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Why do people drive unnecessarily large cars?

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,384 ✭✭✭SeanW


    Spare us the self-indulgent "woe is me" narrative of people judging your posts. You're getting justified criticism because you make stuff up, engage in strawman tactics, use ridiculously hyperbolic language, and use dead children as props in your absurd theatrics.

    First you made stuff up about a poster you quoted some pages back, and used the strawman you fabricated as an opening to pimp a dead child. Which you've doubled down on since. As to the rest of your nonsense, I clearly indicated in my post that it was fair to hold a driver responsible - if they were culpable. I don't hold even individual drivers, let alone "drivers" writ large, for collisions they did not cause.

    Your claim that "Deaths involving SUV drivers aren't that unusual" is a provable lie. We have the data. I've shown previously that fatalities of any kind on Irish roads occur somewhere in the region of 1 every approximately 300,000,000 vehicle-kilometres. For scale, the average distance between Earth and the Moon is only 385,000km from Earth, so the statistically average Irish driver would have to drive the equivalent distance of between Earth and the Moon 779 times before even being involved - let alone the cause of - a fatal incident.

    As to your accusations against me, all I am doing is providing the context to your outlandish claims. It is not my fault that you don't like facts, data and evidence, and that you don't like your hyperbolic nonsense and broad brush accusations being put into context.

    Are you prepared to withdraw this lie, where you accused a poster of saying something that literally nobody said - not that poster or anyone else?

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,799 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    We do know that SUVs are more dangerous though.


    I thought ghoulish was the trendy term around here for things you don't like?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,799 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Are you prepared to withdraw your previous lies that cyclists need additional regulation while motorists need less regulation?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 428 ✭✭pale rider


    I give you the GWM Tank, not available in Ireland, a 2.0 HEV passenger vehicle with off road capabilities…The manufacturer calls it as it sees it…A Tank !

    Some folk on here will love it…some won’t, such is life, rejoice in the choice.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,384 ✭✭✭SeanW


    How is an inanimate object "dangerous?" An SUV doesn't move unless someone gets behind the wheel and starts the engine. After that, the only possible "danger" (and in the case of Ireland, there really isn't any) comes from either the behaviour of that driver (i.e. misuse of the vehicle), or the behaviour of other road users.

    But if you assert that inanimate objects can be dangerous, you will agree that motorways are safer than all-purpose single carriageways, and have demonstrated support for historical, current and future motorway development programmes?

    Otherwise, you have to explain why some inanimate objects (SUVs) are "dangerous" while all purpose single carriageway main roads are somehow "not dangerous?"

    1. How far back would I have to go to find such posts?
    2. I didn't lie.

    I await the next load of nonsense 😁

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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 52,464 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    'guns don't kill people, people kill people'.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,799 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    SUVs are dangerous because people are more likely to be seriously killed or injured in a collision with an SUV than with a traditional car, or have you missed the last few days of discussion?

    1. I don't know.
    2. Oh yes you did.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,867 ✭✭✭✭Red Silurian


    2 things that are trending lately

    It's all the fault of SUVs, what was the question again?

    It's all the fault of the green initiatives, what was the question again?

    It's getting tiring now I find



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,860 ✭✭✭scwazrh




  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 52,464 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    a pity i meant it in irony so.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,384 ✭✭✭SeanW


    Ironically, it is a good question - can an inanimate object be inherently dangerous?

    But as your kind are so fond of pointing out, accidents or collisions or whatever do not "just happen." Someone has to cause them, and that person might not be the driver of the vehicle.

    But since you assert that inanimate objects are inherently dangerous, and are supposedly concerned about "road safety" (i.e. not just bashing drivers) then you will no doubt give your full support to just about any proposed motorway project? Given that these are the types of roads where fatal incidents are least likely to occur, I am sure you have a long history of promoting motorway projects, opposing NIMBY movements against motorways etc?

    Are you prepare to accept that your claim about people claiming collisions between SUVs and children never happened, was bogus?

    As to your nonsense about lawbreaking cyclists, please point to a post where I supposedly "lied" or withdraw that claim. Preferably within the past 3 years or so.

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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 52,464 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    Ironically, it is a good question - can an inanimate object be inherently dangerous?

    Is that a trick question? Why do you think society has banned certain types of vehicles from public roads; and spoiler alert, it's not just down to the intention of drivers.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,384 ✭✭✭SeanW


    Nope, no trick. It's just that if one accepts that it is possible for an inanimate object to be inherently dangerous, in this case SUVs, then it must also follow that other inanimate objects can also be inherently dangerous.

    Take for example, motorway roads vs, various types of single carriageway, such as the all purpose single carriageway with houses, T-junctions etc along them that used to connect our main cities and still are main roads elsewhere, we know that motorways are statistically safer because they separate long distance from slower, short haul traffic and eliminate most opportunities for head-on collisions.

    Yet I do recall arguments being made here on boards, though I don't remember by who or when, to the effect that there are no such things as dangerous roads, only dangerous drivers. Though if I recall correctly, it was the "bash drivers" brigade.

    If there are no such things as inherently dangerous roads, then it logically follows that there is no such thing as an inherently dangerous vehicle, as both roads and vehicles are inanimate objects, until someone tries to use them.

    Recognising this, I was wondering if Andrew's position leads him to support widespread motorway construction, for the sake of road safety? After all, like discouraging SUVs for smaller cars, large scale motorway construction would replace lots of dangerous inanimate objects (all purpose single carriageways) with inherently safer ones (i.e. motorways).

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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 52,464 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    Well, we're left with a simple comparison of two scenarios, where a child runs out in front of, and is struck by a car; only difference is one example they run out in front of a 'traditional' car, the other they run out in front of an SUV with a considerably higher bonnet.

    Taking the results of the study mentioned earlier at face value, they are twice as likely to die in the scenario with the SUV. Where is the extra danger coming from? The actions of the child are the same, the actions of the driver are the same.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1 datatech451


    don't know small cars are generally considered good then large cars it has many advantages over large car like parking, traffic, etc. it can easily park and move on traffic conditions.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,867 ✭✭✭✭Red Silurian


    The SUV is more likely to hit them in the head would be the obvious answer there

    If they were to ban SUVs they'd first need to define what an SUV is, something like a maximum height at the front of the vehicle I presume is where they would go with that. Personally I'd prefer to tax them than ban them



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 52,464 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    The SUV is more likely to hit them in the head would be the obvious answer there

    yes, but SeanW was arguing that there's no such thing as a dangerous vehicle. my point is that if one vehicle can be more dangerous than another, that renders his argument pointless.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,412 ✭✭✭mulbot


    So just using that logic, and leave out the argument of whether they have a use, then vans, trucks, minibuses etc, are they all dangerous?



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 52,464 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    well, if you can place them on a rough scale of 'ability to do damage' or say one is more dangerous that the other - it's a hard argument to make that they're not dangerous to some extent.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,383 ✭✭✭Tenzor07


    Sure, a ban would be difficult enough to enforce seeing as we don't have any bus lane or red light cameras, so taxing on the basis of size and weight would work… Would it have much impact on the numbers of Volvo XC90's or BMW X5's driving around Ballsbridge or Ranelagh, probably not..



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,383 ✭✭✭Tenzor07


    We need commercial vehicles for goods deliveries etc.. We don't need massive cars.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,412 ✭✭✭mulbot


    You seem to have missed my particular point there "leave out whether they have a use". You might not need a big car, others might.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,383 ✭✭✭Tenzor07


    That's where things like additional taxes and increased parking charges would come in for larger passenger vehicles..



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,146 ✭✭✭BlueSkyDreams


    Why should a certain type of car have to pay extra to park in exactly the same space as every other car?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,383 ✭✭✭Tenzor07


    Pretty easy when you think that often these larger vehicles are too big for a standard parking space, thus take up more room on city streets etc.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,146 ✭✭✭BlueSkyDreams


    If they dont fit in the space, fair enough. But they generally do fit.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,383 ✭✭✭Tenzor07


    Do they indeed? May be a need for a sunroof in each of these large vehicles so they occupants can get out of them?

    image.png


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,412 ✭✭✭mulbot


    Even my smallest van, a peugeot partner is wider than the x5



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 52,464 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    According to a quick Google, a Peugeot partner has a width of 2107mm with mirrors, and an X5 has a width of 2218mm; over 10cm wider



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,412 ✭✭✭mulbot


    You're correct, I was allowing for the partners mirrors as they don't fold on mine(automatically)



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