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Rules for Boards Pool tournament

  • 20-11-2003 04:49PM
    #1
    Lafortezza
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,806 ✭✭✭


    as organised by Dakeyrus Here

    My suggestions
    1) each pair play best of 3 frames, this to be changed depending on number of tables available, no of participants, time allowed.

    2) toss coin for break

    3) usual 8ball rules from there, 2 shots on foul, etc

    4) Shots DON'T carry, if you don't take advantage of your free shot, then tough. If you pot a few balls in a row from your first shot then well done you.

    5) Back table. If its a euro table with a 'D' then play that you cant play back table. If its an American table with a line then you should be able to play back table. IMO anyway.

    6) When on the black. I personally don't like the 'stick pocket' rule,
    I prefer to play nominate a pocket for each shot on the black you take.

    Thats about all I can think of really,
    feel free to argue/post your own ideas


«13

Comments

  • #2
    Dakeyras
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 570 ✭✭✭Dakeyras


    Nicely done, heres a set of rules as by Fitz which id be agreeing with:

    No backtable.

    Shots don't carry.

    Potting the black of the break is a win.

    Potting the white off the break is a foul, but not penalised if no colours go down; if a colour goes down, it's one shot on that, or two on the other colour.

    No two shots on the black.

    Nominate pocket on the black for each shot.

    Free balls apply.

    Touching ball rules apply.


    cant remember what the tables are like in the palace and if they have a D or not but i agree with lafortezza on that end of things about back table


  • #3
    DapperGent
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,838 ✭✭✭DapperGent


    Between the two of you I think those rules are perfect.

    Maybe be up the frame count to 5/7 for semis and final depending on time.


  • #4
    tricky D
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,700 ✭✭✭tricky D


    just had my spooks up there doin a recce:)

    fwiw, they have a set of published rules if reqd, some which haven't already been mention follow:

    there are no D's, penalty shots can be taken from anywhere up the 'small' end and the uptable rule applies. uptable is determined by the cue direction not the ball direction

    one shot after foul on break (ie no penalty)

    what about free balls? I'd reckon not.

    also, what about the need for someone with the 'final say'


  • #5
    henbane
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,636 ✭✭✭henbane


    Originally posted by tricky D
    what about free balls? I'd reckon not.

    Gots to have free balls. If someone fouls and leave you snookered two shots are no use unless you can hit what you see.


  • #6
    Lafortezza
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,806 ✭✭✭Lafortezza


    Originally posted by tricky D

    there are no D's, penalty shots can be taken from anywhere up the 'small' end and the uptable rule applies. uptable is determined by the cue direction not the ball direction
    Is there a line? dunno about playing anywhere in the 'small end', maybe playing anywhere on the line would be better/prefferred
    Originally posted by tricky D

    what about free balls? I'd reckon not.
    free ball is after a foul by the other player where you can't see your own balls (both sides?) and you're allowed hit any ball, am I right?
    why do you reckon not?
    Originally posted by tricky D

    also, what about the need for someone with the 'final say'
    Dakeyrus!


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  • #7
    tricky D
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,700 ✭✭✭tricky D


    er yeah agreed, I'll change my mind on that one. was thinking of superleague free balls which a bit much

    can u pot a free ball????

    just to clarify, there's no D, just the line is there


  • #8
    Lucutus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,831 ✭✭✭Lucutus


    Free balls are for snooker, not pool, imo. After a foul, you get two shots, more than enough to compenstate for any awkward position.


  • #9
    henbane
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,636 ✭✭✭henbane


    Originally posted by tricky D
    er yeah agreed, I'll change my mind on that one. was thinking of superleague free balls which a bit much

    can u pot a free ball????

    just to clarify, there's no D, just the line is there

    Can pot a free ball unless it's black.

    I'd say line is more sensible than the whole small end of the table - rules like that make a foul shot as good as end the match and tend to be overkill

    Final say to Dakeyras!


  • #10
    DapperGent
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,838 ✭✭✭DapperGent


    Originally posted by Lucutus
    Free balls are for snooker, not pool, imo. After a foul, you get two shots, more than enough to compenstate for any awkward position.
    If a foul leaves you snookered them your opponent has benifitted from the fact that he's fouled which is a bit unfair.

    A free ball takes that away without giving any extra advantage and it only comes into play when you can't see the whole of one of your balls after a foul which isn't too often.


  • #11
    henbane
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,636 ✭✭✭henbane


    Originally posted by Lucutus
    Free balls are for snooker, not pool, imo. After a foul, you get two shots, more than enough to compenstate for any awkward position.

    If you can't see anything to hit, the person who fouled has the advantage whether or not you have two shots.

    I reckon it shouldn't be played like snooker rules though, both sides is too generous. Might be a idea to have someone not playing making calls on stuff like this on the day.


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  • #12
    tricky D
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,700 ✭✭✭tricky D


    has to be on the line when you think about it as otherwise there is no back table!!!


  • #13
    Dakeyras
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 570 ✭✭✭Dakeyras


    free ball is were a player fouls and you are left snookered, you can choose one of your opponents balls or the black to hit. if your not on the black and you pot it you've lost but you can pot your opponents ball and you continue on. You can also choose to lift the ball and set it behind the line and play on though you cant choose one of your opponents balls to hit when you do this.

    Hope that makes some sort of sense.

    As for whether we need it Im not too bothered about the free ball rule, either way ill take you all :D

    Being snookered after someone fouls is not something that will tend to happen very often anyway so if some people dont like it we may as well leave it out.

    Im also for placing the ball on the line and no back table since we have no D, playing the whole of the behind the line is just a bit too much.

    as for the need for the final say, i am more than willing to take up said post.
    all donations to Dakeyras refereeing gratefully accepted as are numerous pints bought for which of course will have no effect on quality of decisions made in your favour ;)

    whats the opinion on the white ball leaving and returning to the table, hitting your own colour. do you all consider this a foul? because i have a penchant for hitting ridiculous jump shots. They look the bizz when you pull it off, looks disaster when you fuk it up though (which is the outcome most of the time)


  • #14
    Kali
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,601 ✭✭✭Kali


    Originally posted by lafortezza
    3) usual 8ball rules from there, 2 shots on foul, etc

    EPA rules I imagine... "usual" is way too general..
    http://www.arseweb.com/rupe/pool/uk_rules.html (the rules on the left)..

    oh and jumpshots are illegal... leave it for the dodgy pub tables :)


  • #15
    Lafortezza
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,806 ✭✭✭Lafortezza


    Originally posted by Dakeyras

    As for whether we need it Im not too bothered about the free ball rule, either way ill take you all :D
    Being snookered after someone fouls is not something that will tend to happen very often anyway so if some people dont like it we may as well leave it out.
    I'd say leave it in personally.
    Originally posted by Dakeyras

    whats the opinion on the white ball leaving and returning to the table, hitting your own colour. do you all consider this a foul? because i have a penchant for hitting ridiculous jump shots. They look the bizz when you pull it off, looks disaster when you fuk it up though (which is the outcome most of the time)

    I'd say no to jump shots, especially if the cost of repairs to ripped cloths are coming out of the prize fund!


  • #16
    henbane
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,636 ✭✭✭henbane


    Originally posted by Dakeyras

    all donations to Dakeyras refereeing gratefully accepted as are numerous pints bought for which of course will have no effect on quality of decisions made in your favour ;)

    whats the opinion on the white ball leaving and returning to the table, hitting your own colour. do you all consider this a foul? because i have a penchant for hitting ridiculous jump shots. They look the bizz when you pull it off, looks disaster when you fuk it up though (which is the outcome most of the time)

    Jump shots are quite alright as long as no ball finishes off the table.

    Another rule thought - it's a foul if the object ball leaves the table but it is considered to be potted, that's the way I play but I know some people think it should be put back on the table (the spot or summat like that).


    I'll buy you a rake of pints if I have to play you :D


  • #17
    Big Ears
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,040 ✭✭✭Big Ears


    jump shots are only legal in 9-ball.


  • #18
    Makaveli
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,503 ✭✭✭Makaveli


    Originally posted by henbane
    Jump shots are quite alright as long as no ball finishes off the table.

    Another rule thought - it's a foul if the object ball leaves the table but it is considered to be potted, that's the way I play but I know some people think it should be put back on the table (the spot or summat like that).

    Yeah that's the way I play too, although it seems a lot of people respot the ball.


  • #19
    Lafortezza
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,806 ✭✭✭Lafortezza


    Looks like rules so far are:
    (couple open to debate still)
    • No back table because its an American table with a line so you play along the line.
    • Shots don't carry
    • Potting black off break is win
    • Potting the white off the break is a foul, but not penalised if no colours go down; if a colour goes down, its one shot on that, or two on the other colour
    • No two shots on black
    • Nominate pocket on black for each shot
    • Free ball rules apply. If someone fouls and leave you snookered two shots are no use unless you can hit your object ball
    • Jump shots are quite alright as long as no ball finishes off the table.
    • It's a foul if the object ball leaves the table but it is considered to be potted

    Can't think of any more myself, apart from organisation of number of frames in each round, and that kind of thing.


  • #20
    henbane
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,636 ✭✭✭henbane


    Originally posted by lafortezza
    -It's a foul if the object ball leaves the table but it is considered to be potted

    Nitpick - Might want to change that to any ball except the black/cue ball?


  • #21
    Kali
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,601 ✭✭✭Kali


    Nominate pocket on black for each shot

    aye.. and that alone regarding the black, none of this can't shoot into the other players nominated pocket crap or 3-fouls crap that you sometimes get :)


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  • #22
    The Rooster
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,119 ✭✭✭The Rooster


    Under both the World 8-Ball Pool Federation (WEBPF) and the European and United Kingdom Pool Federation (EUKPF) rules, if an object ball leaves the table it has to be re-spotted on the black spot, or as near as possible to the black spot. It is a foul shot, but if the black leaves the table it is also re-spotted, i.e. its not loss of frame.

    (All national and most regional pool touraments in Ireland and the UK use either the WEBPF or EUKPF rules).

    Under the Billiard Congress of America 8-Ball rules, balls that leave the table are not re-spotted. However the US rules are fairly alien to us, as they state that you must call every single shot (i.e 6-ball corner pocket, etc.)

    Interesting that nobody has questioned the "no two shots on the black" rule that was put forward at the beginning of the thread. Under both the WEBPF and EUKPF rules, you do get two shots on the black following a foul. A heavy penalty maybe, but then again you have no excuse for fouling if your opponent has only the black left. You never get 2 shots after any foul under the US rules, you get "ball in hand" instead.


  • #23
    Lafortezza
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,806 ✭✭✭Lafortezza


    Originally posted by The Rooster
    Under both the World 8-Ball Pool Federation (WEBPF) and the European and United Kingdom Pool Federation (EUKPF) rules, if an object ball leaves the table it has to be re-spotted on the black spot, or as near as possible to the black spot. It is a foul shot, but if the black leaves the table it is also re-spotted, i.e. its not loss of frame.
    I think the Irish way of looking at it is "Ah c'mon hurry up and play, its your round next anyway".
    And I think most irish pool players prefer to play that if an object ball leaves the table its considered potted, but opposition player gets 2 shots.

    regarding the black, it makes the person on the black a bit more careful when trying to win the frame, knowing that the dreaded 'in off the black' with the white ball means he loses.
    Originally posted by The Rooster

    Interesting that nobody has questioned the "no two shots on the black" rule that was put forward at the beginning of the thread. Under both the WEBPF and EUKPF rules, you do get two shots on the black following a foul. A heavy penalty maybe, but then again you have no excuse for fouling if your opponent has only the black left. You never get 2 shots after any foul under the US rules, you get "ball in hand" instead.
    If the players are good then 2 shots on the black means game over, maybe a bit unfair for the person playing catch-up.


  • #24
    The Rooster
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,119 ✭✭✭The Rooster


    Re the black, its only re-spotted if it leaves the table, i.e. ends up on the floor. If you pot the black, and make a foul in the same shot, then you always lose the rack.

    I can see your point with the 2 shots on the black, and I think you are in the majority, but I disagree with it. If you have 3 or 4 balls left and your opponent is on the black, then its practically impossible to be snookered and really there's no excuse for making a foul. And while it should be easy to pot the black when you've two shots, I've seen plenty of people (me included) make a bags of things when trying to "lay-up"!

    Also having 2 shots on the black discourages deliberate fouling, which is often prevalent when there is only one shot.


  • #25
    henbane
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,636 ✭✭✭henbane


    Originally posted by The Rooster
    I can see your point with the 2 shots on the black, and I think you are in the majority, but I disagree with it. If you have 3 or 4 balls left and your opponent is on the black, then its practically impossible to be snookered and really there's no excuse for making a foul. And while it should be easy to pot the black when you've two shots, I've seen plenty of people (me included) make a bags of things when trying to "lay-up"!

    Also having 2 shots on the black discourages deliberate fouling, which is often prevalent when there is only one shot.

    If you're on the black and you're opponent has 3-4 left you shouldn't need 2 shots unless he is in prime position. Everybody makes a dumbass foul once in a while on a pool table, in-off off two cushions is not something everybody can work out and dodgy kisses here and there can push you in-off too - the black should be a pressure shot. I appreciate that laying-up can be made a mess of, but it really is awful easy to do.

    As for deliberate fouling - that's an instant loss, no matter when it happens. In the competition there's gonna have to be a 3rd party at every table prepared to call that. It's rare but I have seen the odd asshole try this sh*t and walk away from the table with a smirk on his face.


  • #26
    Michael Collins
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 1,852 Mod ✭✭✭✭Michael Collins


    There's a slight problem when you choose to play the "only one shot on black no matter what" rule in combination with "any ball that leaves the table is considered to be potted" because - what if (I know the chances of it happening are very slim but still it's a competition):

    Your opponent has one ball left which is in a safe position. You're on the black which is also in a safe position. It's your opponents go. Your opponent hits their ball so hard it goes off the table...

    Under the current rules, his ball would be considered to be potted and you'd be left with only one shot on the black which is in a safe position. In which case your opponent has benefited quite a lot from fouling...

    I'd say the best way would be to re-spot any ball that goes off the table and keep the one shot on black rule, especially on the smaller sized tables...


  • #27
    Lafortezza
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,806 ✭✭✭Lafortezza


    Originally posted by Michael Collins
    There's a slight problem when you choose to play the "only one shot on black no matter what" rule in combination with "any ball that leaves the table is considered to be potted" because - what if (I know the chances of it happening are very slim but still it's a competition):

    Your opponent has one ball left which is in a safe position. You're on the black which is also in a safe position. It's your opponents go. Your opponent hits their ball so hard it goes off the table...

    Under the current rules, his ball would be considered to be potted and you'd be left with only one shot on the black which is in a safe position. In which case your opponent has benefited quite a lot from fouling...

    I'd say the best way would be to re-spot any ball that goes off the table and keep the one shot on black rule, especially on the smaller sized tables...

    thats a good point, the only thing I'd say to that is that the chances of it happening are very very slim, I don't think I've actually ever seen it happen tbh.

    But henbane made a good point about having a 3rd party to call those sort of decisions, we don't want any punchups!


  • #28
    DapperGent
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,838 ✭✭✭DapperGent


    Originally posted by lafortezza
    But henbane made a good point about having a 3rd party to call those sort of decisions, we don't want any punchups!
    I want punch ups.


  • #29
    Lafortezza
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,806 ✭✭✭Lafortezza


    Originally posted by DapperGent
    I want punch ups.
    you'll have to settle for an ass-kicking instead, 6-3 is a start


  • #30
    DMT
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,669 ✭✭✭DMT


    Seeing as it will be played on American pool tables, why not go the whole hog and use American rule?

    For instance, if an object is touching a cusion (frozen) it can't be potted and after a foul the cue ball can be placed anywhere on the table....

    Other rules recommendations include:
    • At least four balls must touch a cushion on the break.
    • At least one ball must hit a cushion on each shot if a ball is not potted.
    • Potted the black on the break win the frame, whether or not any of the other object balls are potted. If the cue ball and black both are potted on the break the frame is lost.
    • On the break, the cue ball must first strike one of the front three balls of the triangle:
    O O O O O
 O O O O
  O O O
   [b]O O
    O[/b]


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  • #31
    henbane
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,636 ✭✭✭henbane


    Originally posted by DMT
    Seeing as it will be played on American pool tables, why not go the whole hog and use American rule?

    Sweet jesus, NO! We've spent the last week arguing all the niggly little issues to get some normal friendly pool rules rolling - we aint aiming for official, just something everyone is comfortable with.


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