Electric, Hydrogen & Hybrid Electric Buses in Ireland

BYD don't need ADL anymore, they are well able to hold their own, tbh ADL is on a downward slope and who would of thought…. it was the other way around years ago with the whole Wrightbus scenario. Bamford has turned Wrightbus around and the product is good, the electroliers are a dream to travel on, a couple of modifactions were needed but they are getting there.

The support network around the ADL PA and PAD class buses was a disaster and still is, the fact that drivers are refusing to drive them and it goes as far as drivers been out sick because of said buses…..

I can honestly see nothing else but electroliners been ordered in the future, hopefully some of the single deck versions too.

A very good point, and there is a good relationship with Volvo, parts and support network is fantastic too. Would love to see an order for BZL,s there a nice looking bus and are gaining popularity in London too.

Slightly off topic but not that much. What's the verdict on the seat moquette and interior of the new buses. Currently in Dublin we have :

Go Ahead :

Dublin Bus (and go ahead) :

And the newer TFI (ED PA and bus Bus Eireann ones)

Personally I love the newer TFI spec interiors, Ide love for the SG type and even GT to get a refurb and the tfi moquette installed on them. I think the green fabric for the priority seating is a fantastic idea.

I should note that the PVR in Ahtlone is something to the tune of 6 (maybe 8 after electrification? I'd have to check from which data I got that value of 6 from), so 20 buses is more than overkill. Even if eight or nine go to Sligo, Athlone will have enough spares.

Yes, I don't think they would use the E10 for city services, well maybe 2 or 3 to replace the WS's, but as you say the E12 would make much more sense.

Are there any routes where the bus actually has to be a 10m bus? Unless they need a few shorter buses because of maneuverability they may just want to replace the WSs/121s with something like the Enviro200s or E12s. I imagine the routes would operate just fine with E10s, but if they are ordering regular single deckers again im not sure it would make sense to have just a handful of midibuses running around.

Even though they don't show it on their website, they do have a dual door E12, Go Ahead uses them in Singapore. There even have triple door ones and even BRT, but for LHD markets. But the Singapore ones are RHD.

Ah that's good to know.

I think single door is probably fine for most local link. City services definitely need dual door IMO. I'm not sure where town services fall on that.

Honestly the more I think about it, I could really see them going either way. Although I could see it depending on the scale of the E10 order needed for LL, as if they are only ordering a handful of E10s it might make more sense to order something like the E12 as a part of a framework for the city networks. Do you know if there is anywhere I can find information about the E10 orders or just LL fleet information in general? I just don't have a sense of scale for how many buses they are using and/or need.

Would be my preference. Volvo's tend to be better quality than anything integral from ADL or Wrights. Although Wrights definitely seem to have upped their game since the Bamford takeover big improvements on the Streetlites and original Streetdecks.

I had no idea that the WSs were shorter than the 121s, this all makes so much more sense now. I am not sure what my thought process was, but I think I just assumed the 121s being streetlites were midibuses like the WSs and never took the time to compare them to a DD. I also assume then that the WMs are the same as the 121s rather than shorter like the WSs?

Also this has sent me down a spiral, but I think I am understanding it. So I believe the WSs are the shorter 10.2m Streetlite DFs, meaning that the 121s are the longer 11.5m Streetlite Max models? I also think the 121s are the longer Max models despite what bustimes says because the longer DF model is still only 10.8m and I believe that is about what the DDs are, meaning they wouldn't have a problem with the 59. Also buses 12141, 12142, and 12143 are not regular 121s but slightly different model purchased used from the UK at a later date, and looking at pictures I think they may be a bit shorter? But it could also just be the window layout is different, I really can't tell.

All of this is really to ask, does this mean that except for the WSs all Streetlites could just be replaced by something like the EAs? all of the Streetlites GAI and BE I think are practically regular single deckers, rather than midibuses like the WS1 and WS2.

To clarify when I asked about their replacement that was more a question about their role and capacity, not if/when they should be replaced. With the sheer number of DDs they need to order both for the various BC programmes and to replace all of the life expired vehicles (there are 168 between DB and GAI alone and the GTs are approaching 14 years too), I think single deckers are just low priority. If I had to guess the next order and/or framework for single deckers won't be in place until BC Waterford progresses more, assuming the new fleet will still be single deckers. Although I am not sure what the status of BC Waterford electrification is and if they still plan to use single deckers.

That all said I am still doubtful the Streetlites will last a full ~14 years in Dublin. Sooner than later I think the NTA will want to start electrifying the GAI fleet. Although even depot electrification aside, replacing DB's 159 single-door buses (the youngest of which are 17 years old) definitely takes priority. Additionally if they can electrify the GAI fleet soon enough I think they could cascade Streetlites to new town services and to LL operators to supplement the Enviro200MMCs.

I mentioned it in my previous comment but I think the plan is for BC Waterford to use single deckers like the current network, so I would assume that a significant chunk of the 200 bus framework was intended for Waterford. I am not sure if they had the exact number when the framework was first created, but as a part of the draft network docs it mentions plans for a fleet of 75 buses and I think the fleet requirement has gone up with the revision. My reasoning is really just that all of the documents show single deck buses, from the livery, to concept art, etc, and never once does it mention explicitly mention that it is purchasing DDs. Also considering the fleet is already single deckers (and not technically full length) the frequency increase alone is a massive increase in capacity, and the NTA may think buying DDs would be overkill. I admit my reasoning is probably a bit flimsy, but it is the why I am expecting to see a new framework sooner than later.

Now again I am don't believe it has, but I can't say for certain that plan hasn't changed and they have decided to to switch to using DDs for Waterford. If they still plan to roll out the network in 2026 we should find out information soon, as not only will they need a much larger fleet, but I am not sure if electrification works have begun on the depot, or if the depot is even large enough for all 70-80 buses in addition to buses and coaches used for other services.

Torontos development and investment is pretty poor. Just look at the manner that they operate their tram network, it is genuinely shocking. Like totally insane!

Did you also watch that Not Just Bikes video? :)