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Vice President Kamala Harris vs Donald Trump 2024

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,315 ✭✭✭✭briany


    @Quin_Dub

    Johnathan Swan from Axios did a good job a few years ago with him, just kept calling him back on a single issue.

    That's a bit easier to manage in a TV interview because the interviewer has a lot of leeway in terms of choosing what is discussed. In a debate, the moderator is usually trying to move things forward to different areas of policy.

    Certainly not an impossible thing to do in a debate - even Trump himself managed to stick to the topic of the border in his debate against Biden - but you do need a way to always connect back to your attack points.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,777 ✭✭✭✭Igotadose


    Not denying there are those living at ridiculously low poverty levels (https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/2019/6/5/18650492/2019-poverty-2-dollar-a-day-edin-shaefer-meyer reviews some research in America on who might be living on $2/day or less. About 0.11%)

    However, every 4 years Americans are bombarded with how bad the economy is, and this time around, it seems like it's awash with money, overall inflation low and lowering, excellent levels of employment and a fair amount of mobility. So, I think that it won't have as big an effect on the election as it had in Bush I v. Clinton, when Carville came up with his famous phrase. I'm hoping character in the candidates matters, and it's looking like it does.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,088 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Why does Harris want to unmute the debate? Trump is an expert at spamming nonsense and gish gallop, she won't get a word in edgeways.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,781 ✭✭✭Flaneur OBrien


    I'd say it's the opposite and they're just playing Trump. They're completely in his head. He and his campaign will see agreeing to unmuting mike's as a show of weakness, so will argue to the hilt for muted mikes which will suit Harris way more.



  • Posts: 224 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Why do they fear a voice that disagrees with the political mob, here?



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  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,916 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    Yep.. it's arguing with a toddler.

    "No, you stay up as long as you like, only big boys and girls go to bed early"

    Just more evidence of how incredibly easy it is to manipulate him.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,683 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    I think it will appeal to women voters. Man talking over a woman? More universally relatable than a bag of Doritos, let me just say.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,657 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    I wonder are they aiming for a "I'm speaking" moment where she's seen to shut Trump down during his rants

    It would certainly be a powerful image for a lot of female voters, literally shutting the man up. However, I can't imagine there's many undecided women out there at the moment.

    The women in the MAGA crowd will vote for Trump no matter what and presumably the women who aren't psychopaths are already voting for Harris

    I suppose it's a case of mobilising support and getting people out to vote

    In any case, I hope Kamala Harris is doing a lot of prep to stay focused during her talking points and not get interrupted. She's probably getting people to yell at her while she's working on her speeches to train her to work through the noise

    Such is the state of modern politics 😬

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,777 ✭✭✭✭Igotadose


    So, I see lots of 'it's dead even' headlines, e.g., places like Thehill.com..

    Yet, fivethirtyeights summary of polls is saying Harris +4 nationally.

    https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/president-general/2024/national/

    And the fivethirtyeight summary is from a few days ago.

    Even Thehill's poll shows +4% nationally.

    So, dead even? No. Harris in the lead. Swing states are tight, but that's not dead even.

    Very frustrating. Plus it's August, as always, the only poll that matters takes place on 5 November.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,781 ✭✭✭Flaneur OBrien


    National polls not really worth a damn, tbh. I think she needs to be beating Trump by 5 points to be "ahead".

    Even then, it's the swing states that she needs to be leading by 3 points at least to carry them.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,683 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Yeah, im not sure how the national average weights the states, if she has a commanding lead in California for example does it have a skew on her national appeal, when she could be struggling to carry a lead in the swing states that will actually decide whether the election is a landslide or not.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,315 ✭✭✭✭briany


    The swing states are all too close to call, so it's dead even. National polls do not matter other than as an interesting statistic, and perhaps ammo to needle Trump as and when he's behind, but they have no real bearing on the outcome.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,657 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    You'd want a more significant margin to call it, especially since 538 is an amalgamation of multiple polls which have different and potentially flawed methodologies

    For example if you randomly called a bunch of people, but most of them were in blue states then your poll would probably show more support for Harris which may not be real

    What conclusions can be drawn at this stage is that Harris has very successfully rallied the democrat voters who weren't happy with Biden. The momentum is with her, the big question is whether she can get her voters to turn out on the day. Voter apathy could kill her easily enough at this stage

    Trump on the other hand seems to have hit his peak support and is again dependent on getting his supporters to turn out. The MAGA side of his part will definitely turn out, the question is the more around middle ground conservatives. This is a group which doesn't necessarily subscribe to his antics and would prefer to see policy

    If Trump can find some economic issue to corner Harris on then he'll be in with a chance to win. The usual rallying cry is the Dems are planning to raise taxes

    I'm guessing this is partly why we're seeing generally moderate economic policy from Harris, no big giveaways other than a promise to stop taxing tips.

    All she needs to do is persuade the moderate republicans she won't tank the economy and they'll probably sit the election out after getting fed up of listening to Trump ramble on about electric sharks being eaten by Hannibal Lecter or whatever

    In that case, I think her plan is working

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,264 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    Think it would be based on the 3% lean across the country. Individual states won't be, out of step, by a lot. Fl will still vote GOP but by a smaller margin, MH, GA and Penn would flip over to narrowly favour the Dems.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,781 ✭✭✭Flaneur OBrien


    FL is as guaranteed as California is.

    The Texas thing is interesting. It might not flip this cycle, but it is looking like a battleground state in 2028.



  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,888 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    they/them/theirs


    The more you can increase fear of drugs and crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.

    Noam Chomsky



  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,888 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    actually the lead has narrowed in the last few days.

    Check the state polling. It’s unbelievably tight.

    they/them/theirs


    The more you can increase fear of drugs and crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.

    Noam Chomsky



  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,888 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    in fact the widening gap trend has narrowed in Pa and MI. Worrying.

    they/them/theirs


    The more you can increase fear of drugs and crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.

    Noam Chomsky



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 603 ✭✭✭Stanley 1


    She should turn up and treat it as a press conference.

    The diapers would need doubling up.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 798 ✭✭✭RickBlaine


    Trump is so stupid and tone deaf that he did a photo op at a vet's gravestone with a thumbs up gesture:

    https://x.com/ProjectLincoln/status/1828116237408207121

    Imagine the Fox News melt down if Biden or Obama did that.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,657 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    A lot of tech companies moved to Texas which would be bringing in more college educated workers who tend to vote democrat

    So yes, could end up being a battleground state at some point, although it'll probably get gerrymandered to hell to keep it red

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,657 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    Maybe down to RFK dropping out and endorsing Trump?

    I'd say Harris could slip back over the next few weeks until the debate unless she can do something to keep the momentum going

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,781 ✭✭✭Flaneur OBrien


    Can you gerrymander a state for a presidential election? I thought all the votes of a state went to that EC.



  • Posts: 224 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Yes they do otherwise people could see my rantings.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,781 ✭✭✭Flaneur OBrien


    The gap narrowed by -.3 in PA and -.5 in MI after RFK dropped out, that wouldn't be that worrying, in fairness.

    To put it in context, RFK was on 4.7% in MI and 3.9% in PA. I'm sure Trump and his team were expecting a much bigger bounce than that.



  • Posts: 224 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    The polls in my PA are usually more weighted with democrats than are representative in votes. But how Philadelphia goes usually is how the state goes. There is only majority support for Harris in Philly, Pittsburgh, and the Lehigh Valley. Other than that it is mostly Trump.

    Worries about RJK Jr is being downplayed by democrats but the percentage for RFK Jr in swing states are AZ 5%, GA 3%, MI 4%, NC 3%, NV 4%, PA 4% and WI 4%. It is a big deal with his throwing support to Trump.



  • Posts: 224 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    No. You can vote for anyone in a general election, regardless of party affiliation.



  • Posts: 224 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Re: Trump going to fallen soldiers grave from the incompetent Afghanistan withdrawal. Biden's the one that got them killed.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,468 ✭✭✭chooseusername


    "Trump is an expert at spamming nonsense and gish gallop,"

    Let him off, once he goes off-script, she'll have him where she wants him.



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  • Posts: 224 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Trump beat the poll numbers in 2016 and 2020. If the polls have them almost even then Trump probably wins. Plus Trump has more paths to reach 270 electoral votes than does Harris.



This discussion has been closed.
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