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Lack of resilience in brothers

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 480 ✭✭NiceFella


    OP, don't waste your time trying to get through to your parents. Absolute waste of time and energy. They resided over this mess. It's very common in Ireland, my own parents stuck their heads in the sand when confronted with trying to make changes in our family due to addiction issues and the rest. Shouting and roaring and bitterness. It's very frustrating I know, but the sooner you accept it the better it will be for your own mental well being and more you can just move on with life.

    You've mentioned heading abroad a few times. Go for it, but have a good plan. My GF went to Thailand to teach English for a few months and she came back with a new perspective. Would upskilling also help you with a move abroad? Things to think about



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,959 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    …the whole family unit requires immediately professional interventions due to the dysfunctions in their entirety, but that may not happen, family dynamics are complex, particularly with such complexity, this includes the parents, they also need professional help, but it would be common for no pennies to drop, as it would require a lot of self reflection…

    …look after yourself op, sounds like you have some great ideas for yourself, go for it, you maybe able to assist your family better if you do



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 8,143 Mod ✭✭✭✭HildaOgdenx


    Mod - Please bear in mind that PI is not a discussion forum.

    - Personal Issues is an advice forum.
    - Posters are required to offer advice or opinion to the OP in their replies.

    Thanks
    Hilda



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,451 ✭✭✭Airyfairy12


    Thanks Wanderer78, one of them has an Autism diagnosis, the pda you mentioned sounds like him and youre right, they shouldnt go near employment as they evidently need supports.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,959 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    i have asd myself, so….

    i suspect most of your family may also have it, since its a genetic disorder, as is the case in my own family, im the only one officially diagnosed, but….

    theres a lot of dysfunctions occurring within your family, your parents dont mean it, as they are lost in it themselves, either one or both of your parents are also on the spectrum, but clearly are not aware of this, i.e. theyre not self aware, theres very little you can do about that, the penny kinna has to drop with them, as was the case myself, i realised myself before my own diagnoses, late diagnoses….

    id mirror others, paddle your own canoe, this requires professionals, id also recommend some therapy for yourself, so you can navigate all of this

    its heartbreaking tbh, theres a lot of pain and trauma within your family, but you can do very little about it, just look after yourself first, then go from there



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,111 ✭✭✭Electric Sheep


    It sounds like learned helplessness to me - they have learned that they can get away with this behaviour, and your mother will compensate for it. The solution lies in your parents hands.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,959 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    enabling behaviors would be common with disorders such as asd, its ultimately down to state failures in providing critical supports needed over prolonged periods, resulting in significant dysfunctions, again, asd is a genetic disorder, so one or both parents have it, but are completely unaware of it, i.e. theyre struggling themselves and are unable to understand whats going, what needs to be done, and since communication deficits are a part of the disorder, effective communication of the issues fail to happen….

    this in turn can result in serious issues in time such as suicide, or suicide attempts, as is in this case, and again, the state fails to act and react, the health system has completely failed to appropriately react to the suicide attempt, specialists such as psychiatrists, phycologists, therapists etc etc etc, should be all over this case, and not just with the person that has made the attempt, as with such cases, theres generally far more complex and dysfunctional family dynamics at play, which has lead to the attempt

    these issues take time to play out, and can be very evident for years leading up to such events, but critical state bodies such as the health system and the welfare system, completely fail to act in time…

    …and here we are again, little or no state reaction, and in some cases, the completely wrong reaction!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 315 ✭✭Feets


    Sorry to hear. I know someone similar. No resilience and no want to learn it. Their folks did it to them . You cant do anything for them sadly.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,784 ✭✭✭Mollyb60


    Just to echo what most others here have said; my own brother was the same situation. Late 30's, no job, no motivation, stayed in his room all day smoking weed and playing his Playstation. No amount of head banging against the wall could move him. And my parents 100% enabled the behaviour. I eventually had to take a step back and set a boundary because it was stressing me out so much. I couldn't make my parents change their behaviour, so I had to just change mine instead. I wouldn't discuss the situation any further with them or listen to them whinge and moan about having to loan him money or do his washing.

    You can't force your parents to take any action against your brothers, therefore you need to do what's best for you. Find any way possible (including emigration) to remove yourself from the toxic household. Set boundaries with your parents about what you will and will not discuss, keep yourself right and work on your own life.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,748 ✭✭✭Apiarist


    Just to echo what others advised, I don't think you should try to help them until they are ready to receive your help. And even then you should think very hard about trying to help. You probably do not want to become their surrogate mother. Also, your brothers need to pull themselves together on their own accord, and learn to live as independent people, which they will only do if their circumstances force them to.

    Frankly, I would would seriously consider emigrating to Canada or Australia. Nice countries, good opportunities and far, far away from relatives.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,959 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    …its very possible the op has been the 'parentified child', if so, thats another thing to be addressed in therapy…

    …unfortunately the autistic brain doesnt work like a neurotypical one, so waiting for the autistic person to 'pull themselves together' simply doesnt happen when serious dysfunctions exists, this is where the professionals are required, again, placing onus on the individuals to do so simply wont work, so the outcome will simply be even more dysfunction….

    …ultimately this just costs the state, i.e. the taxpayer even more in the long run, when little or no state interventions occur….



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,050 ✭✭✭blackbox


    Your brother's are all over 18 - i.e. they are adults.

    Perhaps they did not get an ideal upbringing, but an adult needs to take stock and start to control his or her own life.

    They are all probably quite happy with the way things are now, including your mother who would probably hate if they got jobs and all moved out to their own places.

    If they don't like the way things are, they would be doing something about it.

    If you don't like the way things are, change what YOU can change. Don't expect them to change.

    You only get one life.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,959 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    …and again, no they are not 'adults', autism is a 'developmental disorder', this means the person with the disorder has 'developmental delays', and when appropriate interventions do not occur, this generally results in significant long term dysfunctions, and long term damage, to the person themselves and to those surrounding them, i.e. they cannot resolve their problems without appropriate professional supports….



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 8,143 Mod ✭✭✭✭HildaOgdenx


    Mod
    @Wanderer78 I am sure your posts are well intentioned, but as you may have seen, I have already posted a reminder earlier on this thread - see attached.
    Hilda

    IMG_5112.jpeg






    Post edited by HildaOgdenx on


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 8,143 Mod ✭✭✭✭HildaOgdenx


    Mod - Further posts deleted.

    Feel free to set up a discussion elsewhere. This is not the forum for it.

    Please also desist from offering a diagnosis to anyone based on posts on an online forum.

    Please do not reply to this post on thread.

    Thank you



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 675 ✭✭✭LilacNails


    I have a similar experience to your issue op. I agree with what most people are saying...move on and live your own life.

    It's a sad existence, but I don't think there's anything you can do. You really cant change people. Only they will change when they want to. Unfortunately its sounds as if the 3 are too comfy, and unless one was to turn things around, then maybe the other 2 might follow.

    Your parents sound like their similar generation to my own. How I try look at it is, their doing the best by doing what they think is best, even though it's clearly not. Times are so different now to when they were brought up, and what they think is 'right'.

    It's easier said than done, go live your life as you please. I'm sure you feel some guilt, I'm learning myself to just get on with things and accept as they are. It's really hard but you'll never be this young again!

    Best of luck.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,743 ✭✭✭Wanderer2010


    As someone mentioned this situation is actually pretty common in towns and villages all over Ireland, where grown men in their 40s or even 50s are still living at home, with all the frustration and projection that goes along with it. It can be any number of factors that cause it. Years of unemployment and mental health struggles can sadly keep a person living at home, even when they are improving and want to change their life. The housing situation in this country right now makes it next to impossible to rent or buy if you are on a low wage or have no savings.

    This can infantilize adults who end up still in their bedroom at 45, getting their clothes washed and meals done by their parents, playing games, lashing out at those around them. I know a family where the dad died young and there are 3 sons living with the mother, aged 41, 45 and 50. The mother is 74 and I feel sorry for her as it must be very stressful. OP you can't change anybody only yourself so I would just focus on making the best life you can for yourself and pray for the rest of your brothers. There isn't anything else you can do.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,653 ✭✭✭✭Purple Mountain


    OP, sorry to sound harsh but what your 3 brothers do is not your business.

    I can totally understand your frustration and worries about the situation especially as they are living with your parents but unless and until your parents ask you for help or advice, they have all made the decision to live these lives.

    Your brothers are adults and they have made this path for themselves.

    You have so much opportunity for yourself: education and a relationship. You are young.

    Get out as soon as possible with your partner and go make an independent lire for yourself. You can still have a relationship with your family, but at a healthy distance and with boundaries.

    You only have one life- go live it and let other people live the life they have enabled.

    To thine own self be true



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,959 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    …again, this is not 'normal' adult behavior, as theres clearly serious developmental delays occurring…

    …there is actually an onus on society at large to intervene, the individuals themselves would in fact be deeply unhappy and ashamed of their situation, but are unsure how to change…

    …again, society did not react to their needs, they cannot change themselves without interventions…

    …but yes, the op effectively cannot do anything about this, but can make changes for themselves….



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,448 ✭✭✭herbalplants


    The issue is your mother!! She enables it, she brings your brother to McDonald's twice a week!! That is a mother who wants that control over her boys, she feeds off the martyr status, look at me I am doing so much, trust me there are mothers like that.

    Walk away from this situation, nothing to fix. Go as far as you, perhaps another continent.

    Remember the shills only get paid when you react to them.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 675 ✭✭✭LilacNails


    I can see where your coming from, and agree but it's really hard to ignore and not have that "need" to help your siblings esp living in the same house as you. Its hard, frustrating seeing those you love in this suitation. It's unnatural.

    I can see how the op is making it their business, it's a sad and desperate suitation to be, speaking as someone who is experiencing something similar. I get what your saying about not making it the ops business, I just have to put it out there it's really not as easy as some may think.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14 Bogroll2003


    Parent doesn’t change since they are getting some need met by “failure to launch” sons living at home. Don’t listen to the sob stories.

    Mother likes to feel in control, and she is achieving this by “keeping” 3 now adult children at home. She’s the eternal victim.

    They need me, I’m indispensable to them. I’m still in control though they don’t realise it as they’re still operating like little children. Give them play money, gaming, McDonald’s. Kids love that stuff.

    She has kept them in this state.


    OP, just get on with your own life and leave them to it, or you’ll be sucked in for the next 40 years.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,959 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    mother more than likely struggles with anxiety issues, which leads to controlling behaviors, tis messy stuff….



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14 Bogroll2003


    Possibly any of a variety or combination of personality disorders. You’d need to go back through the annals.

    OP what’s your take on your parent’s place in it all? You seem more calibrated to adult life. Maybe your brothers don’t have the skills to extricate themselves from their mother or home life.

    Is she domineering under it all?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,188 ✭✭✭Deregos.


    Its well recognised how mother's tend to mollycoddle their sons. When i was 21 my dad took me aside and in no uncertain terms told me to "get out and see the world, travel and make a life for yourself". I was kinda taken aback at the time but in hindsight, he was absolutely correct and solely the best bit of advice/ tough love he ever gave me. I'll be giving the same advice to my own children.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 675 ✭✭✭LilacNails


    Father's can be just as controlling and dominating.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,959 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    op, if you re not on social housing lists, it would be a good idea to do this also….



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,513 ✭✭✭bb1234567


    The one doing multiple interviews seems promising no? Surely he must be demonstrating skills to employers if he got the interviews, employers don't interview people for the good of their health.

    I also think his episode of suicidal tenancy would indicate his mental abilities to deal with what many of us call 'daily life problems' is far different to a neurotypical person and with such genuine dangers potential here I think you should fully respect there is need for professional help in his case.

    Could they begin with some parttime jobs potentially at least just to accustomise themselves to responsibility and take financial burden off your parents? The 40 hour working week isn't any joke. I does always cross my mind tbh whenever I have bouts of insomnia just how absolutely impossible my typical professional job would be if I was anything but in tip top pshycial and mental health condition. I really genuinely feel such empathy for people dealing with that alongside a job. It must be an incredible burden and the healh issues/job demand exasperate each other in a never ending vicious circle as well.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,959 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    …its understandable why many people with such issues do indeed remain long term unemployed….



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