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Donald Trump the Megathread part II

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Comments

  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,118 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manic Moran


    In fairness, that’s a fairly lousy response. At the time of the Founding, such things were the sole purview of the States, not the Federal Constitution (That change only came about with the 14th Amendment). Had he lived in, say, the Federal capital city (Philadelphia) in 1776, the operative Constitutional protection was “That the people have a right to bear arms for the defence of themselves and the state” (Article 1, Declaration XIII at the time)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 27,954 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    In even more fairness, it's still a good response to the Maga-head who claims to obey the US constitution as originally written. The Pennsylvania Constitution of 1776 isn't part of the US Constituion as origionally written, so if we take the MAGA-head at his word he would disregard it.

    Which makes sense: the Pennsylvania Declaration of Rights also points out that "a frequent recurrence to fundamental principles, and a firm adherence to justice, moderation, temperance, industry, and frugality are absolutely necessary to preserve the blessings of liberty, and keep a government free: The people ought therefore to pay particular attention to these points in the choice of officers and representatives". This is clearly not a document that a Trump supporter will embrace.

    Plus, given what I gather is your own situation, I wouldn't be drawing too much attention to the Pennsylvania Declaration of Rights since, as well as affirming that the people have a right to bear arms, it also affirms that since standing armies "are dangerous to liberty, they ought not to be kept up". 😉



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,118 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manic Moran


    Fear not! I’m technically in the militia (Two of them, actually).

    I don’t agree with your logic, though. Given that in 1776 the federal Constitution did not apply to the states, then the logical method of following the US Constitution as originally written is to leave the matter to State jurisdiction. Had the federal government in the absence of the Bill of Rights attempted to limit the state militias, the US would likely have had its first constitutional crisis right out the door… at a time that the States had almost all the guns!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 27,954 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    Well, there's nothing magic (in this context) about the year 1776. The US constitution was approved by the Constitutional Convention in 1787, and came into force in 1789 when enough states had ratified it. Somebody who says that he only obeys the US constitution as orginally written is not claiming any status for instruments that precede the US Constitution. Logically, since they are not "the US Constitution as originally written", the implication of his claim is that he doesn't obey them.

    If we ignore logic, and try to imply an acceptance of preceding instruments, the obvious candidate is not the Constitution of Pennsylvania, or the constitution of any other-arbitrarily selected state, but the Articles of Confederation, which regulated the powers and functions of the US government institutions. and the rights and responsiblities of the States, before 1789.

    Had the federal government in the absence of the Bill of Rights attempted to limit the state militias, the US would likely have had its first constitutional crisis right out the door… at a time that the States had almost all the guns!

    Not so sure about this. The Articles of Confederation required each state to "always keep up a well regulated and disciplined militia, sufficiently armed and accoutred" and to "provide and constantly have ready for use, in public stores, a due number of field pieces and tents, and a proper quantity of arms, ammunition, and camp equipage". So presumably there would have been a basis there for the feds to take steps if a state failed to maintain a militia or (more likely) if the militia wasn't properly regulated, properly disciplined (which in this context I think includes properly trained) or properly equipped and supplied.

    And there's more! Apart from the militias, the states were not to keep up any body of forces, except "such number only as, in the judgment of the united states, in congress assembled, shall be deemed requisite to garrison the forts necessary for the defence of such state". The Articles go on to say that states must not engage in war without the authority of Congress, and must not maintain a navy. There are limited exceptions for necessary self-defence operations in cases of urgency. They also say that officers under the rank of colonel are to be appointed by state legislatures, the implication being, I think, that the apointment of more senior officers was to be controlled by the feds.

    In other words, there's a lot in the Articles about state militias, and about what the states must do, may do or may not do with regard to militias, and with regard to defence in general. And therefore there was an abundant architecture of legal provisions that the US authorities could invoke to justify attempts to control, limit, direct, etc what the states were or weren't doing in regard to these matters.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 36,196 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    Ghislaine Maxwell appealing to the Supreme Court, claiming a previous plea deal by Epstein was also supposed to cover co-conspirators and therefore she shouldn't have been prosecuted. I think she appealed on it before, but now appealing to the Supreme Court.

    A Supreme Court… which heavily favours Donald Trump… days after meeting with Trump's DoJ… which if the SCOTUS agree with her would see Maxwell's convictions overturned and her released without the need for Trump to pardon her directly…



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,150 ✭✭✭✭Oscar_Madison
    #MEGA MAKE EUROPE GREAT AGAIN



    “which if the SCOTUS agree with her would see Maxwell's convictions overturned and her released without the need for Trump to pardon her directly”

    Funny when I read about that in a newspaper article yesterday, I thought the exact same thing- you’d wonder if this is a joint effort behind the scenes but ensuring Trump is seen not to interfere .



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 36,196 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    I'm sure Roberts, Thomas and the other Trump-judges will have some compelling argument that the Founding Fathers never intended for paedophile sex-traffickers to stay in prison in cases where that becomes a distraction for the sitting President in their duties, and therefore she should be released.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,150 ✭✭✭✭Oscar_Madison
    #MEGA MAKE EUROPE GREAT AGAIN




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,515 ✭✭✭thatsdaft


    I wouldn’t even joke about it

    I can totally see these “judges” make the case that because some of the founding farthers bought and sold people of which some were children that child trafficking is a totally constitutionally cool thing to do.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,113 ✭✭✭Patrick2010


    Didn't that agreement just apply to Florida whereas she was tried in New York?. And what kind of moron even suggested that plea deal that would allow sex traffickers to escape justice?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 36,196 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    The kind of moron who even suggested that plea deal was Alex Acosta, who then served as Secretary for Labor in Trump's first term, and is now on the Board of Directors for Newsmax. It was also negotiated by Alan Dershowitz, Epstein's lawyer, who has also been accused of having sex with women procured by Epstein (and has also argued several times himself as a lawyer that the age of consent should be lowered), and was also Trump's lawyer in one of the impeachment cases during his first term.

    Basically, SCOTUS freeing Maxwell would just be par for the course in what is one of the most f*cked up situations involving numerous powerful parties and individuals to cover up for paedophile sex trafficking. It's why it wouldn't be at all surprising if SCOTUS finds in her favour.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,564 ✭✭✭Lewis_Benson


    Windmills….

    The last windmills, as traditionally defined, were primarily built in the early 20th century, with a few exceptions like De Zwaan, which was moved to the US in 1964.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,142 ✭✭✭threeball


    Could be the straw that breaks the camels back. I think you'd see a massive split in MAGA if Maxwell is released. Amazing that the only thing that would convince them Trump was one of the powerful elites moving in the same circles as others they hate was the Epstein thing.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,036 ✭✭✭TinyMuffin


    he’s released the list 👍


    IMG_1523.jpeg


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,167 ✭✭✭scottser


    Thomas Jefferson was shagging one of his slaves when she was 14 and eventually had 4 kids with her. Grover Cleveland raped a woman and when she had his child he threw he put her in a mental home and his kid into an orphanage. He then groomed a child to be his wife. Warren Harding had an illegitimate child while he was president. LBJ was a notorious womaniser, adulterer and cock show-off. Kennedy was a sex addict. Gerald Ford shagged a spy and Hoover blackmailed him over it. GW Bush had both gay and straight prostitutes at the WH 24/7. To say that the office of the POTUS has prior form is a massive understatement and throughout the history of the office, the courts were always conspicuously silent on these matters.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,321 ✭✭✭spakman


    George Dubbya had gay prostitutes to the White House!? Surely even the POTUS would think that's a bit risky!?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,505 ✭✭✭✭everlast75


    Questions have been asked as to why, when the Dems were in power, did they not release the epstein files.

    Conspiracy theories, valid or otherwise aside, the plea reached with Epstein precluded the prosecution of anyone associated with his crimes. This was an absolutely wild term to agree with by Acosta, as was not his not consulting with the victims when signing the agreement.

    If those people cannot be prosecuted, they cannot be tried and therefore, if they are innocent, clear their name.

    On that basis, it makes sense not to release the information.

    That said, when your campaign was based on riling up your base to believe that there was information that could and needed to come out, then it is a case of tough sh1t when you're being chased for them.

    Elect a clown... Expect a circus



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,167 ✭✭✭scottser




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 2,818 ✭✭✭nachouser


    In the fact sheet published today by the US, it is stated; “As part of President Trump’s strategy to establish balanced trade, the European Union will pay the United States a tariff rate of 15cp, including on autos and auto parts, pharmaceuticals, and semiconductors.

    The sectoral tariffs on steel, aluminum, and copper will remain unchanged, with the EU continuing to pay 50pc."

    Eh, no.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 436 ✭✭Starfire20


    "Questions have been asked as to why, when the Dems were in power, did they not release the epstein files."

    because Bill Clinton was a frequent flyer on the lolita express.

    and because there are probably other dems/dem donors on the list too.

    everyone on that list should face justice regardless of affiliation.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,290 ✭✭✭Yeah_Right


    Never heard about GW Bush and the prostitutes at the White House. Got any more info on that? I know he was a coke fiend in his younger days.

    Also you forgot serial philanderer Clinton.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,332 ✭✭✭amandstu


    Is the EU reducing tariffs on some US goods ? (as I think I saw in that Independent article)

    I understand that theUS has to meet the same standards as before but I didn't know that the actual tariffs were being reduced.

    Is there still a "Boycott America" campaign in place ?Il I s there a website to go that lists the American goods that we can replace with goods from elsewhere?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,505 ✭✭✭✭everlast75


    Elect a clown... Expect a circus



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,716 ✭✭✭10000maniacs


    Bush wasn't involved.

    There were stories of some of Reagan's and GW Bush's staff who were allegedly doing things on the grounds of the WH, but not the presidents themselves.

    It's a story that withered away to the ether because it was a non story.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,269 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    I think you'd see a massive split in MAGA if Maxwell is released.

    I wouldn't be so sure.

    If MAGA idiots have any real abilities, it's an inbred talent for creating blind spots about things that are uncomfortable for them.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,113 ✭✭✭Patrick2010




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,113 ✭✭✭Patrick2010


    Why does he keep lying? He knows US importers will be paying the tariffs not other countries



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,064 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    Flood the zone, repeat the lie often enough and it'll dupe enough ignorant voters.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



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  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 18,051 Mod ✭✭✭✭ixoy


    Absolutely works. I still see it being mentioned on Twitter, that Trump has gotten them a great deal where the EU are paying 15%.



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