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General Premier League Thread 2023-24 Mod Note in op 27/6/23 And 21/05/24

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Comments

  • #11732
    eagle eye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 42,000 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122185230#Comment_122185230

    Its quite possible they need a bunch of players but one great signing can change things quickly. If you managed to sign a Van Dijk or a Kante it could make a huge difference.

    I don't think they need anybody in the forwards. Hojlund looks very talented and you'd expect Garnacho to improve again and you've got Bruno Fernandez. They just need to get a tune out of one of Antony, Mount, Rashford or Sancho if they hold onto him.



  • #11733
    El Gato De Negocios
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 8,360 ✭✭✭El Gato De Negocios


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122188055#Comment_122188055

    Mozart wouldn't be able to get a tune out of Antony, he is absolute muck. Sancho I hope is sold, regardless if ETH is kept or not. Mount, who knows whether he can stay fit. Rashford has looked completely disinterested for most of the last 6 months and i wouldn't be at all sorry to see him sold. We 100% need a forward to play / rotate with Hojlund. There's still alot of gaps in the team that the manager needs to fill. At a minimum we need a top level centre half, a top level left back, top level central midfielder and a top level forward.



  • #11734
    ShamoBuc
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 36,219 CMod ✭✭✭✭ShamoBuc


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122188065#Comment_122188065

    You could probably add an 'Odd Jobs Man' to the above list to help fix the stadium.

    Even getting all the above a major ask- not sure who the right manager would be either. An interesting couple of months ahead either way.



  • #11735
    LuckyLloyd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,796 ✭✭✭✭LuckyLloyd


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122188050#Comment_122188050

    Wow I never heard that Ferguson story! Completely changes my mind.



  • #11736
    ronjo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,199 ✭✭✭ronjo


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122184266#Comment_122184266

    Fully agree with you here. Cant have the cheats winning everying 👍️

    First time I was up for United in a Cup Final since 1983 Milk Cup Final



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  • #11737
    Mitch Connor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 48,915 ✭✭✭✭Mitch Connor


    Arteta being given time is another example that can be used with Eth. Finished 8th in his first full season, then progressed to 5th, then second.

    But, conversely you could point to emery finishing 5th in his only full season and then being sacked the following November.

    But just because other managers have turned it around doesn't mean Eth will or would.



  • #11738
    klose
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,302 ✭✭✭✭klose


    I think the sheer amount of shots united faced this season is Ten Hags biggest issue that he will face when the season is reviewed, that and a negative goal difference and an 8th place finish it’s a bit of a hard sell for him not to be sacked IMO. His transfers have been poor to average.


    His arguments are of course a very good FA cup win against one of the best sides to play ever, he could point to injuries too I suppose?

    I think his main saving grace is the lack of managers about. Tuchel and Poch have their positives no doubt but if it’s any sort of longevity they want they aren’t the guys.



  • #11739
    El Gato De Negocios
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 8,360 ✭✭✭El Gato De Negocios


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122188154#Comment_122188154

    You cant really point to Arsenal being right for sacking Emery when they did, considering he went on to win a European trophy with Villarreal and he has guided Villa into the Champions League for the first time in a generation. Emery had inherited a bloated squad, full of journey men and lads on fat contracts that were unable to deliver onfield, not unlike United. He also got a torrid time from the press and fans "good ebening". Once upon a time the majority of Arsenal fans on Boards were calling for Arteta to be sacked and I can only recall 1 or 2 that gave him full backing.



  • #11740
    Fitz*
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,898 ✭✭✭✭Fitz*


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122188154#Comment_122188154

    Key point here being that Arteta progressed Arsenal. ETH is taking Man Utd backwards.



  • #11741
    CSF
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 34,882 ✭✭✭✭CSF


    Surely we can all agree, that whatever our individual opinions, using one managerial example out of hundreds that manage at a highly level each year, is not an indicator of anything else that might happen in the future.



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  • #11742
    Van Tall Cemetery
    Posts: 1,045 ✭✭✭ Van Tall Cemetery


    I've been saying this for ages but every manager should get 3 years. Doesn't happen in these times unfortunately.



  • #11743
    Mitch Connor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 48,915 ✭✭✭✭Mitch Connor


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122186750#Comment_122186750

    Several questions on that though.

    Is it because it is what he realises he needs to do medium term or will he revert to chaos ball if given the chance next season?

    Why has he only done this with 3 games to go, rather than at any points in the year of 2024 when it was clear, when NEWPORT were walking through us, that chaos ball wasn't going to work? Is the 4222 thing, with no strikers, we have seen in the last 3 games purely prep for the cup final vs City?

    Is what he has done the last few games even usable long term? would United as a club, or its fans, accept playing zero strikers as our consistent style? would it work with Hojlund in for McTominay?



  • #11744
    billyhead
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,253 ✭✭✭✭billyhead


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122188269#Comment_122188269

    Also did Arteta have the same money to spend?



  • #11745
    Fitz*
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,898 ✭✭✭✭Fitz*


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122188442#Comment_122188442

    ETH had more money to spend, on average, but over the 2 full seasons that both managers have been at their clubs, they have spent the same amount of money give or take.

    Permanent transfers only, gross spend according to transfermarkt. Raya's full fee is not accounted for, and the likes of Amrabat are not included either.

    image.png


  • #11746
    jacool
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,130 ✭✭✭jacool


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122188050#Comment_122188050
    image.png

    You are "ball park" true with your answer. Diagram shows the two second places were actually 4 seasons apart.

    "Won the FA cup but only finished 13th in the league after finishing 11th the year before and winning nothing. He was given another year, runner-up in the league and won the cup winners cup followed by another runner-up finish in the league the year after and then the first of many league titles." I can't actually recall the 11th, 2nd, 12th thing myself!



  • #11747
    ronjo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,199 ✭✭✭ronjo


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122188621#Comment_122188621

    Title challenge incoming for ETH considering almost twice as much spent 😁



  • #11748
    CSF
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 34,882 ✭✭✭✭CSF


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122188354#Comment_122188354

    Unfortunately this would rely on the people making the hires to be better at their jobs than they are.


    Look at the switch from Gerrard to Emery for example. Where do we think Villa would be now if they had to have Gerrard there until November this year?


    Every case on it’s individual merits etc.

    Post edited by Boards.ie: Mike on


  • #11749
    artanevilla
    Moderators, Education Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 11,871 Mod ✭✭✭✭artanevilla


    League 1.



  • #11750
    LuckyLloyd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,796 ✭✭✭✭LuckyLloyd


    https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/erik-ten-hag-future-manchester-united-ratcliffe-b2551694.html

    One Cup game does not a manager make



  • #11751
    Van Tall Cemetery
    Posts: 1,045 ✭✭✭ Van Tall Cemetery


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122189087#Comment_122189087

    You must hate winning trophies! Surprised you're quoting an article by Miguel Delaney of all people.



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  • #11752
    eagle eye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 42,000 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122188132#Comment_122188132

    What do you mean he was 1 of 1?

    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122188140#Comment_122188140

    Did you read my post?

    My point is that Ferguson was kept despite awful performances in the league. We don't know why, it's possible there were things going on behind the scenes that we were unaware of. There was a clear out after that season and suddenly things turned around.

    So if ETH gets another season it may be a similar situation where a clear out is required. Rashford looks like he doesn't care, Casemiro looks lost, Antony looks like he's about to lose his cool all the time and he does a fair bit. We could go on and on. If we see a clear out in the summer then we know there was problems in the locker room.

    We are just amateurs with very little important information. Second guessing a man who has a good record as an owner and manager of sports teams is ridiculous. This is the biggest project he's taken on, give the man some time. If ETH goes there's lots who will praise him but to castigate the new owner if he stays is a pretty stupid stance to take because you know nothing about why the decision was made or what's going on behind the scenes at the club.

    Rashford may be a problem or it may be others in the locker room.

    Like none of us knew about the rifts in the Barcelona dressing room many years where you had three cliques, the Catalans, the Dutch and the rest who were nicknamed the United colours of Benetton. Manu Petit spilled this a couple of years ago. It took them about five managers and six years to sort that problem out. Frank Rijkaard was the man to do it. Through all this time there was never a word about it.

    So let's wait and see what happens and accept, without criticism, Ratcliffe's decision until such time as it's clearly working or not working out.

    Post edited by Boards.ie: Mike on


  • #11753
    LuckyLloyd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,796 ✭✭✭✭LuckyLloyd


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122189122#Comment_122189122

    I didn’t really read your post now, I must admit. The Alex Ferguson argument to keep on managers is very tired and irrelevant.

    This isn’t that complicated tbh:

    • new regime
    • Manger 2 years into a 3 year contract
    • Worst EPL performance in club history
    • Relatively inexpensive point to install new manager for a new regime and start implementing the INEOS plan on and off the field

    The immediate fan emotion of a once off Cup game should be discounted. If they can’t stick to their vision in this spot due to being reactive to fan opinion it might raise questions about the long term vision here. You can’t run a football club successfully by fan polling.



  • #11754
    jacool
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,130 ✭✭✭jacool


    My buddy with a half an inside line at Leicester has come back close to tears.

    Says Maresca has just signed at Chelsea. Nothing official in the media though that I can see.



  • #11755
    Mitch Connor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 48,915 ✭✭✭✭Mitch Connor


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122189358#Comment_122189358

    Reports they've made an official approach for him. But no reports of it being signed.



  • #11756
    djan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,015 ✭✭✭djan


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122188154#Comment_122188154

    I don't think it's really a comparison as Arteta had to completely rebuild a sub par squad along with some internal issues and rather quickly was able to improve the underlying stats regardless of results.

    The Arsenal players bought into the tactics and were very vocal in their support and asked for patience from the fans as they slowly implemented it. With ETH it seems the players never really bought into it and a clear style of play was never really established.



  • #11757
    Fitz*
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,898 ✭✭✭✭Fitz*


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122189349#Comment_122189349

    Kenny Dalglish was sacked by FSG after winning a domestic cup, reaching another domestic cup final and a poor league performance.



  • #11758
    LuckyLloyd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,796 ✭✭✭✭LuckyLloyd


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122189437#Comment_122189437

    In retrospect it was the right decision



  • #11759
    eagle eye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 42,000 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122189349#Comment_122189349

    So you know what's been going on behind the scenes at United? You know the real reason why Casemiro has fallen off a cliff, why Rashford looks disinterested, why Antony always looks angry?

    You know that everything that's been going on at United is Ten Haag's fault just like it was with Solksjaer, Mourinho, Van Gaal and Moyes. There is no way that there could have been meddling hands higher up in the club causing issues.

    As somebody who doesn't support any team in the Premier league I tend to look at a broader picture. It's not always the guy on the front lines that's the problem.

    Like Klopp gets the credit for all that's happened at Liverpool but would he have had that success under Hicks and Gillett?



  • #11760
    eagle eye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 42,000 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122189577#Comment_122189577

    I haven't heard much about anybody besides Klopp, I've heard him get the credit for everything.

    Post edited by Boards.ie: Mike on


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  • #11761
    LuckyLloyd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,796 ✭✭✭✭LuckyLloyd


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122189519#Comment_122189519

    Again, it’s not that complicated.

    The entire structures of the club need to be overhauled and the stadium needs to be rebuilt. This is the time where you bring in your own man you believe in who is hired in the context of how you intend to proceed with the running of the club.

    Anyway, interested to see what they decide!



This discussion has been closed.
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