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Aoife McLysaght appointed Science Advisor to Government

24

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,841 ✭✭✭✭Goldengirl


    Yes, spot on .

    This particular article was talking about the need for improved air quality in schools and public buildings before the children recommenced another school year ..August 21.

    It also was the tail end of the particularly bad variant Delta when many people were ending up in hospital .

    The first variant not to be more severe was Omicron which arrived Nov/ Dec 21 in Ireland .

    So at worst she was just speaking out on what could have been a very different situation for us had Omicron followed the same path of increasing transmissibility and severity as the variants before it (Alpha and Delta ) and nothing had been done to improve air quality in schools over Summer 21 despite it being discussed by Foley and gov.

    It is ludicrous to call her a vaccine denier as the OP has done .Her worst sin was being involved with the ISAG group seeking ongoing restrictions to aim for zero COVID which was too extreme but to call Prof McLysaght a lunatic is more than a little extreme also .



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 832 ✭✭✭cheese sandwich


    If McLysaght and her ISAG chums had had their way, we’d still have Covid restrictions to this day.

    I don’t doubt she’s an expert in her field, but she displayed terrible judgment during the pandemic and seems a strange choice as adviser to the government



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,598 ✭✭✭Hamsterchops




  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 41,599 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    Why are people bringing up things from the pandemic which aren't remotely relevant?

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 387 ✭✭L Grey




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,022 ✭✭✭Palmach


    https://gript.ie/new-government-science-advisor-trans-males-are-women/

    A total head the ball.

    In 2022, responding to a proposed US law that would seek to prevent transgender biological males from competing in women’s sports, McLysaght described the proposal as a “brutal manifestation of transphobia.”

    “1. Transwomen are women. 2. The origin of sex-differentiated sports is not to protect women’s sports but to marginalise them. 3. This law is a brutal manifestation of transphobia”, she said.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,494 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    because they are desperate to rehash the same discredited and failed arguments again because they can't deal with the fact they lost and were rightly ignored.

    it's just whinging and throwing the toys out of the pram again.

    I'm very highly educated. I know words, i have the best words, nobody has better words then me.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,838 ✭✭✭Jack Daw


    So you're saying that how a government science adviser behaved and acted during a major health crisis is not relevant?

    Because I would imagine that it's very relevant considering a part of their job will surely involve giving government advice on how to do deal with incidents like this in the future.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,494 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    it's not relevant no, because she simply suggested something without any mallice behind it, whether it was right or wrong.

    unlike those who criticise her who were looking for nonsense with absolute mallice behind what they were looking for.

    anyway, it's over, she's got the job and us sane people won the day when it came to the covid strategy.

    I'm very highly educated. I know words, i have the best words, nobody has better words then me.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 41,599 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    While that's certainly the low hanging fruit in terms of explaining motivation, I was curious to see if there was anything more at play.

    This was years ago. Why some people need to drag up perceived slights from back then, I can't fathom but it can't be healthy.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,262 ✭✭✭✭Geuze


    There are men, and there are women. That's it.

    Yet Ms. Lysaght seems to think that men can become women.

    Obviously, they can't.

    It seems that she supports allowing men to play in women's sports.

    How can somebody in such a serious position have such a weak understanding of basic science?

    image.png

    warned and 1 day forum ban applied

    Post edited by Beasty on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,838 ✭✭✭Jack Daw


    But her nonsensical suggestions that she put out in public would indicate she has nonsensical ideas in her head that she can't keep to herself.

    Donald Trump suggested (without malice) potentially using some of the properties in bleach to help deal with covid and he was vilified for it.Admittedly it was stupid thing to say out loud but why was his suggestion not given the benefit of the doubt and McLysaght is?

    Also she's not one of the sane people who won the day when it comes to covid strategy as we don't have forever masking like she was suggesting.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,560 ✭✭✭eightieschewbaccy


    She effectively recommended caution because we were in very unknown territory. She wasn't alone in that in terms of perspectives from the scientific community. I'd say that's pretty different to recommending ingesting bleach.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,762 ✭✭✭plodder


    Because future pandemic threats are one of the things she is expected to advise on.

    New national science forum to enhance ability to respond to challenges such as climate change and pandemic threats

    https://www.irishtimes.com/politics/2024/10/07/geneticist-aoife-mclysaght-due-to-be-appointed-government-science-adviser-by-cabinet/



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 324 ✭✭2Greyfoxes


    On Your first point yes and no. Some forms of intersex (the extremely rare cases, something like 0.0012% of all births) have both male and female genital, sometimes not always spotted as it could be internal. However for the vast majority of people, yes it is either male (boy, man) or female (girl, woman), and mammals can not change sex. A lot of none mammals can however change their sex, due to a host of reasons.

    Biology is a bit messy and sometimes things go a bit... odd, that said we have yet to discover a gamete that is in a state of transition between Sperm and Ova. So we can firmly say there are only 2 sexes.

    Clever word play may win debates, but it doesn't make it true.

    Understanding and explaining things, is not the same as justifying them, if in doubt… please re-read this statement.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,494 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    donald trump made his nonsense suggestion with mallice because he knew it was bollox and knew some of his gullible twats would actually act on it, which some did.
    presumably it was all about trying to make more money for himself some how.
    McLysaght made a suggestion that mask wearing should continue for longer just as an extra precaution until we were sure the vaccine was working, it worked and her suggestion didn't need to happen.
    it's over lad, you need to move on, the rest of us have.

    I'm very highly educated. I know words, i have the best words, nobody has better words then me.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 41,599 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 324 ✭✭2Greyfoxes


    No he didn't, we all saw it. We have the video evidence. There was no malice in his voice when he said what he said. Nor was it said as a joke, as sarcasm, or any other excuse you may try to use to pardon his words.

    Accept that he made an absolute fool of himself and move on.

    Clever word play may win debates, but it doesn't make it true.

    Understanding and explaining things, is not the same as justifying them, if in doubt… please re-read this statement.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,838 ✭✭✭Jack Daw


    Suggesting forever masking and locking down for much longer was idiotic though.

    What Trump said was also idiotic, point is though he gets called out for his idiocy (and he also not a scientist so nobody should take him seriously) , where her idiocy gets indulged and she's now being brought in to advise government when based on what she has stated publicly in the past you'd have to question her judgment and common sense (which should be a prerequisite for advising the government).



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 565 ✭✭✭Avon8


    Like a lot of people, id be broadly a status quo voter, mainly because I'm more afraid of the loony alternative. But hires like this really make me question my position.

    ISAG were nothing short of a vested interest parasite on the country for the better part of 18 months. This is a supposedly 'independent' scientific group that through leaked emails, were shown to target media hosts sympathetic to their views, such as Matt Cooper and Claire Byrne. Why on earth was a group, presented as kind & benevolent for the public interest, be actively targeting journalists who would support them or wouldn't challenge them on their views?

    Prominent ISAG member Tomas Ryan, stated that COVID was a major factor in Autism at the fetal stage. A suggestion that wasn't so much dismissed by the wider scientific community, but not even discussed by a single respected contributer. Another prominent member claimed Ireland would see 100k deaths

    ISAG relentlessly pushed a "zero covid" narrative, a move that proven to be absolutely disastrous in basically every region it's been implemented. Take China for example, a region that openly monitors land borders. Every rational person knew this wasn't a coherent strategy for Ireland (with an open land border) yet this group of rogue 'scientists' kept pushing for it without reason.

    In the years since Covid, Ireland has operated at an excess death rate of between 10% and 20% above norms, basically every month. This is something that's been acknowledged by the Taoiseach. Without going down conspiratorial routes, which I don't subscribe to, the only rational explanation as to why we've lost all these dead citizens is missed medical appointments, screenings and general care that was brought about by lockdown conditions.

    This literally means we now have more dead people (10-20% exceess deaths) than we could ever realistically aim to save through heavy restrictions. ISAG were a massive component on this, with constant prominent air time and continuous shaping of the publics opinion through misinformation. Somebody was funding these people to colour public opinion.

    I lost a family member though a missed medical screening. The fact that one of these absolute charlatans, who was clearly funded by a vested interest, now gets a cushy government number makes me sick to my stomach



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,017 ✭✭✭jackboy


    I don't know the set up of this Science Advisor role is. Not sure if there will be just one advisor. If it is just one then that will be a problem and bad advice will be frequently given with potential catastrophic consequences.

    She has a chance to improve the country vastly, very fast. We will know pretty quick if she is up to the job. If she chooses to prioritise culture wars she is finished as a scientist. We will know that if she focuses on statements about such topics.

    I hope she also knows that the government will view her role as a fall guy for future government decisions that go wrong.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,762 ✭✭✭plodder


    And? Still not seeing the problem.

    ISAG are still active and still scaremongering about Covid. The government rightly rejected their advice.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,375 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    The point of the worst case scenarios was to avoid it. That was based on information coming from China, some of it was sketchy, some of it was plain disinformation.
    If we had 'carried on as normal' without any changes in public behaviour, and government measures, we don't know what the real impact would have been… hospitals overloaded etc.

    The excess deaths don't account for the demographic changes occurring in society since the baseline was established. At least none that I have seen. This is a crucial step that needs to be done to make any sort of comparisons between years, and assess the impact of eg screenings, tests, checkups etc missed during Covid.

    Those same demographic changes also mean that there are more people than ever in the older demographics accessing public health systems, putting strain on the system. Studies of the NHS in England showed that delayed emergency responses due to strain in the system, can lead to more deaths.
    https://covidactuaries.org/2023/01/11/are-nhs-waiting-timescontributing-to-excess-deaths

    I have a family member who had surgery for a preventative heart issue, during lockdowns, because capacity was available in private hospitals. So things did not just stop during lockdowns.
    Could these citizens have accessed medical care safely without restrictions in a society where covid was rampant? IF they had medical issues, they would be vulnerable to severe covid. It was Catch 22.

    Post edited by odyssey06 on

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,524 ✭✭✭✭One eyed Jack


    It’s a lot of fuss over nothing really. It’s a political role, not a scientific role, one in which leadership and experience is required more so than scientific knowledge. The role is that of Chair of the new National Scientific Advice forum:

    The Government Science Advisor will chair the new National Science Advice Forum, comprising up to twelve experts drawn from those with internationally recognised scientific expertise in a range of key disciplines.

    The role will be part of new science advice structures that will assist in informing responses to complex and challenging policy issues.  The Government Science Advisor will chair the National Science Advice Forum and provide cross-sectoral and multi-disciplinary science advice to the government. 

    Her apppointment was announced today by Minister for Further and Higher Education, Research, Innovation and Science Patrick O’Donovan (above on left, with Taoiseach Simon Harris on right).

    Professor McLysaght, who will be based in the Department of Further and Higher Education, Research, Innovation and Science, said: “I am very excited to be starting this new role and to have the opportunity to work with the many extraordinary people across the civil service.  

    https://www.tcd.ie/news_events/top-stories/featured/professor-aoife-mclysaght-named-as-government-science-advisor/


    The group will give advice on matters of policy which will be routinely ignored, so there’s no reason for concern 😁



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,140 ✭✭✭Jizique


    That is all well and good, butclook at the salary, plus benefits



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,323 ✭✭✭✭Calahonda52


    Pls explain this in layman's language, with specific reference to the AQ standards that lead you to draw this conclusion about a reduction in air quality?

    “I can’t pay my staff or mortgage with instagram likes”.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,762 ✭✭✭plodder


    It's anecdotal. Based on what I was told by people buying A rated starter houses and needing to invest in dehumidifiers to keep the moisture content of the air down. Maybe the houses concerned were built with permissions prior to the latest building regs. I'm not sure.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 29,528 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    That somebody has participated in body whose sole aim appeared to be to undermine both official government policy and the existing independent scientific advisory body, and moreover while on that body pushed repeatedly for measures and goals that have proven to be wildly misguided and were considered so at the time (i.e. Zero Covid) does indeed some relevant when discussing their appointment to an official scientific body.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 29,528 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    The point of the worst case scenarios was to avoid it. That was based on information coming from China, some of it was sketchy, some of it was plain disinformation

    If we had 'carried on as normal' without any changes in public behaviour, and government measures, we don't know what the real impact would have been… hospitals overloaded etc.

    This is all well and good, and that is why many mitigation measures were put in place. The problem is that iSAG were both undermining the government during this period (and their name is offensive at its core as it is suggesting the official scientific advisory group are not independent) and suggesting excessive measures well past the point of reasonableness in both timeline and scale.

    They have then, for the most part, simply slinked away when their doom mongering proved to be exactly that.

    I'm a bit surprised that some people are suggesting that a person's track record is not a reasonable point of discussion in whether they are suitable for a role.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,879 ✭✭✭donaghs


    Maybe you could have said the same about Gemma O’Doherty before she went off the mental deep end.

    I wasn’t really familiar about Aoife McLysaght, but heard about the appointment. Doing a bit of googling now, it looks like she was in the nuttier “zero covid” side of the debate who wanted to keep Covid restriction in place, and increase them, regardless of the mental and financial cost to society, until Covid was gone forever.

    https://www.newstalk.com/news/restrictions-could-drag-on-into-2022-if-ireland-doesnt-adopt-zero-covid-approach-now-prof-aoife-mclysaght-1143993

    https://x.com/aoifemcl/status/1355882797962031107

    https://x.com/aoifemcl/status/1354043632978944000

    Surely no-one is going to defend this crazy stance still?

    Even New Zealand, which came closest to achieving this saw sense.



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