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Northern Ireland 2125?

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 690 ✭✭✭michael-henry-mcivor


    All should be charged with hate crimes-

    U are right to call out those who don't put the law first-



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,789 ✭✭✭Francis McM


    Do you condemn paramilitaries / all those who acted outside the law during the troubles? Surely bombing and murdering and kidnapping people / disappearing them was more serious?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,789 ✭✭✭Francis McM


    What is a sectarian bonfire? Would you define all bonfires as being toxic if they burn wood, in which case you would have no problem condemning bonfires in Ireland, Canada, Spain, Norway etc?

    Personally, I think in N.I. there should be a size restraint somehow on bonfires, say 8 meters or something. And I do not agree with putting political symbols or flags on bonfires. That would be common sense if you ask me.

    What amazes me is how vocal and condemning you are about bonfires, most of which have no flags / political symbols, but yet you cannot bring yourself to condemn the pIRA and INLA? You are like your party colleague Gerry Adams, not in to the politics of condemnation. Until it comes to bonfires of course.

    I condemn the paramilitaries and the law breakers on all sides, you refuse to. Says it all.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 81,290 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Again you avoid answering.

    I condemn all the violence FROM THE START. Do you? Yes or No?

    I don't compartmentalise that like some do or the toxic bonfire 'culture'. I condemn ALL of them.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,789 ✭✭✭Francis McM


    LOL.LOL. There you go again. I have seen you at that before, like Gerry Adams. You condemn the UDA, UVF, British army, police etc because they engaged in violence but you refused to condemn the pIRA because they were engaged in war, not violence, says you.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 81,290 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    I condemn ALL of the violence and do not compartmentalise. + I have never made this comment

    '

    because they were engaged in war, not violence,


    Your entire agenda is to give cover to one side.

    You can't condemn all toxic bonfires or all of the violence.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,789 ✭✭✭Francis McM


    Do you connsider the pIRA "armed struggle" eg Bloody Friday bombings, Enniskillen bombing, Le Mons, Warrington, Brighton bombing etc as "violence"? Yes or no?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 81,290 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    A wonderful example of positive cultural expression local to me, in a border village. Utilising the environment rather than harming it.

    I was out at it last night, my children are involved in organising it and heard some wonderful music performed by musicians from the Protestant faith and culture on both sides of the border, Unionists among them. A great inclusive event for the whole community to enjoy.

    image.png


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 81,290 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    If you can't understand what ALL violence means that is your problem. You seem to have a few with questions.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,789 ✭✭✭Francis McM


    Please stop dodging the question yet again.

    Do you consider the pIRA "armed struggle" eg Bloody Friday bombings, Enniskillen bombing, Le Mons, Warrington, Brighton bombing etc as "violence"? Yes or no?

    Like Gerry Adams, you have never condemned the pIRA. It is only the other side than engaged in violence, says you. Last time, do you consider the pIRA armed struggle as "violence"?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 81,290 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    When you answer the questions you have been asked then you get to ask others.

    1. Do you condemn all bonfires that are toxic and sectarian and if they think they should be demolished and the organisers charged with hate crimes.

    2. I condemn all the violence FROM THE START. Do you? Yes or No?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,789 ✭✭✭Francis McM


    I have been quite clear I would condemn anything thiat is toxic or sectarian, and that includes any bonfires that are toxic or sectarian. I also condemn all violence. That includes all pIRA actions, including (but not limited to) Bloody Friday bombings, Enniskillen bombing, Le Mons, Warrington, Brighton bombing etc. Do YOU consider the pIRA "armed struggle" eg Bloody Friday bombings, Enniskillen bombing, Le Mons, Warrington, Brighton bombing etc as "violence" and therefore condemn it? Yes or no?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 81,290 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    I have been quite clear I would condemn anything thiat is toxic or sectarian, and that includes any bonfires that are toxic or sectarian. I also condemn all violence. 

    So what is the problem?
    I have condemned all the violence and all the toxic and sectarian bonfires.

    I am not getting into your shopping list of condemning individual acts of violence. I condemn them all, they should never have happened from the start. End of.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,789 ✭✭✭Francis McM


    The problem is you never ( and still will not) condemn the paramilitaries on both sides. Only on one side. The other side of course. you will not condemn the pIRA or INLA. They engaged in war, says you, not violence.

    You are like a Muslim extremist who will not condemn the 9/11 attack in America on the Pentagon and Twin towers. That was part of a war against the USA, says extremists, and so they justify it. Ask Muslim extremists if they justify the twin towers and they will say there was "no alternative". There was open dancing in the streets in Gaza after the twin towners collapsed.

    You are like other SF comrades, you will not condemn the Bloody Friday bombings, Enniskillen bombing, Le Mons, Warrington, Brighton bombing etc. Like Michelle O'Neill you think there was "no alternative".

    How could anyone trust SF in govt when you are so dis-honest, when you have the gall to say you condemn all violence but you will not condemn the Bloody Friday bombings, Enniskillen bombing, Le Mons, Warrington, Brighton bombing etc. Not only that, there was no alternative, says a N.I. leader of your party.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 81,290 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Ok, I will itemise who I mean, and that is the end of it.

    1 The British Army

    2 The Security forces in ALL their guises during the conflict/war
    3 Paramilitaries

    4 The Irish security forces
    5 Any lone individual or group who used violence.


    All of the above used violence.

    I am not and never was a member of any of the groups above nor of SF. nor never will be.
    If you have issue with SF on these matters, take it up with them and certainly don't vote for them.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,983 ✭✭✭csirl


    Pages and pages about bonfires?

    Those of you up the north will be glad to find out that bonfires arent a thing in the rest of Ireland. We dont do them. Even halloween bonfires have been largely phased out for H&S reasons.

    So, in 2125 we'll have no arguments or tensions over bonfires.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 81,290 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    The ridiculous push 'look at us' upwards will reach a tipping point (excuse the pun) and authorities will be forced to do their jobs. Jobs they are frankly afraid to do.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,789 ✭✭✭Francis McM


    But you will not condemn the Bloody Friday bombings, Enniskillen bombing, Le Mons, Warrington, Brighton bombing etc.  You may not be a member of SF but you did vote for them and have tens of thousands of posts aligned with and arguing for their position. As is your right of course. Anyway, no point in arguing with someone who will not condemn pIRA atrocities. Have a good weekend, pity you never condemned the armed struggle etc.

    I have seen hundreds of bonfires here in Ireland (south of the border), including up to and including this year. Around the skyline you see the plumes of smoke. Midsummer bonfires are traditionally lit on the eve of St. John the Baptist's feast day, June 23rd, also known as St. John's Eve or Bonfire Night. These bonfires are a continuation of ancient Celtic traditions celebrating the summer solstice, with fire believed to hold symbolic power for banishing evil spirits and promoting a good harvest. Celebrations often involve music, dancing, and young people jumping over the flames for luck. 



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 81,290 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    While gathering around a community bonfire was a chief part of St John’s Eve well into living memory, the custom has become unknown in some regions.

    That is also known as 'dying out',

    I am going to be honest here, I never heard of the tradition until now, so not a thing in this area.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 690 ✭✭✭michael-henry-mcivor


    Do U condemn the brit army who acted outside the law during bloody Sunday etc-

    The Provos were fighting for Ireland- the brit army wasn't fighting for Ireland -

    Now the peace-process is working - and the Crown oath was removed from the PSNI / courts- removal of Special branch etc -then that can be accepted-

    Plus the police no longer patrol with the brit army like they did in the past-

    Its all coming along nicely-



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,219 ✭✭✭itsacoolday


    The security forces on both sides of the border were fighting for peace in Ireland, an objective they eventually reached because they got the para-militaries to disarm / surrender or destroy their weapons and semtex etc.

    You cannot say the pIRA was fighting for peace by blowing up bombs like on Bloody Friday in Belfast , Enniskillen bombing, Le Mons, Warrington, Birmingham etc. The pIRA also killed some Irish army and Gardai, now how did that achieve piece?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 690 ✭✭✭michael-henry-mcivor


    U forgot to condemn the foreign brit para for murdering Irish people on bloody Sunday etc- how was that security for the Irish-

    The brit never got a IRA bullet or ounce handed over to them-

    Weapons were stripped so the inspectors could see they could not be used at that time of the inspection-

    The UFF LVF handed Weapons over to the police as part of their decommissioning-

    The armed brit army no longer patrol in the six counties- the armed brit helicopters have been removed- special branch was removed-

    The Crown oath was removed from the police / Court's

    Tpeace-process works-



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 12,424 ✭✭✭✭downcow


    the burning of bonfires is a huge tradition in unionist communities. I sincerely hope it continues. We would have lost something very special if it disappeared.
    these have been transformed over past 20 years. They are now exclusively wooden structures (and yes of course you will find some outliers that are moving a bit slower.
    bonfire collecting has began for 2026, but will get underway for 1000s of young people next spring.
    my focus would be on those with the biggest carbon footprints, which are not these communities.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 12,424 ✭✭✭✭downcow


    haha francie is now going to decide which bits of unionist culture are acceptable. You really couldn’t make it up.
    patronising nonsense



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 81,290 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    I didn’t decide anything. Just showed an example of folk utilising nature rather than destroying it.

    It used to be acceptable to burn those suspected of being witches, That died out and people managed just fine. Same will happen with pointless ever higher pyres.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 12,424 ✭✭✭✭downcow


    Anyhow, moving on from the (off-thread) republican facination with our bonfires.


    I think we have concluded that there is not a single person on this thread who is stating that, in the hypothetical outcome of a positive UI poll, that there cannot be a devolved NI within a United Ireland.
    so even the most optimistic old romantic republicans on here, are accepting that OWC can continue, just with different people writing the cheques in a different currency.

    what is there not to like - we keep OWC and you guys get shifting some of those USA billions that are taking up space in your bank vaults.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 266 ✭✭walkonby


    Argentinians bristle at the use of “American” to mean someone from the US. To them, an American (Americano) is someone from the Americas. So if you’re talking to Argentinians you may be pulled up if you use American like that. Estadounidense is their word for people from the US; that doesn’t translate well to English but you can use US nationals to mean people from there. But yeah feel free to call Argentinans American.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 12,424 ✭✭✭✭downcow


    I have an Argentinian friend and quite a few Colombian friends. I’ll check this out. I don’t think they would be happy to be referred to by the name of their island. But I will be honest about their response

    ….and of course Argentinians are much more positive about their colonisers than the rest of South America



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 81,290 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Now you might tell us how you plan to convince a majority (who have just voted to leave the UK) to re-partition Ireland?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,195 ✭✭✭✭blanch152




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