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Does the Le Pen Conviction Finally Prove Democracy is Dead in the West?

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Comments

  • #92
    TokTik
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,078 ✭✭✭TokTik


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123449766#Comment_123449766

    Semantics. What evidence did the commission not submit?? Von Der Leyens text messages.



  • #93
    Rocket_GD
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,551 ✭✭✭Rocket_GD


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123449843#Comment_123449843

    Semantics are surprisingly important when it comes to legal cases, who would have thought it?



  • #94
    sydthebeat
    Subscribers Posts: 43,028 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123449843#Comment_123449843

    How can it be semantics when you said it was "her" case, when it clearly wasn't.

    Semantics doesn't cover that clear error on your behalf.



  • #95
    breezy1985
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,860 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    The right are a great bunch.

    "We are tough on crime" "no no not that crime"

    "We will drain the swamp" "no no not that swamp, the other swamp"



  • #96
    TokTik
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,078 ✭✭✭TokTik


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123449865#Comment_123449865

    Yeah it’s only a case about Von Der Leyen negotiating an initial €35BN deal, with EU taxpayers money, by text, which they have refused to release. Hasn’t she form for this in Germany??

    Absolutely nothing to do with Von Der Leyen.
    My mistake.



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  • #97
    sydthebeat
    Subscribers Posts: 43,028 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123449895#Comment_123449895

    Glad you realised your mistake.

    Now with that information fully understood by you, would you like to reframe your initial question again??



  • #98
    rock22
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,801 ✭✭✭rock22


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123449913#Comment_123449913

    I think it is you who might be making a mistake. van der Leyen referred to by the NYT . In addition HER office was specifically censured by the EU Ombudsman over the same issue. This commission is one of the most centralised in recent history.

    If you are basing your defence of von der Leyen on the basis that she wasn't mentioned by name , when the case was named against her commission, then it is , quite honestly, a very thin defence.

    The court interestingly went further. It seems to suggest that the commission might have lied when it said the text did not exist.



  • #99
    sydthebeat
    Subscribers Posts: 43,028 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123450488#Comment_123450488

    i am not at all defending anyone.

    i am simply clarifying the errors in TTs post where he refers the case as being HER case and suggesting that she will be punished.

    The case before the ECJ was the NYT versus the European Commissions denial of the request by the NYT of access to these messages. The ECJ found against the European Commission, not Ursula Von Der leyen.

    Once TocTik reflect these facts in his posts then the argument can continue.

    Will the European Commission be "punished" for its lack of transparency policies around disappearing text messages…. maybe. Will Ursula VDL be 'punished' for text messages which will never be seen again…. most likely not.



  • #100
    rock22
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,801 ✭✭✭rock22


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123450601#Comment_123450601

    You are totally ignoring the fact that this is her commision, created by her and answerable to her. A ruling against the commission is , in all political respects, a ruling against the president.

    "Will the European Commission be "punished" for its lack of transparency policies around disappearing text messages…. maybe. Will Ursula VDL be 'punished' for text messages which will never be seen again…. most likely not."

    And this is why we should be concerned. Otherwise the EU, in terms of upholding good practice and the rights of European citizens, is no better than a medieval tyranny.



  • #101
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 42,980 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    Mod: feel free to create a discussion about vdL and the text messages but this thread was about a politician involved in criminality which is not something that vdL or the EC were accused of.



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