Israel Launches strike against Irans Nuclear Programme

I didn't accuse them. It's a fact. If you don't like it being pointed that is your problem not mine. The Ukranians aren't going to criticise a close ally of America. Bibi and Putin have expressed past admiration for each other too. It's not a surprise given they share simliar traits

I would suggest the conspiracy theories forum with that complete garbage.

"Zero Israeli jets over Iran". "Iran has secretly built a world class defense network to counter the US".

That's so unhinged and incompatible with reality it's disturbing.

So, this is a conflict that Iran cannot lose?

You sound like Comical Ali.

One missile strike and you guys act like Putin and his 3-day special operation…

MOD: Uncivil - Warning issued

There's no snappy turn, just a basic understanding of reality vs fantasy.

What has Iran accomplished militarily since this conflict began?

Is it more, or less impactful than Israel destroying Iran's air defense, establishing air superiority, eliminating senior leadership, rendering their air force null and void?

I don't hold "utter joy" at Iran being decimated, but they are getting decimated, and the complete denial of that reality is frankly, disturbing.

As is the repeated insistence that Iran did "nothing" to invite this, despite Iran declaring Israel its enemy, an entity to be destroyed, and heavily funding islamic militias to attack Israel with rockets for decades after the revolution.

Yea, they were so worried they reopened the economy today… very worried they are indeed…. :)

Your reply has nothing to do with my post. It's a bit odd.

Do you find it objectionable that a military force is actually good at its job, and that another military force is poor at theirs? This is what is happening now.

If you hate war so much why do you give Iran carte blanche in their arming and funding for proxy groups around the world?

Israel is no innocent either. If you were even handed you would acknowledge that Israel has in fact also supported terrorism and helped to destabilise the region through its policies. Whose fault is it that Hamas and Hezbollah came into being in the first place. Now we have Bibi admitting their funding isis linked Gangs in Gaza. The reality is Likud has been happy to court Islamic terrorism over the years, even ex US officials and Israeli officials have gone on record about it. Bibi even bragged about it to his colleagues as to why it was a good idea to let the cash flow to Hamas because it would undermine the PA and stall any effort for a peace agreement .

It would be better if the current Israeli government and the Iranian government were off the scene because neither are really interested in peace.

Yes why schedule the meeting if you thought the other side had past your deadline and wasn't interested in a deal. Also as you mentioned why kill the lead negotiator on the other side who signalled on US tv that Iran was willing to do a deal?

I think there are two possible explanations; either it was a ruse by Donnie or he was blindsided by the Israelis then had to pretend he was in on it all along. In any case it has shattered his image as a deal maker who would not get America involved in any more wars- something he routinely criticised Democrats for.

So, if Iran comes through this without invasion, annihilation or regime change, but has all its nuclear facilities destroyed, that would represent a successful outcome from their defensive viewpoint?????

Israel launched the war unexpectedly with a list of war aims. The country being attacked out of the blue doesn't have any war aims (other than to survive being attacked). Discussing whether Iran is in a position to 'win' or 'lose' the war seems a bit pointless, when war was imposed on it against its will. The success or failure thing can really only be said to apply to Israel.

Israel launched this war with the primary aim of destroying Iran's nuclear capability. You are inventing other aims or promoting tangential aims. Nobody has mentioned invasion except you - if you knew anything about the Middle East, you would know how difficult it would be to invade Iran.

You are trying to shape a narrative of Israel losing, to an extent that is setting off alarm bells.

No, I'm saying that the prism of whether the war can be deemed as a success or failure can only be viewed through the eyes of the instigator. Israel wanted war and launched a Pearl Harbour style attack on Iran last Friday. The only metric we can use to decide the outcome is whether or not Israel succeeded or failed in its war aims - the country being attacked doesn't have any war aims other than to survive being attacked.

Some footage of this mornings attack on Tel Aviv. Probably due to the attack happening in daylight when people are out and about. A total ban on filming attacks on military and defence production facilities now in force.

Warning - Some disturbing footage from the attack on Gaza this morning. Thread no 10

It is not the primary goal.