Hamas strike on Israel

Can you concieve of peace in the M/East with Israel still existing and still denying freedom to the Palestinian Territories? Israel's rabid supporters will think what they want come what may. The facts of the matter is that outwit Arab Jews every other Jew in Israel is a settler on Palestinian land. That is simply a fact.

As long as Israel exists their won't be peace in the M/East. It really is that simple.

I don't have a crystal ball. But I have outlined the challenges Israel faces in earlier posts on this thread. Just to be clear wishing the dissolution of a country does not equate to ethnic cleansing as some have tried to portray on here. In your hearts of hearts do you really see a rabid Israeli society ever viewing their Palestinian neighbours and fellow citizens as their equal?

Israel has certainly blown it in terms of public support in Europe.

They are steadily progressing to rogue state status.

If America drops them, they are truly screwed.

But will that EVERRRRRR happen????

If it was almost any other state carrying out such a genocide - surely there’d be trade bans, international sanctions, travel bans, talk of regime change etc etc etc.

“Ordinary” civilian Israelis who are protesting this genocide have my respect and support.

BUT it’s sickening to think Israeli civilians who back this, or ever worse soldiers or politicians who back it can potentially show up here for a bit of rest and recovery for example.

Alon Mizrahi is an Arab Jewish commentator. He sees Israel as a failed rotten state which cannot continue. The chief cancer in Israeli society is Zionism.

This allows the average Israel to believe he is the chosen one. His suffering is the only suffering that deserves empathy. He has a divine right to live in Israel. The sense of entitlement would be comical were it not true.

A state which must oppress to exist is a failed entity.

I'm not going to go down the route of slagging a poster which is what you have sought to do. All I can do is ask you to read up on the history of Israel since 1948. No Israeli administration has had any interest in making the native people of Palestine part of the new country of Israel. Alon Mizrahi an Arab Jew has said that his people have experienced terrible racism from Ashkenazi Jews who make up the majority in Israel. They have even less enthusiasm to allow a Palestinian state to flourish and actively seek to undermine it at every opportunity.

Yitzhak Rabin was assassinated because he was one person who sought a viable two state solution. A murder which Bibi encouraged. Their is no rational personality showing his or her face in Israel that you could have a rational discussion with vis a vis a two state solution even if you wanted it to happen. Their is no statesmanlike figure like a Mandela etc.

Israel by it's own hand has run of road. It is Israel which has perpetrated a genocide in Gaza. It is a pariah state. It is frowned upon to trade with Israel now. Why should Palestinians have to accept a new (historically) nation that has perpetrated genocide against them as a neighbour. Israel has lost it's right to exist. It is a morally bankrupt entity.

The minute you have to steal land from one people to give land for the formation of a new country then the new entity is on quicksand straight away. Do I expect Israel to be dissolved tomorrow. No obviously not. But in the next 10-20 years Israel will be no more. It will be a Palestinian homeland as it was before 1948.

I'm not going to go down the route of slagging a poster which is what you have sought to do.

Before I even read the rest of that post outline, specifically, where I was slagging you.

It's not my intention to slag you and, believe me, you'd know that if it happened. If you feel you've been slighted, that's entirely on yourself I'm afraid.

Normally there's a lot of crossover in our stances on this conflict, the major separation being the future of Israel as a nation. And it's destruction is not something I think is either viable or even desirable.

Well, all I can say to that is that if you feel threatened, then that's on you as well. I have issued no threats.

I have merely asked you a few questions in an effort to get you to outline how it is that this cessation of Israel's existence is going to come about. An aspiration which you have repeatedly leaned into on this thread numerous times.

If you mean that Israel ceases to exist as the extreme right wing entity it currently is with Netanyahu and his violent thugs at the helm, then I would fully agree. If you mean that it should cease to exist as a nation, well then that's where agreement ends.

Good night.

While I agree the Israeli use of the word to shut down any kind of discussion of their actions has lessened the impact, it does still have a valid meaning.

The Holocaust was an anti-semitic genocide, along with other minorities but the Jews were the main targets.

As for your last paragraph, I don't follow. If possible, some clarification would be welcome.

Many Irish Americans are descended from Famine refugees. I hope that will stir their consciences to demand aid be allowed into Gaza, and an end to this genocide.

"When it comes to Israel, the US is not a rational-actor. It is pushed into unconditional support for Israel by the Christian Zionists, and the Israeli-connected billionaire donors".

Partly, but not entirely the reasoning for it. America has in Israel a powerful military ally with an army and airforce on the ground, with very useful intelligence capabilities, as they see it. It's their foothold in that part of the world and seemingly to keep this they are prepared to allow a little genocide and murder spree along with a bit of land grabbing. Sure its only Lebanon/Gaza, sure they're only an imaginary territory, who cares!