Ireland's Refugee Policy cont. Please read OP before posting

I'll deal with the rest of your points when I have the time

Take your time, I've heard NGO's take long lunch breaks - those city centre expensed lunches can't be rushed!

But first you make a claim that 'his own department' are putting the increase in asylum seekers down to these tweets, what's your basis for this

No basis, since I claimed no such thing. Can you show where I did?

And who are the government colleagues who believe this?

Believe what now? The claim I made (that he said what he clearly, in writing, did say), or the claim you falsely attribute to me?

If it's the former, I already posted a link to a news report about it.

Mod Edit: Warning issued for uncivil posting - discuss the topic, do not speculate on a posters identity

You can describe it as a lie as many times as you wish, his own department and his own government colleagues admitted the truth of it, and it caused a measurable increase in asylum seekers coming here for the free houses Roderic promised them (and who can blame them?).

How are you turning a quote attributed to 'staff' at his department into that being the opinion of the wider department? How many of these 'whistleblowers' do you think the author of this opinion piece spoke to? From what I know of journalistic practices it's perfectly acceptable in an article like this, when no substantive claims are actually made (the author himself ascribes the rise in asylum seekers to several factors) to only to have spoken to one or two people. I believe it's also extremely unusual for people in secure government jobs to speak to the media in significant numbers given that their contracts will have terms of confidentiality.

And who are the government colleagues?

I've had a google and I don't see any articles where government colleagues call him a 'one man calamity'.

Would you mind sharing them? Otherwise it's beginning to look like another far-right rumor.

Of course I accept O'Gorman posted some tweets, relating to a white paper on direct provision, it's there for anyone to see. That these amount to a promise of own-door accommodation, an invite, or were even news at the time is false. Even more far-fetched is that we ignore all of the other factors which might have led to increases in people seeking asylum at the time, and through blind faith in the word of Gript.ru etc, accept (with no evidence), that people read this tweets and decided to come here.

Here's a couple of key points from the white paper linked directly in O'Gorman's tweets which I think pretty clearly undermine the far-right rumour that this constituted a promise or invite.

The new model is considerably more complex than the existing IPAS model. Implementation will require the commissioning of accommodation, the provision of weekly income support and the coordination of services and supports nationwide involving a wide range of public sector and independent bodies, at both national and local level. Specialist resources will be needed to meet the often complex needs of applicants. The skills and resources required to implement such a model are not currently held by DCEDIY, whose International Protection Accommodation Service has up to now relied on private contractors to provide accommodation and related services and to act as the point of contact between applicants and mainstream services. In this context, for the new model to be successfully implemented, new and specialist resources will have to be made available directly to DCEDIY. Appointment of the Transition Team is the first step in this process.

As the new model represents a highly specialised operational service, further analysis will be carried out during the transition period on what the optimal delivery vehicle for the service might be in the longer term. Given the nature of the service, this will include consideration of the establishment of an independent body in the form of a new statutory agency of DCEDIY to provide the service. Analysis will be undertaken in late 2021 / early 2022to determine whether or not proposals need to be brought forward to establish a statutory agency to provide the service.

There are transitional risks attaching to any major policy reform and this is clearly relevant in the present case. There are also risks inherent to the new model itself, once operational.

A key risk area relates to the numbers of people applying for International Protection in Ireland. While trends can be observed and monitored, it is not possible to predict accurately how many people will require the services to be provided under the new model. A sudden or sustained increase in demand constitutes a risk to the implementation of the model as planned. In a scenario in which the planned capacity of 3,500 people per year is insufficient to meet demand, greater use will be made of private tenancies in Phase Two. Where Phase One (Reception and Integration Centre) accommodation is insufficient to meet demand, efforts will be made to provide people with Phase Two accommodation more quickly (i.e. from 3 months) in order to release capacity in the Centres. While extra accommodation capacity is being included in the proposed model to respond to higher than anticipated demand, sudden changes in demand would be difficult to manage. Similarly, delivery of what will be a large capital programme within the timeframe will be challenging and require active management. Delays or slippage in the delivery of major parts of the programme could delay the decommissioning of permanent centres.

The development of a multi-strand accommodation approach is inherently more complex than that foreseen by the Advisory Group, which drew on an existing housing programme and on the resources and expertise of Local Authorities. The model proposed above will require multiple capital projects to be brought on stream. It will require support services to be commissioned from multiple organisations. It will also require programmes to be developed and coordinated nationally to stimulate community involvement. As such, it will require a significantly greater investment in staff, capital and project management resources than would have been anticipated by the model recommended in the Advisory Group Report. It will have to be undertaken at a time of continuing pressure on the housing market. Each of the strands proposed above carry risks. Capacity is potentially constrained in private tenancies. Urban renewal programmes are still small-scale in nature. The programmes involving Approved Housing Bodies, NGOs or hosting in the community will have to be developed from scratch. The inherent risks involved in the delivery of a multi-strand programme of this nature, where key elements will require to be developed, make it necessary to introduce an annual review mechanism to assess the on going feasibility of each strand. Such a review would also include structured feedback from current or recent applicants on their experience. If strands persistently fail to deliver the capacity needed to accommodate applicants, it will be necessary either to remove that strand from the model or to re-allocate the numbers across other strands. The annual review will also have to consider whether or not there are other accommodation strands that could be added to the model.

If that's TLDR let me give my synopsis of what the Department are saying: They don't currently have any own door accommodation. If they get any it won't be very much. There's a housing crisis so they probably won't get any at all.

I think that this paper didn't amount to much in the line of an actual promise is also clearly picked up on by the NGO reaction at the time.

So one anonymous FF TD in a Gript.ru article. Not government colleagues then.

2000 deportation orders so far this year but only 129 have been confirmed to have left the state according to this BBC article.Interesting read. it appears the whole system is a shambles.

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cx24x47qp8no

it’s there in black and white that ROG with the tweets was writing cheques he couldn’t cash. No matter how much people argue that those tweets weren’t a big deal or that the white paper outlined it’s a complex process it is there in black and white about own door accommodation in 4 months. Those are the bits that will jump out at people coming for opportunities.

Warnings? Please.

Yes, warning such as these

A key risk area relates to the numbers of people applying for International Protection in Ireland. While trends can be observed and monitored, it is not possible to predict accurately how many people will require the services to be provided under the new model. A sudden or sustained increase in demand constitutes a risk to the implementation of the model as planned.

This far-right rumour, or conspiracy theory, now has it that people selectively ignored passages such as this in the white-paper.

Let's call it what is. More anti-immigration lies.

There was no invite or promise. And anything that was mentioned wasn't even particularly new, having been publicized as part of the programme for government the year earlier.

That's before we get to other European countries actually having own door accommodation at the time.

As I've said many times, the rumor or conspiracy theory is that these tweets constituted a promise or invite, which lead to an increase in people seeking asylum in Ireland.

The linked document makes clear the aspirational nature of the plan to end direct provision, and also that no own door accommodation was actually available at the time.

The new model is considerably more complex than the existing IPAS model. Implementation will require the commissioning of accommodation, the provision of weekly income support and the coordination of services and supports nationwide involving a wide range of public sector and independent bodies, at both national and local level. Specialist resources will be needed to meet the often complex needs of applicants. The skills and resources required to implement such a model are not currently held by DCEDIY, whose International Protection Accommodation Service has up to now relied on private contractors to provide accommodation and related services and to act as the point of contact between applicants and mainstream services. In this context, for the new model to be successfully implemented, new and specialist resources will have to be made available directly to DCEDIY.

So far the only thing established to support this conspiracy theory is that there were some tweets. Nobody's denying this or ever did.

You don't think that a tweet saying the following:

Tweet: Every day we make a new commitment to those seeking asylum in Ireland. In Ireland we will end Direct Provision. Read our plan:

Then a link to a document where it says:

All accommodation in Phase Two will be self-contained houses or apartments for families to ensure their privacy and independence. Single people will be accommodated in either a single room or their own flat. The houses will be located in residential residences to encourage social interaction.

Phase Two applicants will be offered accommodation in a range of settings. It is expected that the first two options will provide the majority of the need: o Houses/flats will be built/purchased through approved housing authorities or equivalent organisations.

You don't think the above text might have acted as a draw to bogus asylum claims?

I’m not saying people selectively ignored anything. I’m saying that people will hone in on what looks attractive and appealing. It’s human nature and anyone who has ever worked in customer service or customer facing positions will know this.

Absolutely scummy behaviour, why are we not deporting these criminal wasters?

Now we get the privilege of paying to keep them incarcerated for years, they should be on the first plane out of here the day they walk out of prison

Imagine going to somewhere that gives you refuge and shelter and you repay their hospitality by violently robbing their elderly people. Charming pair.

I heard this on the 6pm Drivetime headlines. Shocking, talk about the lowest of the low, attacking vulnerable elderly people in their homes, and for her betraying the trust that had been placed in her to care for them. This boils my blood. 🤬