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Israel Launches strike against Irans Nuclear Programme

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,627 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    I think the big surprise was that there wasn't any surprise. It's comical Ali levels with Iran ATM.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 11,956 ✭✭✭✭Cluedo Monopoly


    What are they doing in the Hyacinth House?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,627 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    From yesterday, I'd guess they were probably planning on hitting something in Israel but failed.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 11,956 ✭✭✭✭Cluedo Monopoly


    Oh right. I missed that. Why is world politics played out on that silly Twitter platform these days - I'll never understand it. I wonder what they were alluding to. Absolute lunatics on both sides. And then you have Mr Trump in the mix.

    What are they doing in the Hyacinth House?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,662 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    Love for Bibi? LOL

    I would like nothing for for Bibi to be thrown in jail for his corruption.
    The thing is, regime change in Israel is done via the electorate. They have free elections there.

    The ordinary Iranians are not so lucky. They live under a religious dictatorship.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 11,956 ✭✭✭✭Cluedo Monopoly


    For his corruption? Nothing else? Speaks volumes.

    Regime change could happen if his 6 party coalition, including right wing religious nutjobs, fell apart.

    Surely you don't want the IDF to stop using their toys?

    What are they doing in the Hyacinth House?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,662 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    Gobbels is dead so he wont be able to learn anything.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,135 ✭✭✭lumphammer2


    I hope this conflict goes as bad as possible for Netanyahu and Trump …… these 2 need to be brought down permanently ….. and jailed for the rest of their lives ….. Netanyahu and various Republicans are responsible for all the misery in the Middle East ….. the world will not be at peace until they are out of power for good ……



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,662 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    Middle Eastern history did not start on October the 8th.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,662 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    It seems Kamemni is still talking tough regarding US intervention. I guess at this moment in time all he has is words. I guess he is not going to surrender to Trump and Co.

    No deaths or injuries reported in Israel after last nights attack. It seems the Iranian attacks are running out of steam.

    Meanwhile Israel is still targetting Irainain military infrastructure and assets.

    What options are there for Iran now? Very little tbh. The only hope they have right now is that Trump blinks and their nuclear sites remain somewhat intact and instead of being wiped out completely, there is enough there to go again and catch up in a few years…

    Still, though, the Iranian people now know the regime is weak and has been humiliated on the international stage. There won't be a better chance than this to overthrow the clerics.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 36,964 ✭✭✭✭o1s1n
    Master of the Universe


    The WW2/Nazi comparisons really are tiresome and make me think people don't actually realise how many people died during this period, and the length the Nazis actually went to compared to what's currently happening.

    People killed during WWII - 70,000,000 to 80,000,000 approx.

    People killed in the holocaust - 11,000,000 approx.

    50,000 Palestinians have been killed in Gaza since October the 7th 2023. That is horrific, but pales in comparison to anything the Nazis did in their death camps.

    The nazi death camps killed 220 times more people than that. For every 1 person killed in Gaza, 220 people were killed in Nazi camps.

    A standard Dublin double-decker bus can typically hold around 90-95 passengers.

    That's almost 2.5 double decker busses at full capacity of people killed by the Nazis for every one single person who's died in Gaza since 2023.

    They're both absolutely horrendous situations and I'm not downplaying Gaza, but I really do feel folks comparing the current situation to the Nazi regime is downplaying the holocaust death toll and the WW2 death toll to incomprehensible levels.

    No, Goebbels couldn't learn a thing or two from Israel as he far, far, FAR exceeded any evil they've comitted with evil of his own.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,834 ✭✭✭✭TheValeyard


    You know what. Wouldnt be a bad idea at all if this shenanigans brought down the Islamic regime, Bibi and Trump. Id settle for that.

    Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit sniffing glue



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 13,851 ✭✭✭✭kowloon




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,662 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    During the peak period of extermination of Jews in Treblinka, 15,000 people per DAY were being murdered.
    It would only have taken less than 4 days to match a death toll in Gaza that has been going on 20 months. And it is just one extermination camp, nevermind all the horrors of the Eastern Front, or the conflict in the Pacific.

    The Gaza war is horrific, and we all want it to end, but these comparisons are both unfounded and devoid of any historical fact.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,767 ✭✭✭circadian


    The murder of 6 million Jews, about two-thirds of Europe's Jewish population along with millions of other marginalised groups by the Nazis was a singular event in history in terms of both intent and execution. Everyone agrees it was a systematic, bureaucratic effort to erase entire peoples from existence.

    That said, I think it's important to be cautious about turning human suffering into a numbers comparison or ratio game. The death of tens of thousands of civilians, the majority of whom are women and children, in Gaza is a humanitarian catastrophe that deserves moral seriousness in its own right, regardless of whether it numerically “compares” to past atrocities. Atrocities aren’t diminished or made less tragic just because others were larger in scale.

    The reference to Nazism is often to draw attention to patterns: dehumanization, collective punishment, ethnic scapegoating, or the normalization of mass civilian suffering. That doesn’t always mean the situations are equal, but that the moral alarms are being sounded because we've seen where these paths can lead.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,627 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    At least Trump uses Truth Social, not that that's any different.

    Id' say Iran had a target planned for a large strike, either military or civilian but their rockets were shot down.

    Something tells me Assad is getting a new neighbour in Moscow, that or Israel/Trump will give one final warning/demand and then take him out.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,315 ✭✭✭Large bottle small glass


    Amin al-Hussein's collaboration with Hitler and Mussolini and the fact he continued being an influential Palestinian leader after the war might be a good reason to leave out the Nazi comparisons.

    Is there any other leader than survived collaboration with Hitler. Stalin maybe but he changed his mind.

    Terrific company to keep



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 13,851 ✭✭✭✭kowloon


    I'd compare Gaza to the Warsaw ghetto if I had to come up with a Second World War comparison, but the whole kill scorecard is a bit crass. It's not a competition.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 36,964 ✭✭✭✭o1s1n
    Master of the Universe


    Phrases like 'Could learn a thing or two from…' insinuates that what is currently happening is worse than what previously happened. Which I find crass to be honest.

    You'll also note in my post that I said I wasn't trying to downplay / diminish Gaza and again reiterated that it's horrendous, so not sure why you put that in your post.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 55,020 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    If you want proof of dramatic language just look a few posts back. There's a poster fawning about the skill of the Israeli army at the same time as they're using tanks to slaughter starving people queueing for scraps of food. Dramatic indeed.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 11,956 ✭✭✭✭Cluedo Monopoly


    Wouldn't there be a long line of loony religious clerics to take over as Ayatollah? The real regime change we need is one that condemns religion to the man made nonsense that it is.

    What are they doing in the Hyacinth House?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 4,079 ✭✭✭dmcdona


    That the world has had 80 years to contemplate the atrocities of that time resulted in the phrase "Never Again".

    I certainly would be horrified if that phrase is edited to:

    "Never Again, or at least until the ratio of dead is equivalent to WWII"

    Equating all innocents executed, murdered, disappeared etc. using double decker buses as a measure is probably unfortunate. Some sick individual might even query how many cremated ashes said double decker buses could hold.

    I'm not criticising the sentiment of your post - you rightly point out that your not downplaying atrocities. I just think extreme care needs to be taken when using comparisons of different conflicts as they relate to the dead. It's really not a numbers game - one dead innocent is one dead innocent too many. That goes for everyone on all sides - Iranians, Israelis, Palestinians alike.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 13,851 ✭✭✭✭kowloon


    That's not happening anytime soon, particularly in the Middle East.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 55,020 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Their acts of Genocide and War Crimes is behind it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,662 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    I would agree, but there is a cohort who keep bring up the Nazi comparisions with Israel.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 55,020 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    And they are correct in doing so. Genocide and War Crimes committed by both.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,935 ✭✭✭Homelander


    That's completely impossible to answer in that broad fashion.

    Israel for example, heavily funding the PKK and other militia groups to attack Turkey for decades, regularly publicly advocating for the destruction of Turkey, all culminating in a major attack that killed 1,500 Turkish citizens?

    Would be entirely, radically different to Turkey deciding to attack Israel over Palestine.

    One represents a serious threat to the basic security of Turkey, its borders, and its people.

    The other does not, and military intervention against Israel ALA intervention against Iraq in 1991 is also not very comparable given Hamas launched a major armed assault on Oct 7th and still refuses to surrender to the current day.

    People kind of dance around it as if it's meaningless but Hamas refusing to surrender and disarm is a huge part of why this situation is continuing, regardless of whether you think it's justifiable, abhorrent, a genocide in action, or anything else.

    Anyway, it's not the Israel-Hamas thread, but in summary, no I don't think Israel attacking Iran is remotely comparable to a third country like Turkey or Egypt suddenly attacking Israel.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 4,079 ✭✭✭dmcdona


    Certainly not the numbers.

    The comparisons illustrate the hypocrisy of a State who (rightly) coined the phrase "never again" and then goes right ahead and repeats history and the atrocities perpetrated against itself on other people.

    As a previous post stated, the comparison is highlighting the

    dehumanization, collective punishment, ethnic scapegoating, or the normalization of mass civilian suffering



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,106 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    How does Israel get out of this conflict if there is no regime change and the US doesn't come in on their side? It appears that Netanyahu was absolutely banking on one or the other happening.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,961 ✭✭✭Beta Ray Bill


    The enrichment sites are deep under ground.
    They can't hit them from the air.
    They need boots on the ground, and the only way that is happening is with US support. And the US can't do it unless they have the support from Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and particularly Iraq, which at this moment they do not have.

    Therefore 3,000km for 20 or 30 odd planes per night is the only option for Israel. And even for a country as well armed as Israel, that is not sustainable for weeks on end in terms of Pilot exhaustion, Fuel, Weapons, Aircraft Maintenance (The F-35 is 4 hours maintenance for every 1 hour flying, the F-16 is 16 hours, I think the F-15 is 20 hours - And it's at least a 4 hour round trip to Tehran), etc

    Like if Iran cared about it Cobra helicopters or F-14s (that they cannot get parts for) they'd hide them, they certainly wouldnt leave them out in the open.

    Taking Iran will be very difficult for the US, It's very mountainous

    Suprise attacks only work when you can follow up and capitalise on them. No doubt Israel has inflicted huage damage to Iran but then longer Iran has to adapt to Israeli tactics the harder it is going to be for the US and Israel.



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