Hamas strike on Israel - mod warning in OP updated 19/10/23

Seems Netanyahu and Gallant can go for pizza after all. I'd imagine the EU aren't happy with them breaking ranks.

Haaretz:
The Italian government won't enforce the International Criminal Court's arrest warrants against Netanyahu and against former Defense Minister Yoav Gallant, the country's foreign and justice ministers said. According to their statement, the Italian government received the necessary legal counseling to offer immunity from the warrants if the Israeli politicians visit.

Or Israel.

It's destroyed Gaza, fundamentally weakened Hamas. I'd say Israel has achieved more of its aims, at massive civilian cost.

Their reputation, whatever remained is gone though too.

I decided to skip it when planning holidays for next month.

But to call a spade a spade. Hamas invaded Israel and killed men women and children , apart from the rapes. It set up rocket launcher in civilian areas in Gaza attempting to use their own people as human shields.

Israel took out the launchers and the people Hamas used as shields got killed. Only ones to blame here are Hamas.

Israel let in food convoys. Hamas stole them for themselves and let the people starve. Israel stopped allowing them in as the only ones getting the food was their enemy , Hamas.

Alternatively Israel could have sat back not fired at Hamas sites thus allowing them unfettered opportunity to keep firing at civilians in Israel.

They could have let the convoys through and let Hamas keep taking the food to fuel it's fighters in the battle against Israel.

It wasn't going to happen and yet Israel are the bad guys in all this. It's a funny world 🤔

Given the israeli media are crediting the collapse of Bibi to pressure from Trump's camp, it really highlights how complicit the Biden administration has been in the genocide in Gaza. Trump is not even in office, and yet he can have his envoy pressure Bibi into taking a deal he doesn't want, which leaves Hamas intact. Biden did nothing except send israel more bombs to drop on schools and hospitals. If he had put any pressure on Bibi the israeli crimes would have been halted long ago.

Biden must go down as the worst President in modern US history.

As for Bibi, he long ago abandoned the hostages in favour of a war aim of destroying Hamas and ethnically cleansing the Palestinians from Gaza. Hamas has endured, and the Palestinians remain. Even by his own definition, Bibi and israel have lost.

In the Trump thread they seem to be trying to credit the Democrats. It's mind boggling. If Kamala was elected it would the same weakness continued, no ceasefire.

Not once did the Biden administration make any serious demands of Nethanyahu.

so ceasefire announced and will start on Sunday. Does this mean that Israel will bomb hard between now and Sunday so they can cram in the most damage they can before it ends.

(crude question I know)

Bibi is seemingly refusing to attend the inauguration of Trump because he is angry with Trump. It lines up with the reported pressure by the Trump camp on Bibi for this deal. One of the other causes of disagreement is apparently Iran. israel is desperate for the US to join it in launching a war on Iran after israel's own much heralded airstrikes were humiliatingly defeated by Iranian air defences last year. Trump is supposedly refusing to go to war with Iran, infuriating the israelis.

Given the political fallout from this defeat in Gaza, the awkward war crime charges against him and the inability to manage Trump effectively I wonder if Bibi can remain in power for much longer.

Because the killing won't stop.

Palestinians will continue to die from starvation, malnutrition, lack of medical facilities, lack of sanitation, a bullet from an IDF Sniper and so on.

Thinking that Israel will stop the killing of Palestinians is delusional. They been doing it non-stop for many many years.

Right, so even though there is a ceasefire, an Israeli withdrawal, and a new crowd running Gaza and its state services, you think there is some bloodlust deep inside the Israelis aka the 'Jews' and they will start killing Gazans within days or weeks.

Seriously, you need to relax with that rhetoric. You seem deeply unhappy that there is a ceasefire, a ceasefire that you and others have called for, for months and months.
Now that this ceasefire is here, you are negative about it. Its like you enjoy Gazans being killed because it serves your sense of virtue that the Israelis are just 'evil'.

Jaw jaw better than war war

I agree, but its a lesson the Palestinians have yet to learn, sadly.

Presumably it would revert back to the pre-October 7th state of being - no? The one in which at least 38 Palestinian kids were killed in the first 9 months of that year in the West Bank by the zionist military forces?

(About 150 more killed then over the next 9 months alone - again in the West Bank where Hamas have no authority or influence).

Is the discrepancy in understanding down to the fact that for some those 38 kids don't count and never did? As in if we go back to an average of 4+ dead kids per month killed by zionist military then that's the same as zero for some?

You see that's were we differ. Gazan citizens were killed as a direct result of Hamas actions. To ignore that is to ignore the elephant in the room

The Trump thread is a tab biased to put it mildly.

Who is responsible for the ceasefire happening now, Biden or Trump ?

If its Trump what did he say to Netanyahu to get him to agree to a ceasefire I wonder ?

Ive just seen Trump shared a video from Jeffrey Sachs lambasting Netanyahu and labelling him "a deep dark son of a bitch", wow that is interesting.

Hamas will be back. The leader in Qatar has already put out a speech saying he's proud of October 7 and vowing to do it again. Talk about bloodlust. Also saw videos of hamas fighters in Gaza celebrating their 'victory' by waving their guns around and vowing to destroy Israel. Nothing will ever change. Hopefully this ceasefire can hold longer than the others though before they start firing rockets into Israel again.