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Israel Launches strike against Irans Nuclear Programme

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,462 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    If they are terrorists because their targets are the military of the state they are in, as you say. Will you agree that Israeli settlers, who this week we have seen attacking the IDF are also terrorists?

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,462 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    Like the IDF soldiers filmed smashing dialysis machines and ultrasound machines in hospitals in Gaza. Would you condemn that smashing and destroying too or do you support it?

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,462 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,613 ✭✭✭brickster69


    Iran’s government has now officially put into effect the non-cooperation with the IAEA this morning that was voted on earlier this week.

    This follows some wild accusations being made overnight regarding IAEA infiltration by foreign intelligence services.

    "if you get on the wrong train, get off at the nearest station, the longer it takes you to get off, the more expensive the return trip will be."



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,590 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    I am familiar with the UK law that deems Palestine Action as a terrorist organisation, maybe you can outline to me the relevant domestic laws that apply to the Israeli settlers?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,479 ✭✭✭MFPM


    There lies the problem, governments use these laws to suit their own political ends. The 'terrorist' label is useful when it suits and then ignored when it doesn't we've seen it so often....it's rarely about the rule of law but political opportunism and Starmer and his cronies are masters of that approach. The approach of the UK government on this matter is utterly absurd and any objective thinking would conclude that IMO. The approach has parallels to that of the South African government to the ANC (clearly their social weight was entirely different to PA) during Apartheid. Remember Mandela was on the US terrorist list for 30+ years and only removed 23 years post release from prison!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 768 ✭✭✭Randycove


    it isn’t so much about opportunism, it is pragmatism.
    Iceland were declared a terrorist state during the financial crisis to prevent one of their banks from transferring all of their assets from the uk to Iceland. Obviously the UK doesn’t consider Iceland to be a terrorist country, but that was the legislation under which a convenient law was passed. The same in this case, Palestine Action are a pretty abhorrent organisation and I have no doubt have very strong links to the abuse labour MPs were getting in the last election, so in order to ban them and curtail their activities, they have to become a proscribed organisation, because there is no other convenient legislation.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,613 ✭✭✭brickster69


    Israel getting hysterical and calling on the European countries to impose sanctions on Iran for withdrawing from the IAEA this morning. Amazing double standards from a country which has totally ignored UN security resolutions insisting they do so themselves for decades.

    I think they are going to bomb them again soon as the clock continues ticking down every day.

    "if you get on the wrong train, get off at the nearest station, the longer it takes you to get off, the more expensive the return trip will be."



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,590 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Here is the real problem. In a democratic country like the UK, you can elect a government to change the law, and the people have it fully within their power to do so. That they don't shows the people have chosen. Palestine Action are rightly proscribed as a terrorist organisation.

    South Africa was far different - it wasn't a one person, one vote democracy. Iran is further different, a repressive regime with no democratic support. Being labelled a terrorist in a democratic country is far different from being labelled in apartheid South Africa or Iran.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,850 ✭✭✭mikethecop


    Why do you people always demand that other people condemn this or support that ???? can you not understand that i do not have to be the same as you ? nor do i want to ,

    regardless the actions of action palestine is actively acting in support of putin . DO YOU SUPPORT PUTIN ?? 😂 do you support attacks on active runways and gardai ?

    you must do if you support those groups right ???



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,263 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    Iranian Airspace in their Western and central regions has been closed.

    No word I can find yet as to why.

    There has been a coincidental rise in US military supply flights into Israel.

    The US cutting even more supplies to Ukraine means that already allocated weapons must be going somewhere…



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,462 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    Section 2 of the 2016 Counter Terrorism Law


    “An act (or threat of an act) that is carried out with a political, religious, national, or ideological motive, intended to instill fear or panic among the public, or coerce a government or an international organization to act (or refrain from acting).”

    To be considered terrorism, the act must also involve one or more of the following:


    •Causing serious harm to a person’s body or liberty.

    • Creating a serious risk to life or health.
    • Causing serious damage to property, infrastructure, or essential services (e.g., transport, energy, health).
    • Causing serious harm to religious sites or symbols.
    • Disrupting essential services or daily life significantly.

    If Palestinians attacked and choked Israeli soldiers, burnt a military post and destroyed Israeli military vehicles and equipment you would not hesitate to label them as terrorists but of course violent Israeli settlers are given a free pass due to your ongoing hypocrisy and double standards as evidenced time and time again throughout this thread

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,114 ✭✭✭jackboy


    They may be stocking up for another attack on Iran, maybe a more sustained operation including the US and maybe more countries. I'd imagine letting Iran recover their missile launch capability would be a bad idea, now could be the time to finish the job.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,462 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    Of course you don’t have to condemn the destruction of dialysis and maternity equipment by the IDF. Why would you.

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,375 ✭✭✭RGARDINR


    I doubt it bit what I say is happening is there getting all their interceptors fully stocked up and more and all their planes getting rearmed big time.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,462 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    They are going to re obliterate the highly successful best ever attack that obliterated the already obliterated targets.
    The new operation will be code named “this time we really mean it

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,479 ✭✭✭MFPM


    I don't think Iceland were declared a terrorist state at the time, though they were rightly outraged at that label being thrown around. The reality was that the UK government of the time invoked preexisting legislation as a 'panic' measure in the financial crisis - yes, from the UK's perspective it was 'pragmatic' yet still incorrect. What's happening with PA is a whole other ball game in my view. This is a very deliberate attempt by Starmer to put the boot into the whole movement against the atrocities being committed by Israel - it's an off shoot of the general approach by them to weaponise anti-semitism to silence any critique of the actions of Netanyahu and his regime and of course people drawing attention to the West's complicity in the mass slaughter of the people of Gaza. The laughable fact is Starmer defended people (and won the case) who engaged in similar activites to PA while a QC. Using the Terrorism Act here is simply outrageous, it's an abuse of the legislation and is criminalising the right to protest, it's a very dangerous development and irrespective of any bias against the group or their activites it should be opposed by anyone who has an interest in democracy.

    Post edited by MFPM on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,850 ✭✭✭mikethecop


    That's some nice point avoiding right there ☝️

    same play book every single . makes debate pointless and circular

    if you disagree with some one you are not entitled to attack and destroy property and people ,

    that is terrorism , that is what the people you support are doing



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,479 ✭✭✭MFPM


    Briefly, (to hopefully avoid sacntion for taking this somewhat off topic)…..I suspected your response would be along these lines. The idea that a vote for a government is an endorsement of every aspect of their program or a defence of every piece of legislation on the statute books is risible, people vote on many issues. We saw in the last GE here that Palestine rated fairly low on the list of why people were voting the way they did however I suspect large numbers of government voters felt the government's response to that issue was relatively poor (polling would suggests as much) People can't just change governments at the drop of a hat either!


    There is of course a difference between so-called democracies and non-democracies. Still, I would argue it's far worse for a so-called democratic country to go down the road that the UK is going down, particularly for the reasons the current UK government are doing it. It's not dissimilar to the establishment of Guantanamo Bay which was an appalling and egregious move by the Bush regime to deliberatley create a space of exception for the detention of Muslims and Asians on little or no evidence of wrongdoing - worse still to keep it open for decades!


    Colombia is a further example - FARC is a proscribed terrorist organisation internationally because of the appalling activities they engage in - torture, kidnappings and murder etc - yet Colombian governments have done all of those things yet it's generally ignored.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,089 ✭✭✭Sudden Valley


    That this group is now judged to be in the same category of the UVF and IRA is farcical. May as well create a new word for the actual terrorists who kill people.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,462 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    Oh I agree with you. Now I am asking you if you support IDF soldiers individually destroying dialysis machines, ultra sound equipment etc?

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,462 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    Another example is the US sending detainees to be tortured in Syria and then criticising Syria for torturing detainees.

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,079 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    An anti-war / anti-genocide movement vandalising military property or infrastructure scarcely seems to fall anywhere close to what could be called 'terrorism'. The word terrorism comes from the verb 'to terrorise', but these guys merely seem to be trying to disrupt the UK war effort and its attempts to aid Israel in carrying out its genocide.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,590 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    They meet the legal definition in the UK, that is sufficient.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 705 ✭✭✭sheepysheep


    More bad news for the Iranian regime. The full demise of its terrorist proxy, Hezbollah, draws ever closer.

    "The prospect of securing Hezbollah's disarmament - unimaginable two years ago - underlines the big shifts in the Middle East power balance to the detriment of Iran's allies across the region since the start of the war between Israel and Hezbollah ally Hamas in October 2023."

    It would have been difficult to imagine the effect that that pager bomb strike would have on the whole region in such a small period if time. It set off a chain reaction that has potentially reshaped the politics of the ME for years to come.

    A great pospect for the Lebanese and Israeli people if this can be realised.

    Full article below.

    https://us.yahoo.com/news/lebanon-drafts-reply-us-demand-125725083.html



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,590 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    An amazing step towards long-term peace in the region if Hezbollah are neutralised as a terrorist threat.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,273 ✭✭✭mountain




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,479 ✭✭✭MFPM


    And the UK government welcome the Israeli guys actually engaging in terror day after day after day....



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,310 ✭✭✭Large bottle small glass


    The regime change in Syria was also a big factor. Iran no longer has a land corridor to supply Hezbollah.

    The pager strike was different level though. Hard to believe it actually happened.

    From a psychological perspective must leave their enemies thinking what else are they capable of and what are they planning



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,079 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    It still requires a political decision from the UK Parliament and they are perfectly free to reject the designation of PA as a 'terrorist' group if they so desire.

    That legal definition above is oblique in the extreme btw - someone throwing a brick through the window of a police station could be designated a 'terrorist' if so desired.



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