Hamas strike on Israel - mod warning in OP updated 19/10/23

Footage today of ambulance crews in Gaza rescuing injured civilians while under heavy fire from the IDF. Incredible bravery from those crews. Desperate display of cowardice and all that is wrong with humanity from the IDF

As demonstrated throughout history, just following orders or the Nuremburg defence does not absolve the guilty

Ms Mohamed and Ms Yang, were denied entry because they were suspected of wanting to "document Israeli security forces and spread hateful rhetoric against Israel", the population authority said according to The Times Of Israel.

Assuming they have documentation that supports the suspicion, the right decision was made to refuse entry. Just because someone is a politician doesn't mean they can't be a nutjob. (See our own RBB, Claire Daly etc). Especially if your country has been attacked by a recognised terrorist group (h*mas), and they have expressed sympathy for the terrorists.

they have expressed sympathy for the terrorists.

Have they? I only briefly know about their criticism of Israel in the Commons but did they also express sympathy for Hamas?

I don't know, never heard of them before. I'm basing my comments on what was written in the article quoted by the poster earlier.

You don't know but you've labelled them as "sympathetic to terrorists"…..

That's the easy tope trotted out each time Israel comes under scrutiny; "if you're not for us; you must be for the terrorists".

These places are accessible online or in person.

Do you realise you've written this whilst also justifying the denial of people to access these places in person?

Edit: Also do you not think that Israel would be eager to demonstrate that the politicians opinions are incorrect, and show them the reality on the ground…or would that be detrimental…..

But others are the ones "genuinely confused"…..

That's one very confused post.

The truth is that if everything was done fair and square in Israel they would have no reason to ban anyone from entering. The fact is that because of their War Crimes and ill treatment of Palestinians they fear anyone reporting it. You do know that in Gaza being a member of the Press Corp is a death sentence.

I'm guessing you've never heard of "framing" whereby bad actors pick and choose which parts of a story to tell in order to fit their particular narrative.

It would indeed be interesting to learn why so many are so heated up about the imaginary genocide during a legitimate war against a group that didn't exist before the 1960s, and but are silent about actual genocides …

But I suspect it's a simple case of: "No Jews, no news"

'Assuming' is doing the most lifting ever

It is Israel, they lie and they lie about their lies

Why would anyone do that? The Red Crescent has called for an inquiry into the killing of Gaza paramedics. Nobody seems to know exactly what happened. The fact that the mainstream media in this part of the world went cold on the story after two days—coupled with the fact that they erred on the side of caution when reporting the incident originally—suggests that it's time to move on and find another new stick to beat Israel with.

Just to be clear, I believe there should be an independent and impartial investigation into the circumstances in which these paramedics died, but that will be conducted in due course—not on your timeline. The pro-Palestine movement and Hamas might decide that it is not worth pursuing when they see that they are not gaining any traction from their claims in the short term. The people of Gaza might be free from Hamas—I hope they are—by the time the investigation is completed.

It isn’t really—it poses valid questions about the parties involved. Also, you keep jumping between Gaza and the West Bank in your posts. You do realize that they are not the same place, right?

Finally, if being a member of the press corps in Gaza is a death sentence, as you claim, I would argue that Israel is acting in the best interests of the international press by restricting access to Gaza. Or would you prefer to see members of the Western press dying because of Hamas's actions, simply because it would benefit the anti-Israel narrative?

The people in Gaza and the WB are Palestinians who are suffering because of Israeli actions. There's the connection.

Being a member of the Press and a member of the British Parliament is different. The politicians were denied access because they would see the crimes being committed. The Israelis can't murder them because of the outrage it would cause. The Press however are suffering to prevent them reporting the Israeli crimes so they have no protection. They'll murder them. The Press are not being murdered by Hamas but by the agents of the '' regions only democracy ''. Some democracy that.

1000 Israeli Air Force personnel call for ending the war are threatened with dismissal. Katz calls them a "noisy marginal" group that doesn't represent IDF soldiers or Israeli Public. I'd imagine the hostage families and all the Israeli protesters plus a load of IDF soldiers would disagree. A lot.

Nearly 1,000 Israel Air Force current and former reservists published a letter on Thursday morning calling for the return of all hostages even at the cost of ending the war, writing that "currently, the war serves mainly political and personal interests" and that continuing it "does not contribute to any of its declared goals and will lead to the deaths of the hostages, Israeli soldiers and innocent civilians, and to the attrition of the IDF reserve forces."

Following the letter's publication, IDF Chief of Staff Eyal Zamir and Israel Air Force commander Maj. Gen. Tomer Bar announced they would dismiss active duty reservists who signed it from service. The IDF said that most signatories are not active reservists, but did not disclose an exact number.

Israeli Defense Minister Israel Katz rejected the letter, saying the signatories "attempted to undermine the legitimacy of the just war that the IDF is leading in Gaza." Netanyahu said statements like those made in the letter weaken the IDF and strengthen Israel's enemies in a time of war, and are "unforgivable." The premier called the signatories a "noisy, marginal group" which is being "mobilized for one goal – to topple the government," adding that it does not represent IDF soldiers or the Israeli public.

Finally, if being a member of the press corps in Gaza is a death sentence, as you claim, I would argue that Israel is acting in the best interests of the international press by restricting access to Gaza. Or would you prefer to see members of the Western press dying because of Hamas's actions, simply because it would benefit the anti-Israel narrative?

What on earth are you talking about - do you think Hamas are the ones killing all the press?

I don't know if you are misinformed or trying to make up your own reality.

This is an interesting piece from the BBC.

As a 13 year old, he was sentenced to 9.5 years in prison for attempted murder - he had no legal representation and was treated abominably.

But it was the addendum that caught my attention:

Last month, a 17-year-old Palestinian boy from the occupied West Bank who was held in an Israeli jail for six months without charge died after collapsing, in unclear circumstances. Walid Khalid Ahmed became the first Palestinian child to die in Israeli detention.

An Israeli doctor who observed the post-mortem examination found that he was suffering from extreme malnutrition.

I'm not going to defend war crimes. But the fact remains that as long as there are a variety of countries (e.g. Iran) and groups (of which Hamas is just one of many) Israel is likely to have legitimate casus-belli for some time.

And yes, it does indeed look like Israelis were involved in the creation of Hamas, and I agree that that was an epic mistake. But considering that any serious person looking at this (including the researcher behind CaspianReport, whose video I shared earlier) considers Israel's struggle for survival to be like "juggling grenades" then epic mistakes are going to happen.