why/how he got the job in the first place

Not quite sure I buy that line of questioning. Rowntree wasn't parachuted in out of nowhere as head coach - he had been with Munster for the previous three years under JVG and clearly had built a reputation as a great forwards coach.

I have no doubt that Rowntree's straight talking rubbed some players the wrong way - that sounds in character - and I'd also agree that not all great positional coaches make great head coaches - but nobody at the time questioned the Rowntree appointment. Ultimately, he won a URC - so it was hardly a poor coaching appointment regardless of how it finished.

I honestly believe Wig was in the wrong place at the wrong time - a team with some of its ageing greats phasing out, that's always going to cause a bit of grief.

Totally agree with this with regards the Rowntree appointment. Munster were actually getting criticism at the time for taking to long to make the appointment, but there wasn't a Munster fan I knew who was disappointed when he got the job. This is spot on, imo:

Ultimately, he won a URC - so it was hardly a poor coaching appointment regardless of how it finished.

Fwiw, I think Murray's criticism of the coaching turnover is misplaced as well tbh. Penney was offered a 3rd season (heavily rumoured he wanted 2 years). Rassie left, exercising a cause in his contract for his dream job. I think JVG was our 2nd longest ever serving coach? And what happened with Axel…

Ironically, the Rowntree appoint was at least trying to bring some continuity, appointing from within.

Not quite sure I buy that line of questioning. 

Again, and this is absolutely critical, it's not my line of questioning.

This is Conor Murray who, by my count, played under seven Munster head coaches, plus Joe Schmidt, Andy Farrell and Warren Gatland:

"I didn't rate him at all and in his last season, even the more younger, innocent players were starting to see through him. Personally, I didn't see a lot of rugby knowledge there".

That’s pretty damning, no matter how you slice it.

but nobody at the time questioned the Rowntree appointment

I'm not sure about that either. There was a lot of chat about other candidates and the end result seemed to be that Rowntree was the only one interested rather than the best man for the job. Considering they lost Larkham and JVG in the space of a month, it was odd that they took four months to lock Rowntree down as head coach.

Well if he's criticising some of the signings and their performances he might want to look closer to home and be honest about some of the munster stalwarts performances. In the later stages of his career before JGP took over i thought murray's performances for munster were not on a par with his ireland performances

The "I didn't see a lot of rugby knowledge there" comment is especially interesting given Rowntree was an internal appointment/promotion. He'd already done ~3 seasons as forwards coach before taking over the top job. He was a known quantity at Munster, his rugby knowledge (or lack thereof) should have been very evident when they gave him the role.

Are you trying to argue his "rugby knowledge (or lack thereof) being evident before they gave him the role" means he was a poor appointment?

There isn't a Munster fan I know who at the time, or in retrospect, thinks it was a poor appointment (even given how it ended up). His results back that up.