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Donald Trump the Megathread part II - mod warnings in OP, Updated 18/03/25

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,031 ✭✭✭✭briany


    It would be unacceptable, but it's not as if it would be the first time that the US undertook a roundly condemned invasion.

    If it did happen, it would likely happen after the US left NATO and completed its geopolitical realignment. There's not a lot that Europe could do about it militarily. Some economic sanctions and vigorous head shaking.

    But I don't think it would be the end of western civisation, unless European leaders completely threw in the towel. It would just underscore the US's leaving of it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,687 ✭✭✭✭LambshankRedemption


    Denmark is in NATO, so NATO would have to mobilize under the unlikely event of an invasion. I don't see it happening to be honest. I think this talk is Trump trying misdirection.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,802 ✭✭✭JJayoo


    Think about how easy it would be for the US to go into partnership with Greenland if they weren't run by an absolute loon.

    56,000 people so maybe 30,000 people people eligible to vote in a referendum for independence, them you will have a 50/50 split so realistically you might only need to influence 5000 people to vote for independence and you have a billionaire who controls the biggest social media site and unlimited funds from the US to promise investment, it would have been incredibly simple



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,031 ✭✭✭✭briany


    Article 5 of NATO says that in the event of an attack on a member country, other NATO countries should take measures they deem necessary to provide aid. It doesn't mandate military action, per se. That's just one option.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,146 ✭✭✭chasm


    Rubio on X

    "The United States will not tolerate any third-countries or their oil companies producing, extracting, or exporting oil and oil-related products with the Maduro regime in Venezuela. This is a regime that has consistently stolen elections, pillaged from its people, and colluded with our enemies. Any country that allows its companies to produce, extract, or export from Venezuela will be subject to new tariffs, and any companies will be subject to sanctions."



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,936 ✭✭✭✭Frank Bullitt


    What’s interesting about this, Venezuela produces the type of oil that refineries in the states use, the other major supplier being Canada, who they have a trade war with.

    Where exactly do they think they can get the raw materials to survive this?



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 16,893 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manic Moran


    You would think, but we don't.

    Officially Signal is not an authorised form of communication for doing Army business, but everyone up to the highest level is perfectly aware that it is the default for anything which isn't classified simply because it's the most practical way of communicating: We can get the job done, or we can complain about how we've no system for doing it. I've not been in a unit in years which doesn't use Signal as the de-facto method of co-ordination. There are systems for use in classified environments which do work quite well, but the catch with that is that they are only of use when you're sitting…well… in a classified environment, which is a very defined location.

    That said, someone obviously wasn't paying attention when they made the group chat!



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 16,893 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manic Moran


    It was certainly stupid, which goes back to the issue of possible censure by Congress. Will heads roll? I doubt it, though the National Security Council and Armed Services Committees have both started looking into it, to start with.

    https://www.axios.com/2025/03/24/congress-yemen-signal-hegseth

    I doubt there's anyone in the military chain of command who doesn't use Signal. It's been an issue identified at the J6 level for years, but nobody's done anything about it yet, probably because there is no affordable alternative. Still, Four months ago the FBI recommended that people (everyone, not just government) move to apps like Signal because it was considered more secure.

    https://www.npr.org/2024/12/17/nx-s1-5223490/text-messaging-security-fbi-chinese-hackers-security-encryption

    The Biden administration had started moving to Signal some time before that. Originally sparingly, but then in the last year became heavier users specifically because of the perceived security against Chinese and Iranian espionage. They seem to have been a bit better about verifying who they added, though.

    This is five days ago, the app is ubiquitous now.

    https://fortune.com/2025/03/20/government-workers-using-encrypted-messaging-apps-signal/

    There were two major claims in the Clinton case. That she used a private server and not a public one, and that she had classified materials.

    Legal opinion on the first was that the use of a private server was not contraordained if records were being kept pursuant to the Federal Records Act. Signal is end-to-end encryption, basically a VPN, and it was presumably between government devices, so that implies compliance with the FRA.

    The other claim, of classified materials, is harder to validate on either side. However, the definitions of what should be considered classified is found here. https://sgp.fas.org/library/quist2/chap_7.html

    From the definitions and examples found there and what I've been able to gather from the articles, the information would have been considered at least "Confidential." That doesn't trigger the requirements of a SCIF or secret networks. Maybe some information would have been "Secret", I presume the investigating agencies will come to a conclusion on that.

    Regardless, even the most secure system is going to fail when someone does something stupid.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,664 ✭✭✭kyote00


    strange bed fellows…. Signal founders being who they are….

    Post edited by kyote00 on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,074 ✭✭✭skimpydoo


    it’s also being reported that one of the people in the signal group chat was in Moscow whilst they were chatting. This has to have heads rolling, Hegseth, Waltz and the person in Moscow has to go.

    If this happened under Biden, the Republicans and their maga supporters would be kicking up a big stink about this.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,049 ✭✭✭✭everlast75


    IMG_20250325_064041_248.jpg

    He's denying the story, even though the evidence exists.

    Congress should hold a hearing, produce the evidence and then call for his resignation.

    The only thing this admin does better than cruelty, is incompetence.

    Elect a clown... Expect a circus



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,355 ✭✭✭Billy Mays




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 914 ✭✭✭Dr Robert


    It's falling apart already. No surprise to anyone.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,784 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    The two big issues are that they used it for classified information and that they invited a reporter into it.

    Like you, I understand that these guys use something like signal. We've seen politicians in the UK and Ireland using whatsapp. It makes sense to have a messaging system where they can coordinate. But sharing classified information in it is a huge mistake. And inviting a reporter in is just bizarre.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,052 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    Manic, this is far more serious than somebody doing something stupid. Heads gave to roll over this. Trump should have called for an immediate investigation, since he apparently hadn't been informed, and a complete review of all communications since the administration took over needs to be undertaken to ascertain if other material has been handled in such a careless and irresponsible way.

    Had this, or other information, gone to the wrong hands or the journalist in this case could have reported the details before the attack, it could have placed US lives in direct danger.

    For a military person such as yourself to simple wave away such a security breach as something stupid and by your post clearly looking to downplay it is staggering.

    Everyone in the military should be requesting guarantees that such a stupid mistake cannot happen again.

    Have details of military codes, secret locations, passwords, personal details, training plans etc also been leaked?

    It would seem reasonable that this, or other people, have been privy to far more information that what we have just learned about.

    And POTUS and rge defence secretary don't give a damn and want to attack the journalist. A US citizen who has done an incredible act that will hopefully lead to saving military personel lives in the future.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,234 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Putin is laughing his hole off

    Which one of the following countries that Trump has openly threatened will he declare full scale war on first?

    Canada

    Mexico

    Greenland

    Panama

    Venezuela

    Yemen

    Iran

    Not to mention that he's escalated support for Israel's attacks in Gaza and Lebanon while withdrawing all military aid from defending Ukraine.

    What a dope

    Chomsky(2017) on the Republican party

    "Has there ever been an organisation in human history that is dedicated, with such commitment, to the destruction of organised human life on Earth?"



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,928 ✭✭✭thatsdaft


    Where are them checks and balances?

    IMG_5751.jpeg


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,366 ✭✭✭Oscar_Madison
    #MEGA MAKE EUROPE GREAT AGAIN


    “Congress should hold a hearing, produce the evidence and then call for his resignation.”

    But they won’t. This has likely already blown over - and we know MAGA can stand such heat anyway - besides, it was a Ukrainian / Canadian/ Irish hacker that got the journalist added- did you not know that? 😄



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,928 ✭✭✭thatsdaft


    Only a few days ago the same clowns said they will hold investigations on whom in pentagon leaked that Musk is being show war plans

    IMG_5752.jpeg

    only for the same clown to then share warplans with journalist

    But hey I see the feeble reply from MAGAts is “but but her emails”



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,921 ✭✭✭spacecoyote


    Yes, the journalist himself seems to have a greater duty of care than the people in the positions of power.

    He removes names of anyone who could be risked with their mention.

    He removed himself from the group, when arguably, he could have stayed in it, stayed silent, and potentially picked up more intel.

    Manic may be framing it in reasonable language, but it's a serious "drank the koolaid" type of reaction.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,366 ✭✭✭Oscar_Madison
    #MEGA MAKE EUROPE GREAT AGAIN


    So we’ll take it that they did indeed share war plans with Musk - and MAGA’s only concern is who pulled its pants down and exposed them for putting 100s of millions of lives at risk



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,049 ✭✭✭✭everlast75


    In case anyone cares about how Fox are covering this....

    Jesse Watters: “You ever try to start a group text, you’re adding people, and you accidentally add the wrong person. All of a sudden your aunt Mary knows all your raunchy plans for the bachelor party. Well that kind of happened today with the Trump administration.”

    (For "Aunt Mary" read "journalist")

    (For "bachelor party" read "bombing Yemen")

    Elect a clown... Expect a circus



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,366 ✭✭✭Oscar_Madison
    #MEGA MAKE EUROPE GREAT AGAIN


    Dumbed down and trivialised - nothing to see here. Move on or we’ll get the water cannons out- actually feic that, we’ll get the canons out.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,007 ✭✭✭tinytobe


    It's sadly how "democracy" works these days. The Brexit referendum and Cambridge Analytica was pretty much the blueprint for that and the Brits fell for it.

    Or in this case, Article 5 of the "Rest of NATO without the US". Well, the "Rest of NATO without the US" wouldn't be credible if they didn't come to the aid on a member country. It'll be the end, of it.

    Trump's aim is to destroy bigger organization which he deems he can't do business with, at least in his mind. Whether it's NATO or the EU, it doesn't matter to him.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,335 ✭✭✭Field east


    what about the town hall meetings and other outlets - especially radio , some Tv stations, u tubes- that provide a PLATFORM to those that are ‘not happy’ , to put it mildly, with the way things are going . REMEMBER that close to 50% did not vote for Trump. AndREMEMBER that those that did not vote but could have might be more Enthuased the next time - so they are still there and might be now interested in voicing their concerns

    So all of the above are PUSH BACK opportunities to KEEP THE RESISTANCE ALIVE



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,984 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    They are in spin control today. Not that they need to be, MAGA is populist and I don't see this making waves with the average American or their base.

    If I were Vance, Hegseth or the rest I wouldn't be the slightest bit concerned about this, just attack the journalist/clinton/whatever and move on



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,032 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    We can get the job done, or we can complain about how we've no system for doing it. 

    It's a serious indictment of the US Military and Dept of Defence given the trillions budgeted to them in the last 20 years if they have to use a private sector communication app for the purpose of simple communication between team members.

    I mean, in a time when Elon Musk is claiming DOGE is finding wasted billions everywhere it looks, this is another indicator of where he should be sending his minions if he is serious about finding waste. Not that he will, if the Pentagon not having passed an audit in years wasn't enough to trigger a serious investigation in that respect, then this isn't going to be either.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,596 ✭✭✭francois


    It also displays the contempt Vance and Co. have for Europe. If ever proof were needed that Europe needs now to treat anything from the US with suspicion, and be wary of sharing intelligence at this stage



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,032 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Did anyone else notice that twice now in the last few days, Trump has pleaded ignorance to distance himself from the actions of his administration.

    At the weekend, he claimed he didn't sign an executive order associated with sending people to El Salvador which a judge had an issue with it (this after saying Biden's pardons didn't count because he didn't physically sign them) even though his Press Secretary had said repeatedly including on Fox News that he had signed it.

    And now yesterday where 2 hours after the story of the journalist invited in to a war room messaging chat broke, Trump said when asked that he knew nothing about it.

    Classic Trump of course, worry about himself and throw whoever he can under the bus. A colossal f*ck by his administration.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,871 ✭✭✭✭aloyisious


    On several points of the transmission of the information by Waltz; is there some-one within the small Trump Admin team with a name similar to the Atlantic journalist to cause such an error? If not, why/how did the journalist's name get on to Waltz list of names he would be sharing classified information to? Has anyone in Waltz Admin group thought yet to ask him why he had an Atlantic journalist name on his phone contacts list in the first place?

    The journalist seems to have been very surprised to have gotten all the texts so it's reasonable to assume that he was not regularly in contact with Waltz.

    One cannot fail to praise the journalist for not revealing the names of persons at life risk while getting the facts that there was a major leak of classified information by a member of the Trump Admin group without the knowledge of and permission of the person who officially decides what is, and what is not, classified information.



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