Israel/Palestine Thread

I had a long post ready to go in response to this drivel, but do you know what, it's not worth my time. Funny you just pop up when others of your ilk are put on their holidays. You'll probably disappear for a while when they reappear so there's actually no point in engaging.

First of all, I do think Israel has a right to exist. I understand why the state was set up. I think a nice chunk of Germany would have been more justified, but it is what it is. I just don't think there is an argument that the safety of Israeli people in their state trump the safety of Palestinians in theirs.

But this...

Equally dishonest is claiming that Palestinians are the 'Natives' to the area while ignoring that Jews have been established in the region for millenia. 

...is nonsense. Yes, there have been Jews there for millenia, but people are either native or they aren't. Some Palestinians were/are Jews, correct? Many are Muslims. Some are Christian. They are the natives.

But even being a Palestinian/ Native Israeli Jew does NOT give one a right to steal land and attack their fellow natives because they are Muslim. It doesn't give them a right to say they are better, because they are a different religion. Imo, that is supremacism.

I think we can all agree there haven't been Americans there for millenia. Or Polish. Or Iraqi. Or Russian. Or British. And on and on.

Because alot of these people have those nationalities, and you (I think) are arguing that it is fine for people from these countries to trump the actual native people - aka the Palestinians (well, just the Muslim ones), as regardless of nationality or ethnicity they share a religion with people who have lived there in some form or other for millenia?

I think we can also agree that, if you and I are Irish Catholics today, and decide to change to Judaism, our ancestors are still the same as they were before. We don't suddenly get retconned to be descendants from the tribes of Israel.

Incidentally, many Gazans are descendents of the early Jews. Should they have less rights to their land, because their great great grandad decided to change to Islam, than some lad from Oregon whose great great grandad converted to Judaism? Or even some lad from Oregon who traces a genuine lineage back to when Jewish people were expelled by the Romans? That is a wild argument to me.

I watched a video linked above, where an elderly man from the West bank was shot by settlers trying to get him off his land. He was shouting "I am from here! My uncle has a farm down the road! My grandfather farmed here! Who are these people? Where are they from?" (Referring to the settlers who attacked him).

Is he being antisemetic in your opinion?

Palestinians have more right to be on that land than any Jew from America or Europe.

I don't believe that is what the quote you mentioned was saying though. It said some in Hamas are cut throats and fighters, yet some are involved in building hospitals, civic administration, and the normal social activities of being in government. This is true, and important to remember. Saying all employed by "Hamas" are responsible does, in theory, make targets out of doctors and schoolteachers, a very dangerous argument to make.

If Israel are found guilty of genocide, I hope your lack of plausible deniability on crimes quote doesn't play out. Personally, I would blame the Israeli government and military for these crimes and hope they are strung up by the balls for it, though I doubt it will happen. Regardless of who voted for them, they are the ones who made the bloody decisions they made. They are the ones who carried it out. Much like the Hamas politicians and combatants.

The Israeli doctors, teachers, nurses, police, civil servants, civic leaders etc etc, not so much.