Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Donald Trump the Megathread part II - mod warnings in OP, Updated 18/03/25

1369370372374375736

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,933 ✭✭✭ArthurDayne


    This is it really. He said Zelensky was a dictator due to not having elections and now suddenly every MAGA-head you see posting anywhere online has suddenly developed a very robust opinion on the absolute inviolable sanctity of holding elections during a time where your country is under active military invasion and bombardment and much of your electorate has been dispersed internally and across Europe — not to mention of course the constitutional bars in Ukraine on having elections during wartime which pre-dates Zelensky's tenure.

    I even saw someone saying how Winston Churchill even had a wartime election that saw him voted out — an election which took place after Germany had surrendered. This is not a hard thing to fact check independently, but delivered with the characteristic confidence and brashness of the uninformed.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,042 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Horrific story from the US yesterday. A 6th grader in Texas took her own life because her classmates kept bullying her telling her that her parents would be deported and that she would end up alone. She was 11 years old.

    People were deported before Trump came along. Who knows what her parents situation was or whether that would have ever happened. But this is probably a scenario that is more likely to be happening in every state across the country as Trump and his administration has dramatically increased the likelihood for harmful rhetoric to be used as an abusive weapon.

    I hope the parents of the kids who were doing the bullying feel guilt at having created an environment where their children felt that this was acceptable behaviour.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,728 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    MAGA don't feel comfortable with fact checking though.

    I wonder why.

    :/



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,040 ✭✭✭✭briany


    I blame the invention of the Apple iPhone.

    Really - before that thing came out, people had to know how to work a desktop or laptop in order to get on the Internet in any serious way. The iPhone just made things too easy. Every c/t under 60 was on it after that, tweeting and facebooking. It was the second Eternal September.

    It wasn't long after that when pub chat went from talking about football, spouses and work to, "Heeur - didje ever hear of de Illooominati??".

    As for the corporate media, there is now a completely separate media environment populated by self-sustaining thought bubbles. Corporate media can hold power as accountable as it wants, but the impact won't be remotely as severe as decades past. Besides, corporate media needs ratings to survive, and it's been a constant battle to maintain relevance since the emergence of so-called 'new media'. That has meant copying the new media playbook in many ways, such as promoting more extreme points of view, such as with Fox News in the US, or BBC's more nicey-nice approach of giving 'all voices a chance to be heard'.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,933 ✭✭✭ArthurDayne


    100% — but the sad thing is that the appeal of that show is precisely the fact it doesn't delve any more than skin deep into an issue to make it broadly appealing and "balanced". I get a sense a lot of people follow it because they feel like they're just watching a mirror image of themselves who can almost feed their world view back to them in a funny way. They think "Joe is actually a smart thoughtful guy despite what people might think of him — just like me — just because he isn't some whizkid intellectual". It's kind of a comfort blanket, and I don't mean that in a judgey way, I think Rogan's podcast has just tapped into a space where people are saturated in online debate, so-called culture wars etc, and that podcast just feels like a bunch of dudes just slowing everything down and making it funny and relatable.

    I find that more forgivable and understandable than the likes of Ben Shapiro, Douglas Murray etc who pose themselves as intellectuals but rarely go any deeper than a centimetre beneath the surface of complexity on an issue but people seem to believe they're watching the cutting edge of conservative intelligence.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,856 ✭✭✭✭Red Silurian


    Estonia is a NATO country, even if the USA leave NATO (a distinct possibility) there isn't a hope the Russians will risk it. Georgia might be a different story, they already occupy about 20% of Georgia so it would be easy pickings. Georgia's potential EU membership might come into play as well



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 30,593 CMod ✭✭✭✭johnny_ultimate


    As controversial as it may be in some quarters, there's a lot to be said for actual peace talks around Ukraine, even if a peace deal would almost certainly involve some concessions to Russia (who are very much an imperialist invader). I think any principled anti-war voice would support an end to the death and destruction, as it can't just drag on inevitably. There's no doubt Ukraine is struggling, and it's been three years. Something has to give, and Europe does need to accept that at some point.

    The problem is Trump's petty, vindictive and bizarrely pro-Russian stance means the US has now all but scuppered the possibility of a fair deal (or whatever would constitue 'fair' in these innately unfair circumstances). The Republicans will almost all fall in line with whatever shite Trump is peddling on Truth Social. The hypocrisy of him calling Zelenskyy a 'dictator' at the same time he's having a love fest with Putin is immediately obvious to anyone being remotely honest.

    And never for a second should anyone buy into Trump being truly 'anti-war' or 'Donald the Dove', even if he does push for an end to some conflicts. The man has been bigging up his ethnic cleansing plan for the last few weeks and threatening to invade or annex various allies. There's a good chance his cosying up to Putin is simply a play to alienate and antagonise China. He's a power-hungry, wannabe autocrat, perfectly summed up by the whole 'king' business in the last 24 hours.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 41,713 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    But Americans have had traditional media, especially Fox News, pushing their own agenda well before the internet and most people got their news from partisan newspapers and partisan networks then. All the internet and the smartphone really did was change who was pushing the partisan narrative and the degree of extremism.

    You are correct that the internet changed things fundamentally. My point was that corporate media has been at the same game and pioneered exactly the same things you see with grifters like Rogan, Taint, and Peterson.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,040 ✭✭✭✭briany


    The big danger with regards to Russia isn't in a conventional military conflict. It would surely take them a fairly long time to rebuild their military to the point where they felt reasonably confident of getting something out of a land war vs a prepared and hostile enemy, such as those states on their western fringe.

    No, the bigger danger comes with the possibility of USA leaving NATO and taking their nuclear umbrella with them. I don't say for a second that Putin would try to nuke Europe, but this would suddenly become a glaring high card in any game of tough talk and brinkmanship that Europe/the EU wanted to play with Russia. This isn't to mention the hybrid warfare tactics would try to employ, stoking up tensions where possible in the Baltic states and Poland.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,856 ✭✭✭✭Red Silurian


    The US isn't the only nuclear armed nation in NATO though. I think their loss to the organisation is vasly overstated and NATO would be quite a strong force without them

    Also China has shown in the past that the use of nuclear weapons makes them very nervous. Some say China are largely holding Russia back from using them in Ukraine



  • Advertisement
  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 29,598 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    There is nothing inherently wrong with peace talks. The problem the entire time has been that Russia has steadfastly refused to back away from its maximalist aims. And now Trump is validating them.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,040 ✭✭✭✭briany


    No, the USA is not the only nuclear power, but Russia has way more warheads than the rest of the NATO countries combined - approx 600 vs approx 6000.

    This is only one aspect. We have to also remember that Europe is only three bad election results away from a fundamentally changed situation. If Germany, France and UK were to flip to more pro-Russian governments in the form of AfD, National Rally and Reform, respectively, Putin would be very happy. There is more than one way to wage war upon Europe, and some of them don't even involve the firing of a gun. Just armies of trolls pumping out disinformation.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,619 ✭✭✭eightieschewbaccy


    I'd also have a low level of trust in serious negotiations from Russia while they continue to throw critics of the war out windows.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,590 ✭✭✭McFly85


    Peace talks are to be encouraged, but what’s happening between the US and Russia right now is purely performative. He is saying what Putin wants him to say, will claim that he has negotiated a great deal(that gives Russia everything they want) and will claim they’re belligerent war mongers when it’s inevitably turned down. Any perceived hard-man mask has slipped and he’s clearly a Putin stooge. And even some MAGA types seem to be concerned about it - the conservative subreddit has plenty of people questioning his statements this week where previously they would have all staunchly supported him.



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,759 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    Exactly - I just took a look at the FoxNews website and there is not a SINGLE mention of Ukraine or Russia on the homepage.

    The single, largest and most consequential Global news story right now and Fox have NOTHING for their viewers.

    Just crazy.

    All the articles are about how much money DOGE is going to give back to the hard working voters or how some "liberal lunatic" was shut down by some good ole boys or whatever.

    Not excusing these people at all , but if all they read/watch is Fox News they may not even know that there is anything happening to even prompt them to look elsewhere for more info.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 30,593 CMod ✭✭✭✭johnny_ultimate


    No question that US-Russia only talks are a farce at best, total capitulation at worst.

    The only slight positive I can see from the whole affair is that European leaders are now seriously talking about what post-invasion Ukraine looks like. As someone who is defiantly anti-war, I don't think EU countries propping up an indefinite war is a good outcome for anyone, even if Ukraine is deterimined to fight on. I do think an end to the invasion will regrettably involve some concessions to Russia, but Europe is much more deterimined to fight for a better 'deal' for the Ukrainian people than the supposed dealmaker-in-chief.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 41,713 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    I just had a look and you are correct. I clicked on a headline about alleged government waste and it reads like a Trump presidency press announcement.

    There is a chicken and egg element to this. Who's responsible for Fox News? The Fox News owners and staff or the people who pay for it and justify its advertising revenue. It is a little bit disturbing. I found out about two decades ago that my Da had a visa for the US sorted but bottled it last minute. He'd be a perfect fit for the MAGA demographic.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,107 ✭✭✭MrMusician18


    The centrist parties in Europe therefore then need to look at what is making the right so appealing and look to emulate at least some of their policies.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,790 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    The thing that Russia is good at is pushing limits. Do they launch all all out full scale invasion? Or do they just have a small border raid. Do they blockade a port?

    They could easily make it so that an individual country feel it badly, but it's not a full scale invasion. And at each step push it a little bit further. And when the country invokes article 5, the rest of nato would be split as to whether or not to respond.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 41,713 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    No, they don't. You don't beat Nazis by turning into Nazis.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,627 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    Can't wait to see centrist parties run on a platform of "Immigrants are the cause of all your issues, not the people profiting off you" and "We'll fix everything for you on Day One, and start making excuses about why things are actually going to get worse for you on Day Two"



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,808 ✭✭✭Hoop66


    What is making right-wing parties in Europe so appealing is, mostly, Russian disinformation.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,754 ✭✭✭yagan


    Russian disinformation being targeted towards specific individuals via US owned social media platforms.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,107 ✭✭✭MrMusician18


    Do you beat them by staying exactly as you are? Like it or not, a substantial portion of the population have shifted right which has created a bloc that's now hard to ignore. They see issues as a result of migration for example that are being ignored.

    The choice is to create some mild right policies to pick off voters at the centre right edge or leave them alone for the hard right to capture.

    This is your problem, according to you everyone and everything to the right is an extremist, a nazi. No wonder people are being lost to the populists.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,107 ✭✭✭MrMusician18


    That kind of facetious dismissive nonsense is what got the US where it is and is the engine behind the rise of the right here and across Europe.

    Our young people are more right wing than any previous generation. This is largely down to the housing crisis which is a supply and demand problem. Politicians and policymakers talk endlessly about the supply side issues but not that demand is through the roof; for which inward migration is a major contributor.

    That said Trump seems committed to causing a global recession so perhaps the demand side will fix itself.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 41,713 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    Have they? Based on what?

    The Conservative party lurched to the right and got the worst drubbing in its entire history.

    Then there was this moment when an actual Holocaust survivor called out the odious Suella Braverman on her hateful othering:

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,802 ✭✭✭✭fullstop


    A handful of nuclear warheads could effectively wipe most of the planet, so 600 or 6000 is a bit of a moot point IMO



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,436 ✭✭✭✭rossie1977


    The housing crisis has been caused by 40 years of right wing neo liberal laissez-faire policies across Western Europe. In UK there are millions of less social housing units than in 1980 despite big rise in population.

    I do find it funny that in order to "fix" the right wing policies of last 45 years implemented in US, Australia and Western Europe by Reagan, Thatcher and Liberal Party and built on by every following government, the answer is to vote in a much more extreme right wing populist fascistic agenda..that will surely work lol



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,436 ✭✭✭✭rossie1977


    A single megaton bomb over NYC or London is enough to absolutely cripple the world economy.

    There wouldn't be enough emergency services in the UK or the entire eastern seaboard of the US to deal with the casualties in either scenario.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,240 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Its down to framing in the media, and the framing in the media is done to cover up the fact that there are tens of thousands of empty buildings all around Ireland right now that are being left empty because its in the owners interest that property and rental prices are high.

    The state actually needs more migration to fill the jobs in the construction sector do that we can actually build the houses we need. And the government should directly invest in state owned social housing instead of distorting the private rental market and out bidding private renters.

    The rise of the alt right is directly related to the changes in media consumption and them blaming migrants as a distraction for the corporate buyout of irish properties

    Chomsky(2017) on the Republican party

    "Has there ever been an organisation in human history that is dedicated, with such commitment, to the destruction of organised human life on Earth?"



Advertisement