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Very quiet in here

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,149 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    Well if I felt the forum moderators were acting on the reports, I would raise a feedback thread.

    And I would raise the examples on the feedback thread.

    But the scenario is what happens next on the feedback thread and how to justify the complaint as to why I don't believe it should be on the site. Because when those issues are pointed to on the feedback thread, other posters may challenge them justifying why they think it should. So we'll get into the space of discussing the issue itself to justify those positions. The concern is that that could lead to sanctions for not sticking to site discussion \ feedback or the thread shut down for going off topic.

    Where's the line?

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Administrators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 15,821 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Big Bag of Chips


    Well feedback is open. Both "sides" can contribute. So yes, I'm sure the topic might get discussed by others who disagree with what you say. With the best intentions feedback threads will meander into discussion. They shouldn't become an extension of an argument from another forum but of course, in the spirit of feedback, others can come and dispute what you are saying.

    If you don't want that, then it might be best to contact a moderators or admin specifically, by PM, outlining your issue. But again, it doesn't mean you will automatically get what you ask for.

    It's funny, when we let feedback threads evolve and let discussion flow we are not moderating. When we step in we are stifling discussion,shutting down posters, making excuses etc.

    The internet has changed massively in 25 years, as has the type of people accessing the internet. It's not a straight-line. It's difficult to operate in absolutes.

    Most Moderators are doing the best they can with a very diverse userbase holding conflicting opinions on most topics.

    Post edited by Big Bag of Chips on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,149 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    It's not that I mind it, and yes I think PM is more suitable for some more sensitive points, I would not consider it needed for my hypothetical example as long as there's an understanding from those moderating feedback that when examples are brought up there will be a certain amount of discussion of them and the issue itself.

    I was trying to outline why posters might, in good faith, be reluctant to cite examples.

    Of course, most moderators are doing their best but sometimes it is not obvious what the best course of action is.

    I think there's a balance between letting it flow and stifling it - which is nudging the flow to keep it in the bounds where it stays as useful feedback (especially for Current Affairs feedback). It is difficult to operate in absolutes and that is different for every thread which is why I think that 'nudging' is needed. Mixing metaphors, I think that it without that nudging, it won't flow, it will get bogged down.

    I have seen on previous feedback threads a note from an admin that the thread has been open for a period, and that posts are getting repetitive \ getting too deep into discussion of the issue itself and that the thread would be kept open for X hours for a 'final say', before admins take on board its content.
    That is a good card to keep in reserve also.

    A limit of one post per hour in Feedback might help, but I doubt its feasibility.

    Post edited by odyssey06 on

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Subscribers, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,700 ✭✭✭hometruths


    Do you think in this case the OP was reluctant for good reason to cite examples of the specific language and phrases they wanted to filter out?

    People are arguing theoreticals in support of the OP's suggestion, other posters are looking for specifics to argue against the OP's position, but none are available.

    It's thus inevitable that the thread would veer off the topic of the feedback suggested in the OP. Any attempt to bring it back on topic by asking which phrases or language should be filtered was met with ridicule, and a thinly veiled suggestion that if you had to ask you were evidently transphobic. And finally the ludicrous idea that they'd be infracted if they specified what phrases they thought the mods should filter.

    It's all pretty disingenuous at best. And exactly the kind of bad faith posting that's becoming increasingly common in CA. The OP got found ought by posting in a feedback thread with the feedback charter. A similiar stunt in CA might have had the desired effect with a number of posters who disagreed warned or banned.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,149 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    I'd prefer to keep the discussion at a general level or for new concerns.
    Specific threads have run their course for specific issues.

    A poster may not wish to give more 'oxygen' to something they think should not be on boards in the first place, by re-airing them on a highly visible feedback thread.

    But in that case, I think as suggested they should raise them by PM.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 91,477 ✭✭✭✭JP Liz V1


    How often are charters updated, in all forums? I suppose it's hard on forums with no mods



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,922 ✭✭✭✭suvigirl


    No one can direct me to the rules in relation to warning points on the site. Not the CA ones, I can get them, just the regular ones



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,537 ✭✭✭...Ghost...


    It’s absolutely crazy town with the new rules. Warnings can be handed out by mods (and often are) who disagree with your point of view and will dish out rubbish reasons that you can’t appeal.

    The powers that be must not give any damn about the site becoming a ghost town where only certain posters will post in a few threads and new visitors are rare.

    You can’t even trust the charter anymore and if you read the stickies and follow the rules, you can still be a target for a mod who doesn’t agree with you. Who in their right mind would start appealing warnings that are months old by the time you get to a ban that enables an appeal? Goodbye boards. Sinking ship.

    Stay Free



  • Administrators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 15,821 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Big Bag of Chips


    A poster may not wish to give more 'oxygen' to something they think should not be on boards in the first place, by re-airing them on a highly visible feedback thread.

    PMing Admins or Mike is also an option if someone feels strongly enough about something but doesn't want to broadcast it.

    At some point, you're going to have to let somebody know what you're talking about.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,855 ✭✭✭eightieschewbaccy


    And I'd repeat that the concept of don't be a dick was not present in that thread. Allowing it to descend into a debate into transgender people including quips about their genitals sounds more like moderators washing their hands of a discussion at that stage.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,175 ✭✭✭✭Goldengirl


    No direction, no input , just set up to fail . Then close and dole out bans to some mainly , on one side of the debate only .

    --------------------------------

    Please provide constructive feedback or don't post.

    Post edited by Big Bag of Chips on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,922 ✭✭✭✭suvigirl


    3 posters banned on this thread now, wonder what they did 🤔🤔

    -----------------------------

    Warned: It's none of your business.



  • Site Banned Posts: 1,331 ✭✭✭Yvonne007


    I've now received a six month ban for jokingly calling someone Cathy Newman because they misrepresented me in a "so what you're saying is" manner.

    It was a joke. Not intended to be offensive.

    Tinfoil hat on, I do believe that certain people didn't want me on here and reported me spuriously. I think it's unfair.



  • Subscribers Posts: 43,300 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    If you've reached a six month ban in less than a year from joining it doesn't sound like you want to be here either.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,537 ✭✭✭...Ghost...


    In fairness, it’s very easy to cross a blurry line that’s as straight as the north/south border. Some people absolutely deserve warnings/bans, but some warnings come from complete misunderstandings partly thanks to the fact that the written word oft does not translate well into jokes.

    Stay Free



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,537 ✭✭✭...Ghost...


    I think you can now start appealing the warnings/bans that happened before the 6 month ban? 🤣

    I’m not sure anymore 🚶🏻‍➡️

    Stay Free



  • Subscribers Posts: 43,300 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    nah, you dont go through 7 different warnings due to "misunderstandings" of the rules. If you are 'misunderstanding' that much then the problem is the poster, not the rules.

    what a normal poster would do in the situation where they have accumulate 2 or 3 warnings is theyd recognise their posting issues and change accordingly.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,346 ✭✭✭aero2k


    I've made exactly the same joke more than once with no warning. I think it's a fair response - IME when a sentence starts with "so what you're saying is", the bit after the "is" is a much closer representation of the perspective of the person speaking/writing it that the perspective of the person it's directed at.



  • Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 56,988 Mod ✭✭✭✭Necro


    As always, context is key - that poster had received three on thread mod instructions, in three seperate threads, from three seperate forum mods in just over 24 hours after coming back from a three month ban. All of which they failed to post here, naturally.

    There is only so much leeway you can give someone.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,346 ✭✭✭aero2k


    I suppose it's the distinction between an absolute offence like speeding, and something like making physical contact with someone where it might or might not be assault depending on context. I don't envy the mods either way.

    I think it would be good if mods could deal with blatant misrepresentation of another poster's posts, though I accept that's a bit subjective.



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  • Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 56,988 Mod ✭✭✭✭Necro


    It's never as black and white as posters seem to make it out though. This is why it absolutely baffles me when you see posts querying why X, Y or Z are banned on feedback threads. Mods and admins have a much clearer picture than what the regular poster has.

    So someone making an off the cuff joke about Cathy Newman with zero mod warnings or even a clean enough record is going to be provided with much more leeway than someone who repeatedly, consistently breaks the rules and shows no regard for any mod instruction provided to them previously.

    That has always, and will always continue to be the case with how moderation operates.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,139 ✭✭✭✭Esel
    Not Your Ornery Onager


    Had to Wiki Cathy Newman to understand the 'joke'…

    On 16 January 2018, Newman interviewed Canadian psychologist and author Jordan Peterson. The interview covered topics such as gender equality, including the gender pay gap, freedom of speech, and transgender rights. Short clips, gifs and memes of the fiery back-and-forth subsequently went viral, especially Newman's repeated use of the line "So you're saying..." —an utterance made 35 times during the 29-minute interview.

    Not your ornery onager



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 42,234 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    They've never forgiven her for challenging him. She had to involve the police as she got death threats after the interview as well.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,830 ✭✭✭✭MisterAnarchy


    She tried to challenge him but made a complete fool of herself in the interview.

    She was biased and emotional. She asked loaded questions and constantly tried to put words in his mouth.

    Peterson absolutely destroyed her.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,091 ✭✭✭tinytobe


    I think that the mods only should take action and ban somebody if there are insults, f words and those likes.

    Currently, I often notice that the mods are disproportionately involving themselves if something doesn't fit their opinion.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 42,234 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    He didn't. This was years ago and repeating this silly claim doesn't make it true.

    Anyway, this isn't the place.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,830 ✭✭✭✭MisterAnarchy


    It was you who brought it up and made the silly claim that "They've never forgiven her for challenging him"

    She was the big loser from the interview.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 42,234 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    No. That's true, proven by the fact that people are bringing this up half a decade later and pretending that he won.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Help & Feedback Category Moderators Posts: 26,237 CMod ✭✭✭✭Spear


    Drop the Petersen interview stuff, this is not the thread for it, and this thread has already seen too much off-topic stuff.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,346 ✭✭✭aero2k


    Delete - just saw the mod note.



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