Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Forming the next Irish Government - policies and personalities

12467…103

Comments

  • #92
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74,075 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122933173#Comment_122933173

    If we are to believe what we are told that FF and FG are in genuine talks then there is a possibility that a government cannot be agreed in which case alternatives cone into play.
    So which is it? A genuine process of negotiation or a pre-ordained shadow dance with the outcome already agreed?



  • #93
    breezy1985
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,300 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122931154#Comment_122931154

    Oceania was at war with Eurasia: therefore Oceania had always been at war with Eurasia.



  • #94
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74,075 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122933270#Comment_122933270

    Plenty of doublethink here today.



  • #95
    Loafing Oaf
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,942 ✭✭✭✭Loafing Oaf


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122933084#Comment_122933084

    Sorry garbled that post a bit, I meant 'label' to refer more broadly to eurosceptic.

    “My own view would be that it may not align to the values of Fianna Fáil, and as a progressive, republican party that believes in equality and believes in the European project, that itself might rule out certain individuals or groups”

    https://twitter.com/businessposthq/status/1864917692014096618

    The 'or groups' there would suggest to me that broadside is at least partially aimed at Independent Ireland…



  • #96
    Cluedo Monopoly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,631 ✭✭✭✭Cluedo Monopoly


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122932752#Comment_122932752

    Not a hope.

    There is only one option FF+FG+Independents. That's a foregone conclusion despite the media pretending otherwise.

    Independents will be much easier to satisfy and keep under control. Independents don't do snap elections - too risky and costly. And they have plenty of FFG gene Independents. Lowry will make it happen.

    What are they doing in the Hyacinth House?



  • Advertisement
  • #97
    Loafing Oaf
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,942 ✭✭✭✭Loafing Oaf


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122933481#Comment_122933481

    Independents don't do snap elections - too risky and costly.

    Plus they're very unlikely to be walking out en masse. Even if one or two of them decided they'd had enough the show would carry on…



  • #98
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74,075 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122933481#Comment_122933481

    I have watched Ivana’s political career, I be gobsmacked if she isn’t angling for a ministerial job.



  • #99
    blanch152
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,980 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    This thread is hilarious.

    The poor Shinners are all over the place, offering themselves up as sacrificial lambs happy to be a mudguard for Fianna Fail by criticising FG for demanding a rotating Taoiseach.

    Have they no self-respect?



  • #100
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74,075 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122935389#Comment_122935389

    They won’t be decimating themselves to one TD by the skin of his or her teeth.



  • #101
    Larbre34
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,642 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122933628#Comment_122933628

    Well of course she is.

    But she's not going to be in government, which will make being a Minister a tad difficult.



  • Advertisement
  • #102
    Caquas
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,893 ✭✭✭Caquas


    Brendan O'Connor has a good commentary in the Sindo about the phony post-election conversations.

    The politicians pretend they are talking about policies and act insulted if they are asked about jobs. They are parroting words like "stability" and "respecting our mandate" but the whispers are all about Ministerial jobs and other prizes.

    Brendan points to another layer of phoniness where

    people who clearly can’t form a government seem to be having intense talks with each other about forming the government they can’t form.

    Then there's the weird Labour/SD tango. And the Independents coming together in a "conveniently-sized, single-purchase, ­multi-pack", purely coincidentally the ideal size for a majority government.

    I'm less convinced by Brendan's link to the terrible murder of a woman in Cork. This is not a case for "blame the government, blame society, blame everyone except the murderers because they are disadvantaged/disturbed/vulnerable".

    https://www.independent.ie/opinion/brendan-oconnor-one-simple-story-offers-us-a-bit-of-perspective-amid-ongoing-political-waffle/a1286713820.html   



  • #103
    pureza
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,066 ✭✭✭pureza


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122936004#Comment_122936004

    Sure he’s only giving words to what we all know anyway

    I think the pre reaching agreement tension between FF and FG is genuine enough though,they’re like rival GAA clubs,friendly over pints but mention the match or the championship aka the government and it’s a right old tussle



  • #104
    Caquas
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,893 ✭✭✭Caquas


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122936628#Comment_122936628

    We all know politicians are faking it when they pretend not to be interested in jobs.

    And most people know that talk of Lab/SD in government is fanciful. But why then is there is so much talk about this among politicians and in the media?



  • #105
    Brussels Sprout
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,849 ✭✭✭Brussels Sprout


    I was listening to the Paths to Power podcast at the weekend and Ivan Yates was saying that people within FF are furious about SOF announcing that he wouldn't mind a third go in the Ceann Comhairle's chair. He also said that he'd heard that Verona Murphy would be very interested in the job (which would help FF/FG by boosting their combined seats by 1).

    He'd no time for all the chatter about Labour or Soc Dems potentially being part of the government either. Kind of a "Look we know it's going to be the independents. Stop with all the other nonsense and focus on that instead" attitude.



  • #106
    Red Silurian
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,326 ✭✭✭✭Red Silurian


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122939047#Comment_122939047

    I don't think parties can apply the whip to the CC position and TDs have to get a free vote. Regardless they will need a majority of 5-6 not 1-2 if they want to get most of the legislation through so what SOF wants to do is his choice.

    The CC has also traditionally sided with the govt on tie-break issues and SOF has shown to do this when he was needed to also so I realy don't see why they are complaining

    He's absolutely right to dismiss the smaller parties, SF will offer a deal to FF in the coming days but FF are likely to reject it because it will contain things like fixing the health system, which I imagine would make Micheal Martin shudder



  • #107
    Caquas
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,893 ✭✭✭Caquas


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122939047#Comment_122939047

    Ivan Yates went up in my estimation as a pundit because he (uniquely?) called the election correctly, at least in respect of FF/FG. He's also right about the Lab/SD nonsense but there are good reasons FF/FG want to show willing.

    SOF is suffering from Speaker-syndrome which has spread from Westminster to Leinster House. A Speaker must act impartially and uphold the dignity of the House but they end up with no mandate while pompously believing they are above politics.

    SOF is now on manoeuvres for another term, contrary to his earlier statements and without his party's endorsement. He is looking for support from anywhere he can get it - even those who clashed bitterly with him in the past but who now want to weaken FF's voting strength. There are a number of experienced Independents who could do the job better i.e. act impartially without weakening the next government (e.g. Catherine Connolly, Leas-CC)

    The election of the CC is the first item of business for a new Dáil and its most important decision before the election of a Taoiseach (which MM believes won't happen this year, leaving us with an "acting" Government to start 2025). The secret ballot for CC, unique in the Standing Orders of the Oireachtas, takes it out of the control of the parties. If SOF has his way, FF/FG will have to buy off another Independent.



  • #108
    Bishop of hope
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,362 ✭✭✭Bishop of hope


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122939414#Comment_122939414

    But surely SOF would be a safe casting vote for any FF govt makeup. Your long winded post really is just another opposition deflect to what might be a favourable situation created by the incoming govt let alone at least one more guaranteed TD return for FF next Dail?



  • #109
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 55,145 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    SDs would be crazy to go into coalition at this stage , or to align themselves with Labour, or go anywhere near SF.

    The best thing they can do is go into opposition and spend the next 5 years positioning themselves as the alternative to FF and SF. There is a political market for this IMO.

    They are uniquely positioned here. They have none of the baggage of SF. They have none of the baggage of Labour. They have a leader who is a strong politician but is also well-liked in general. They differ from the likes of PBP in that people actually take them seriously and they can attract wider support.

    They need to make sure they don't over rely on spoofers like Hearne though.



  • #110
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74,075 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122939550#Comment_122939550

    I'd love to see the SD's grow but they have to do more work on grassroots tbh. They simply don't run enough candidates or are even active in a lot of constituencies.
    A bit done but more to do.



  • #111
    Loafing Oaf
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,942 ✭✭✭✭Loafing Oaf


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122939550#Comment_122939550

    The problem with this "We'll think & talk about government formation after the election" line for the Soc Dems is they are implicitly positioning themselves as a mudguard for the next FF/FG government as all experience to date indicates the broad left will never win enough seats to form a non-FFG government without forming some sort of United Left Alliance, to coin a phrase, ahead of the election…



  • Advertisement
  • #112
    Fr Tod Umptious
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,442 ✭✭✭✭Fr Tod Umptious


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122939550#Comment_122939550

    They are uniquely positioned here. They have none of the baggage of SF. They have none of the baggage of Labour.

    There is nothing unique about the SDs.

    They are no different than Labour were for years.

    They'll have plenty of baggage if they go into government and get the brunt of the blame for unpopular decisions.



  • #113
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 55,145 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122940003#Comment_122940003

    Not sure you got my point, I said they were uniquely positioned, not that they are unique.

    I also said they'd be crazy to go into coalition. Also, while their policy platform is Labour-esque, they are absolutely uniquely positioned in that they have no baggage to act as a drag right now.

    There is no other serious party of the left in this position.



  • #114
    Fr Tod Umptious
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,442 ✭✭✭✭Fr Tod Umptious


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122940017#Comment_122940017

    But uniquely positioned to do what?

    Sit in opposition, talk the talk, make a few gains the next time round, and then what?

    Go into government and be a mudguard.

    Rinse and repeat.



  • #115
    Red Silurian
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,326 ✭✭✭✭Red Silurian


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122939602#Comment_122939602

    Social democrats are still positioning themselves under the banners of "new" and "small" whereas they have been involved in 3 GE's and 2 EE/LE campaigns in the last 8 years.

    The next time around I'd like to see them drop that mentality and put themselves forward as an alternative to the other 2 parties of FFG and SF. Run candidates in every constituency and LEA, put their best speakers forward on TV and radio debates. Actually try to push for the mayor races of Limerick and Dublin (if Dublin ever actually happens)



  • #116
    breezy1985
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,300 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122940175#Comment_122940175

    The have no hope of doing that and to do it would probably mean changing totally as a party.

    Their vote is entirely urban* and just like Labour before them they will not appeal to large sections of the population without selling out what they are.

    *Don't pretend Wicklow and west Cork are rural. They are two of the most upper middle class places in Ireland.



  • #117
    Red Silurian
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,326 ✭✭✭✭Red Silurian


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122940344#Comment_122940344

    All I'm saying is the party need to get their act together and drop the new party mentality.



  • #118
    Caquas
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,893 ✭✭✭Caquas


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122939465#Comment_122939465

    A casting vote is only useful in a tie.

    Long-winded? Don’t you mean cogent ?

    Your second sentence is more longwinded than anything I have ever posted.



  • #119
    L1011
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 73,032 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122939465#Comment_122939465

    The CC has obligations in use of the casting vote, there's no concept of safe or not. When you are low on numbers, you'd really prefer the CC to be taken away from the opposition.



  • #120
    blanch152
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,980 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122940917#Comment_122940917

    Correct, will be interesting if Connolly puts her name forward.



  • Advertisement
  • #121
    Tippman24
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 212 ✭✭Tippman24


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122931054#Comment_122931054

    The DART is on its way to Kilgarvan, being built by Healy Rae Construction on foot of today's discussions.



Advertisement