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Dublin Airport New Runway/Infrastructure.

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,968 ✭✭✭sparrowcar


    1. Secures jobs
    2. Increases employment in the area.
    3. Adds more revenue to the local economy
    4. Stops Dublin losing flights that have gone to UK airports the past few years.
    5. More choice and ideally lower priced tickets.
    6. Utilises an under utilised parallel runway system.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 363 ✭✭CardF


    1.Decreases property values.

    2.Damages citizens health.

    3.Further concentrates the airport market - monopoly levels.

    4.Adds to Dublins road congestion.

    5.Makes a mockery of national planning laws.

    6.Perpetuates the Dublin centric economy.

    We're never joining nato. 😁



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,019 ✭✭✭BP_RS3813


    All of those are valid points but are locals health not to be considered at all? In general I mean - I am aware they were offering the noise insulation scheme for those who were badly affected but as the airport grows and more flights occur the number of those affected negatively will grow as the airport grows.

    Maybe our viewpoints differ I'm of the opinion that economics should never come before locals health (within reason). That 'within' reason part seems to have been withered down in recent years and advocates of Dublin airports growth seem to have the opinion that economics trumps health which should never be the case.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,915 ✭✭✭WishUWereHere


    First off I want to put your mind at ease in saying I am not on any payroll remotely connected to the aviation industry. What I am though is a lover of all things connected to Commercial aviation.

    I’m no expert but I’d say approximately 50% of the island’s population live within a 90 minute drive of Dublin Airport, so for me logic says the vast majority of international landings & take offs should come through Collinstown. This obsession with Cork & Waterford is bewildering to say the least, accessibility to both airports are far inferior to Dublin - though I will admit Dublin also needs vast improvement ( metro springs to mind ).
    I’d love to know exactly where you live ( vicinity to Dublin airport I mean ) and have You ever taken an overseas holiday or business trip - I find your one tracked line of thinking very off putting.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,915 ✭✭✭WishUWereHere


    PLEASE, can you remove your blinkers - not everyone supporting growth has financial interests in Dublin Airport.

    Your one trackedness is now becoming boring.



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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 32,765 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    as the airport grows and more flights occur the number of those affected negatively will grow as the airport grows.

    Unless they build a third runway - which they wont - the number of people affected is completely and utterly static.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,019 ✭✭✭BP_RS3813




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,473 ✭✭✭Jinglejangle69


    One reason why they shouldn’t.


    Climate change, more flights more damage.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,517 ✭✭✭Blut2


    Ireland gets more jobs and tax revenue for the state in aviation from the airlines, airplane maintenance, and the airport staff. 44,000 people are currently directedly employed in aviation, and 140,000 indirectly, generating €9.8bn in economic output as of last year.

    Ireland gets more jobs and tax revenue in tourism and hospitality from more workers and tourists visiting and staying in hotels and spending money. 258,000 people currently work in the tourism industry in Ireland, bringing €19.7bn to the country last year, with the vast majority of our tourists arriving via airplane through Dublin.

    Ireland gets more connectivity for the people of Ireland flying to other countries to do business, visit friends and family (the country is 23% foreign born now and rising rapidly), and to go on holiday.

    And huge driver of the MNC investment, and corporate taxes, that currently power the economy in Ireland is our air connectivity. Having direct, regular, flights to business hubs like SFO, LAX, and JFK is a key factor in Ireland being chosen as an investment location by executives in firms debating their options.

    We're an island nation in the North Atlantic, sitting in the ideal position between North America and Europe with strong links to both, with a huge international population. And with short travel time from every major population center on the island to Dublin airport.

    All of which means Dublin airport is only going to get more and more traffic as time goes on, its a brilliant success story for the country. The tiny numbers of people living very close to the airport who this bothers would be better off accepting this and moving elsewhere, rather than wasting their time fighting against the incoming tide like Caligula.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,915 ✭✭✭WishUWereHere




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 41,040 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    The actual noise footprint of Dublin is tiny compared to Heathrow, Gatwick, Manchester… By this I mean the number of people who are actually affected by noise, not "Sometimes I can hear a plane". They will have turned down buyout or insulation offers from the DAA…

    I'm partial to your abracadabra
    I'm raptured by the joy of it all



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 41,040 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    What's the point of showing anyone a diagram which has 16/34 still in use?

    I'm partial to your abracadabra
    I'm raptured by the joy of it all



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 363 ✭✭CardF


    "Ireland gets more jobs and tax revenue for the state in aviation from the airlines, airplane maintenance, and the airport staff. 44,000 people are currently directedly employed in aviation, and 140,000 indirectly, generating €9.8bn in economic output as of last year."

    And the best part is all this happens with a mostly moderate level of aviation noise over a huge section of north Dublin (where hundreds of thousands of people live), so negatives are mostly acceptable. For now, because of a legal agreement which big business wants to flush, setting a precedent for the whole country where any similar regulations become toilet paper, unleashing who knows what.

    But its not all bad news, once our legal system has been made a mockery of we can have a conveyor belt of constant profit maximizing noise over the fastest growing county in the country. (@Podge_irl no its not static, Fingals population is growing). This will greatly benefit some c suite execs, and the occasional … 'aviation enthusiast'.

    Tourism and connectivity is obviously going to mostly pass through Dublin since Dublin gets over 90% of the air traffic. Someone above said 50% of the population live within 90 mins drive of Dublin, well Dublin airport already having over 90% of the market more than covers that argument. Dublin airport is a success, it has succeeded, like Dublin. And like Dublin its also sprawling now and sucking up all the potential from the rest of the country. You would think 'as an island' we'd want more good sized airports to help expolit opportunites throughout the country, rather than putting 90% of our eggs in 1 basket. All expansion of Dublin airport goes through Fingal co co's offices, from pipes to wires to roads. So your tide may become more of a stream.

    We're never joining nato. 😁



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 363 ✭✭CardF


    ok its not just financial interests, it a few plane spotters too.

    We're never joining nato. 😁



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 32,765 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    God damn plane spotter lobby. They'd give Big Pharma a run their money.

    No one is going to rehash the regional airport crap. There is a thread for it somewhere but people want to fly to dublin and there are massive critical mass impacts from having Dublin as a hub. There is no option to redirect to other airports. Also the number of people impacted by the number of plane movements is static. Unless you plan to ban having children in Portmarnock the growth of the airport wont impact that. Also FCC population may be growing but its mostly in Swords and other areas not remotely impacted.

    All expansion of Dublin airport goes through Fingal co co's offices

    Not for much longer thankfully.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,517 ✭✭✭Blut2


    We get all of those benefits with Dublin airport at the size it is now. The more it grows in size the more additional benefits we'll get as a nation.

    Ireland isn't large enough to justify having multiple airports. A large airport has a ground transportation cachement area of 3 hours - which in Ireland, from Dublin airport, now covers every major population center. Belfast, Galway, Limerick, Cork, Waterford, Derry etc - literally every single one. Most at well under 3 hours, too.

    CPO'ing, or a voluntary seller/voluntary buyer scheme, for a small number of objector properties, in order to benefit the country and its transport infrastructure, is something thats been well established in our legal system for all of our history as a state, its no mockery. How do you think the LUAS, or train lines, or motorways, got built? A small number of people local to development objected to each of those too but were overruled, because the greater good for the country and Irish people needs to win out.

    Ireland's planning process delays things terribly, often for years, but in the end the right thing does get done. So like I said, if you're one of the small number of local airport resident objectors you really only have two choices here: learn to live with the continual expansion of the airport and stop wasting time and energy being worked up about it, or sell up and move elsewhere. Because for all the reasons listed above, and more, theres no hope of it being kept in stasis at current size. Its only going to get much bigger and busier.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 363 ✭✭CardF


    lol you'll have to cpo half of north Dublin.

    You've never been to the northside outside of an annual trip to the airport, have you?

    I mean I posted the noise map a page back, and explained that Fingal is the fastest growing population center in the country. Still in some peoples minds this is a question of a hamlet sitting off the runway which is complaining. Id be with you if that was the case, but its not.

    Aircraft noise at its presently tolerable level is present from Malahide through to Dunboyne, north up to Swords and south to Castleknock. (those are the names of some of north Dublin suburbs btw). A huge section right across north co Dublin.

    Speaking of motorways. The M50 had to build noise suppression even though residents had 'bought near a road - what were they expecting'. How are you going to suppress the noise of a constant flow of airliners. DAA has tried to dodge, and fudge and hand wave such concerns but they're not going away.

    A cap was agreed, by law. And has been breached. Investors will rightly fear the rug being pulled some years down the road because of DAA's prior shady practices on this issue. Fingal council are unlikely to be quick to help with any planning related to DAA, the health of citizens being of first concern.

    Any pressure to push the numbers up is from a few yahoos in the business community. And some plane spotting anoracks. 33 million seats is more than the public needs.

    We're never joining nato. 😁



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 567 ✭✭✭Thunder87


    If your proposal is we illegally force private airlines to move flights to the regional airports then wouldn't that negatively affect the lives of the locals in Cork or Shannon through increased noise, congestion etc?

    Or is your proposal that we just ban everyone from leaving or entering the country once we nationally pass some arbitrary number of passengers in a given year?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,915 ✭✭✭WishUWereHere


    Gosh, You are coming across as very dictatorial. You mention areas growing. I wonder why? The airport is there decades and that doesn’t seem to be deterring the house purchasers.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 363 ✭✭CardF


    Because the levels are kept somewhat moderate.

    Because Fingal co co keep Willie and Mick in their box.

    I asked an AI about which north Dublin suburbs are affected by aircraft noise, and what is their total population.

    The total comes to 132,000. And I can see from the list that its missed a few places.

    Those people arent all going to move. In fact their number is going to increase. So if there is a conflict of interests then its the wellbeing of the public vs aspirations of DAA which already has a 90% share of the national market. Reminding you of this doesnt make me the bad guy.

    Additionally, its also a case of property prices vs DAA, that whole overflown area will have reduced property value if flight noise is significantly increased, or allowed depart/arrive earlier/later. Thats something that landlord TDs and business interests might actually care about. Tenants wont pay as much for noise polluted property.

    Can we not content ourselves with 33 million. Call it a success. Start looking for the next success today, rather than leaving it til some kind of crisis in 10 years. Maybe stop the Dublin sprawl, and the self perpetuating cycle of putting everything in Dublin because everyones in Dublin. Throw some regional airport a frickin bone.

    We're never joining nato. 😁



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 555 ✭✭✭dublin12367


    Do you believe this drivel your posting yourself or are you intentionally trying to wind other users on this thread up? I hope for your own sake it’s the latter. 😬



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 363 ✭✭CardF


    cant you debate the post? instead of getting salty at me?

    We're never joining nato. 😁



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 555 ✭✭✭dublin12367


    I could. Absolutely, but no doubt you’d come back with more drivel and it’s been debated numerous times before.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 32,765 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    I see we've gone from stopping the growth of Dublin Airport to stopping the growth of Dublin.

    All very realistic and reasonable.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,915 ✭✭✭WishUWereHere


    and I asked you earlier today where You lived and is the airport affecting you personally. Seems you only want everything your way. Time to remove myself from this rabid conversation.
    I’ll finish my contribution by encouraging more and more passenger growth at Dublin Airport, which has the knock on effect of contributing to the economy, and not let Liverpool Manchester etc benefit from the stupid cap in Dublin.

    Over and out.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 363 ✭✭CardF


    i understand such information may be disappointing to you. i too like planes, and lights and fancy buildings. but it is what it is.

    We're never joining nato. 😁



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,915 ✭✭✭WishUWereHere


    Why not start Your own thread on the negatives of increasing the numbers in Dublin AirPort? And see how many contributors you generate. I can guarantee you I’ll steer clear of that thread.

    Post edited by WishUWereHere on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 41,040 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    Load of condescending nonsense which is impossible to take seriously.

    The cap had nothing at all to do with noise.

    You have thankfully no right to decide what the public needs.

    I'm partial to your abracadabra
    I'm raptured by the joy of it all



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 41,040 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    I'm partial to your abracadabra
    I'm raptured by the joy of it all



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,641 ✭✭✭✭cson


    And surely anyone moving to Fingal is aware of the existence of Dublin Airport and can factor that into their choice to move there or not?



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