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Dublin Bus fleet

2

Comments

  • #32
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 23,612 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123278243#Comment_123278243

    Well I'd guess these might be even worse for eating tires, what with all the added extra weight of batteries.

    On the other hand you'd likely save on fuel versus Diesel and brake pads and other maintenance parts, so I'd guess it might balance out.

    I do wonder if it might be worth them doing a special order of 50 or 100 tri-axles, while continuing with the order of the EW's as well. Add much needed capacity on the busiest routes.

    I wonder if they might prefer a Wright version (which doesn't currently exist) rather then the ADL or BYD options given recent experience.



  • #33
    p_haugh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,501 ✭✭✭p_haugh


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123278243#Comment_123278243

    They had issues with "eating" the rear tyres mainly because DB went for a spec that lacked rear-axle turning, which drastically reduced the lifespan of the tyres as a result.



  • #34
    AX636
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 115 ✭✭AX636


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123278637#Comment_123278637

    Volvo at the time had the single wheel in the middle, while the Dennis equivalent had the rear wheel at the rear with the double in the middle



  • #35
    dublincc2
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 468 ✭✭dublincc2


    Regarding the stupid sloped windscreen (which looks worse every time you see it once you’ve got to recognise it compared to the standard fronts) will they ever remove this requirement? What is the purpose of still having it on the buses? There aren’t reports from the UK of drivers being dazzled by the glare and causing accidents, so it seems pointless cosmetic overkill. At extra expense too.



  • #36
    mikeybhoy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,589 ✭✭✭mikeybhoy


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123280765#Comment_123280765

    The EWs have the standard front same as the BE VWD and the electroliners in the UK. I guess it's sloped enough anyway to suit DBs spec



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  • #37
    dublincc2
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 468 ✭✭dublincc2


    Another confusing issue is the fact that Dublin Bus ordered pre-facelift Gemini 3 (the SG class) and added the proprietary windscreen while from 2015 onwards the Gemini 3 was built with the StreetDeck ‘stealth’ front end which has the windscreen sloped anyway. It’s possible they designed the windscreen to be like that integrally because of DB.

    So why didn’t DB order any of the post-facelift Gemini 3s which had their windscreen as standard and instead keep the original model (SG) and modify it? Literally makes no sense why they kept going with the pre-facelift last 2015, especially when many cities I’ve been in such as Edinburgh have them as standard and they seem to be a much more comfortable bus.



  • #38
    john boye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,742 ✭✭✭john boye


    DB like standardisation, they always have done. These "issues" you keep raising really are very trivial in the grand scheme of public transport issues.



  • #39
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,700 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123287516#Comment_123287516

    I’m pretty sure that the desire to have sloped windscreens came through the union vehicle design committees.

    Given that’s coming directly from the people who are actually driving the buses, there clearly were issues.

    As you say it’s a minor point and to be honest I’d take the views of the drivers on something like this over some random person who thinks they are “stupid”!



  • #40
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,700 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    As for the fleet, well I understand that DB took the decision to repaint EVs in TFI colours for the simple reason that they won’t have enough EWs in service to displace them until towards the end of next year. External fleet presentation is something that DB have taken some care with - with the four year repaint cycle

    There will be more charging facilities coming on stream shortly, but given the needs for power upgrades and potentially planning permission for the substations, it’s going to be a slow process.

    All of this, along with the need for more buses as BusConnects is rolled out, means that the older buses will likely be around until the end of 2026.



  • #41
    john boye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,742 ✭✭✭john boye


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123287721#Comment_123287721

    As I've said before, I wasn't doubting the reasons for them. I'm saying if someone's issue with them is purely aesthetical then it's not really an issue at all.



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  • #42
    mikeybhoy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,589 ✭✭✭mikeybhoy


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123287721#Comment_123287721

    All I was saying was it doesn't seem to be an issue for 1,000s of ALXs in the UK without the sloped windscreen. If the DB design was so good why didn't ADL modify the design for all future ALXs. I just think it's strange I've driven ex DB AV/AXs with a private operator including at night and I can't say I noticed that the glare was any better than other buses I've driven.



  • #43
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,700 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123287946#Comment_123287946

    I was agreeing with you! :-)

    The other poster that you replied to seems to be obsessed by it!



  • #44
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,700 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123287964#Comment_123287964

    Well that’s what vehicle design committees are for! :-)



  • #45
    john boye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,742 ✭✭✭john boye


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123288065#Comment_123288065

    Yeah sorry I see that now.

    And yeah it's a strange hill to die on!



  • #46
    BusGuy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 197 ✭✭BusGuy


    EV93 on the 44, weird allocation



  • #47
    hfjm20
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 50 ✭✭hfjm20


    Does anyone know if the EA’s are coming back anytime soon?



  • #48
    BusGuy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 197 ✭✭BusGuy


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123327561#Comment_123327561

    If we see any signs of trial running of the EA's (O spine for example), we could see them return.



  • #49
    hfjm20
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 50 ✭✭hfjm20


    Do DB have any plans to invest in new hydrogen or other battery powered buses in the future? Or is the NTA's framework agreement for 800 buses with Wrightbus the only thing planned for the moment?



  • #50
    goingnowhere
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,366 ✭✭✭goingnowhere


    NTA owns and funds the fleet



  • #51
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 23,612 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123329389#Comment_123329389

    There is also a framework for 200 single decker battery EV buses with the NTA, Enviro200EV's (The EA/D class).

    I wouldn't expect to see any hydrogen buses in city services, batteries work better for such services. They did buy 3 hydrogen buses for BE to use on commuter services. They are used, but we haven't heard much about them since they entered service. I don't think they have been very successful, I think they have found it hard to source enough green hydrogen for them and the cost of it has been crazy high, making them fairly uneconomical for now.



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  • #52
    p_haugh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,501 ✭✭✭p_haugh


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123330342#Comment_123330342

    The HWDs are only really used on a peak-time 105X to/from Dublin, with the odd 103X done. Looking at bus times, they seem to regularly spend upwards of a month or so off the road. I work near the Mercedes Yard by the Naas Road and theres regularly a HWD parked up in the yard (They also need to go to BOC gases which is also just off the Naas Road in order to refuel)



  • #53
    mikeybhoy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,589 ✭✭✭mikeybhoy


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123330652#Comment_123330652

    DB had a single decker that used have to be fuelled down in the docks. I'd imagine it's very awkward to operate a bus that can't be fuelled in the depot.



  • #54
    hfjm20
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 50 ✭✭hfjm20


    It's a bit of a shame about the charging situation because hydrogen would seem to be better in most ways than the battery, environmentally speaking anyway



  • #55
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 23,612 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123332956#Comment_123332956

    Hydrogen is much worse then batteries environmentally speaking!

    It takes about 3 to 4 times as much electricity to generate say 100km worth of Hydrogen as it does to charge a battery with 100km of range. Given that currently about 60% of our electricity comes from gas, that obviously isn't great. Now our grid will get cleaner in time, but hydrogen will always be less efficient.

    Of course that is best case scenario, green hydrogen, unfortunately most hydrogen is produced using fossil fuels in the oil and gas industry and is pretty terrible for the environment. 99% of hydrogen is produced in this polluting manner.

    There is also the issue of how difficult hydrogen is to store and how damaging it is to the environment when it leaks.

    If you are concerned about mining, the battery industry has made massive strides to remove/reduce the more troublesome chemicals from their production. Though it is worth noting that Hydrogen fuel cells also use rare earth metals and other mined materials like platinum, so they aren't free from mining either.

    Generally speaking, batteries are better where they work. Hydrogen is second best, best used for applications where batteries don't work.



  • #56
    goingnowhere
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,366 ✭✭✭goingnowhere


    But if you use Hydrogen you also have batteries as part of the package



  • #57
    ITV2
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 483 ✭✭ITV2


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123332668#Comment_123332668
    82458830_10220596149031505_5953600751371550720_n.jpg

    The gas powered bus VL6 seen when new in June 1998



  • #58
    hfjm20
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 50 ✭✭hfjm20


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123333785#Comment_123333785

    Would hydrogen be better suited to intercity routes? I assume that's why its been placed on the 105X



  • #59
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 23,612 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123339019#Comment_123339019

    Yes, for the moment it would be the only zero emission option for intercity as batteries wouldn’t really have the range.

    Having said that, I wouldn’t be sure if that would be the case in a few years. Batteries are developing so quickly and charging speeds developing so quickly that they may overtake that application too!

    A big development happening at the moment is a new charging standard for trucks and buses called megawatt charging standard. It supports up to 3 megawatt charging speeds! At those sort of speeds you could recharge even semi truck batteries in just 5 minutes! This is still a developing area, but definitely one to watch.



  • #60
    hfjm20
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 50 ✭✭hfjm20


    I wish the NTA looked more into the Volvo BZLs. They seem to be quite popular over in the UK at the minute



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  • #61
    AX636
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 115 ✭✭AX636


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123353549#Comment_123353549

    Don't think it was an option at the time



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