Kerry Co Op Shares

I’m losing my patience here pal 😂😂 honestly you can ring me if you’d like, I think it may be easier.

Let me be more clear.

Let’s say you own 2,000 co-op shares worth €1m (for round figures) and have 1 child

If you want to transfer them to your child now, this is what will happen:

Let’s say you bought all your co-op shares for a total of €100,000

If you give your shares to your child while you’re still alive you will be taxed on what the shares increased in value by when you owned them. So you bought them at €50/each and now they’re worth €500 each so in the eyes of revenue you made a gain of €450/share and will be due to pay CGT of 33%. I know this is probably surprising to many of you but ring IFAC and ask them instead of trying to tell me I’m wrong. I know I’m right. You yourself would face a CGT bill of €300,000. You made a gain of €900,000 and 33% of that is owed to the tax man.

People used be able to sign their co-op shares over for the par value of €1 but that’s well and truly stamped out now.

When your child would inherit the €1m worth of shares they’d have €400,000 worth of an inheritance tax allowance so would have to pay inheritance tax of 33% on €600,000 which is €200,000

You can “WILL” your shares in such a way that when you die your child can sell the shares and pay no tax whatsoever as long as they buy land from the proceeds.

Try doing it your way though pal and see how that works out for you. When the revenue send you a bill for hundreds of grand tell them “yada yada yada”

I remember asking my ifac accountant few yrs ago about revenue valuing the coop share value for inheritance purposes and he was saying €250 per coop share( Kerry plc share value was around €120 per share that time) whether that was upped since I don't know

If something is inherited after death there is never CGT paid on it only inheritance tax per tge inheritance rules. It's immaterial whether its houses, land art or shares. Agri shares may fall under farming inheritance rules but owner needs to pay CGT before transfer

The communication around this is some joke. There will be three NO votes from my family anyway. Arbitration is one thing but expecting us to pay 1c a litre for 5 years for no return. That's 6k a year to me and I scrimping and saving every day for a few bob.

The Co-Op own 17% of the PLC and could throw their weight around a bit more if they wanted to. They could actually bring the PLC to their knees through the stock market. But instead they are allowing themselves and moreover suppliers to be walked all over.

OK. That's still loads. Look up what Elliott Investment Management can do as activist investors.

"Losing your patience"?

"Pal"?

"😂😂"

Why such aggressive language? Or are you being condescending and belittling, why? Either aren't a good look, imho, but each to their own.

I understand things in relation to tax in relation to sales and transfers to be as you've written, why is why I'm struggling to reconcile them with your earlier claim regarding the tax free transfer of converted plc shares through inheritance and how a plc share then differs from differs from a coop share.

The only people who you explain are going to benefit here are a small cohort who are going to die soon and whose children all want buy land?

If is in fact this is a large number of people, the price if land booms again and the benefit may be lost anyway.

I'm more ignorant than stupid here tbh so if I can test your kind patience one more time to just explain how this will work I'd be very grateful.

That's what you came here to post about in the first place?

Wrong on all counts there George. Kerry never did me any favours. They are bullying the Co-Op and as sh1t flows downhill the Co-Op will gleefully walk all over the suppliers.

Dairygold or the producer group for me I'd say come 2026.

I think I’ve explained it in black and white, crystal clear. If you would like to speak to me on the phone where it would be easier to explain I am perfectly happy to talk to you. If I wanted to insult you I don’t think I’d repeatedly offer to make time to talk to you.

You genuinely don’t sent able to grasp it and that’s okay.

Between them they have created millonaires in your family and vast wealth for dairy farmers in the region 

I'm sick of hearing this sh1t. The Kerry boys took the coin. They sold out to the stock market and now they want us to buy the co-op back. Dairygold never sold out like the kerry boys.

And a few crumbs toward the leading milk price contract. It's no wonder they are running out of suppliers. Imagine what the milk price will be next year for us. Bottom of division 3 again I guess and then minus 1 cent after that.

And here I am trying to find a second hand trailer because I don't want to spend 6k on a new one.

I’m only trying to save you from yourself. You want to vote against a great deal and it’s only out of the goodness of my heart that I’m here educating you.

By voting for the JV the farmer 60, gets a share cert for 1,590 kerry group shares + 300 “new” co-op shares

Scenario number 1:
Vote for the JV & he can “will” the kids 530 shares each and they’ll be well below their inheritance tax limit and upon their fathers death they can sell the shares and not pay a penny tax - so literally absolutely zero tax whatsoever to be paid out of the shares and they’ll end up with €46,110 in their back pockets each after tax

Scenario number 2:

The kids inherit the 300 co-op shares and they sell them on the grey market for €400 each

Each child gets 100 co-op share

Each child gets €40,000 for their co-op shares

Scenario number 3:

Alternatively they can sell them through the cash for shares scheme and pay income tax on them, the average person in kerry earns €43,000/year (top income tax limit is only €44,000) so at todays price each co-op share would make €513 and half that goes in income tax, prsi, USC so they’d get €256/share after tax which is €25,600 per child

The numbers speak for themselves, this JV puts extra money into your kids back pockets. It doesn’t matter if you’re dead or alive, they still come out better. For the sake of this I just took the assumption the father is dead and willed them but ultimately the way I’m speaking out on behalf of is best for the kids in the example you gave me

The children will not necessarily need to wait. As they are considered business assets retirement relief is available for a farmer in this scenario or in a liquidation situation. This is available from 55 to 65 you may dispose of 750k from 65 to 75 you may dispose of 500k worth of assets. It one of the reason why business assets should be held jointly by husband's and wives and wives should be in a business partnership(not necessarily reg with dept of agricultural)

They could...... But I'm not a gambler and if I was I would bet that all we will get off them is plenty winks, nudges, promises and cute hoorism in general. Coupled with stories of old lads making loads of money in previous generations.

Well the nods & winks/cute hoorism was definitely going on at Kerry coop during the 80s/90s until plc took control especially in relation to quota.

That's very good information. I'm sure there are other options as advised by PWC a few years back besides liquidation, I was just using thatto contrast with this deal, and also as I see the Co-Op board to be out of their depth I all of their dealings.