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Leinster Team Talk Thread (Love you Furlong time)

19149159179199201415

Comments

  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 36,369 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney


    La Rochelle are no great shakes. It's chasing shadows thinking that beating last year's champions means anything.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,819 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    LaR are fairly gash this year! There's a better side comingup next week, and I'd prefer if it was LaR. We've lost 5 in the league, crawled over the line v Connacht and nearly blew the match v Saints.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 672 ✭✭✭Madeoface


    I thought we lost a lot when Ngati went off. Not overly upset about the loss tho as we'll 5 point Connaught. Ryan played well on return as did Hugo.

    Foley better option than Luke now but he was a solid performer in years gone by too so let's not **** all over him. It's the management that pick the team.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,721 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    well you don’t put any stock in beating the current premiership leaders either so we’re working off a pretty small sample size here



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,972 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    Losing these games is frustrating, but I don't think it's that big a deal in the long run either. We've a great 23/26 players who can beat anyone home or away.

    I certainly wouldn't go talking down the victories over La Rochelle either. Especially the one in France. That was a massive deal.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,349 ✭✭✭✭Foxtrol


    Lost 5 in the league and every single one Leinster rested a huge proportion of the first team.

    Connacht win was the same, a complete shadow side.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,819 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    Agreed! But..... I think in the past we win these matches. I feel like there's a drop off this year.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,819 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    Looking at Ngati's try, he looks like he's injured as he's running the ball in.



  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 36,369 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney


    That's kind of the point. The Leinster first team has not much of a track record of late. Two matches, against a mediocre La Rochelle and a good Northampton team who decided to knock on 87 times in the first half and dominate Leinster in the second is nothing to build any kind of confidence in the side off

    I seem to remember you pooh-poohing the idea that Leinster wouldn't steamroll Northampton risible. Maybe you now put stock in that narrow victory.

    They could well overturn Toulouse. They might even win the URC. I wouldn't put any money on either though.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,972 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    Anyway. Next week is the big one. I think we'll do it. I know there are still some reservations about our rush defence, but I've seen enough in our games against La Rochelle and Northampton to be relatively confident we can cope with Toulouse.



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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 32,769 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    Leinster are 100% worse this year than last. But they beat Toulouse handily last year so there is some buffer room there. Let's see.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 440 ✭✭conquestscarer


    I don't know, we arent as clinical but I think our team could be set up better for knockouts. We learnt the last couple years that you can't go out in finals and just score 70 points. I think our defence is a lot better this year and last year we were playing an outdated system on that side of the ball.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 32,769 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    I know that is one angle, but I don't agree in the slightest. We beat a significantly worse LAR team, outside of that we have shown nothing to suggest we are better than last year in any degree. I'm not sure what about a stuttering attack and a defence that suffocates until you get around the edges and then is filleted is better.

    I'd take our team from last year 100% over this.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,972 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    Leinster's attack has been the point of difference between them and Toulouse in recent fixtures.

    Toulouse's main defensive weapon is the jackal turnover. They're excellent at stealing the ball and launching counter-attacks from deep. But if you can keep the ball away from them they lose discipline and start conceding penalties/line breaks.

    Under Lancaster we had the perfect attacking system to nullify that defence. We were very ruck oriented, prioritising speed at recycling to make our way up the pitch, setting up the next ruck and the next after that and the next after that. Toulouse couldn't touch our ball. Unfortunately La Rochelle's defensive system was different and coped with our attack much better.

    We've moved away from that attacking system to being more unstructured and taking more risks. It worked against La Rochelle, but we may see Toulouse making more steals at the breakdown next weekend.

    Post edited by Clegg on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,972 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    I think we'll do the double.

    There's an attitude about this Leinster side I haven't seen before. We've always been shithouses that pushed the legality of our game to breaking point. But this season I've watched us playing spitefully and with more aggression.

    Think we're sick of the losses in knockout games and just trying to get over the line any way possible.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 910 ✭✭✭johnh6767


    Winning the top title in Europe is a massive massive massive achievement, sometimes I fear we talk about it as a fait de complis which is nuts, incredible achievement to get to the final, and now a toss of the coin 50/50 between 2 incredible teams



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,721 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    We beat a significantly worse LAR team, 

    They aren't the team they were last year but they're still fifth in the Top14 and they made a big deal about targeting our game… and we put 40 points on them. We put 47 points on an almost full-strength Bulls team, 60 on the Ospreys.

    I don't think we're playing as well as last year either, but equally I think we're overstating the issues too.

    Tonight was a very disappointing game but ultimately not a big deal in the context of next week. Ryan and Keenan got through 80 minutes, that's about the extent of what we learned. We were never going to able to have continuity going into the final, that's just the downside of being in both tournaments and being bulk supplier to Ireland.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 32,769 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    And we put 55 on Leicester and 41 on Toulouse last year. We lost the final and the record books are what they are, but we were a better team last year.

    We had the embarrassment against the Bulls but beat the Lions, unlike the absolute mess against the Sharks this year. I'm somewhat sanguine about tonight's game, it is only causing problems because of some of the other ropey performances, not least losing to Ulster at home earlier in the season.

    I'll be thrilled if we win next week, but we are worse and Toulouse are better so I'm not that hopeful. but we have a 20 point buffer to work with…

    I also completely disagree with the "that's the reality of being in both competitions" stuff. I think our selection didn't help and screwed us last year, and I don't think the lack of continuity is doing us any favours this year either.

    And yes, I'm generally just annoyed and venting partly also.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,721 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    I also completely disagree with the "that's the reality of being in both competitions" stuff. 

    I think we got it wrong for the semi-final last year, but I'm not sure what else we could have done tonight, it would have been madness going full strength for a game that was a nice-to-win a week out from the CC final.

    I don't think the lack of continuity is doing us any favours this year either.

    Yeah, that's exactly my point? We're chopping and changing week to week because we have to, not because we're trying to be clever, and it's inevitable that there will be a trade-off in performance.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 32,769 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    I don't disagree about tonight. I think the damage was done earlier in the season. I would have preferred a stronger bench but that's a mild enough critique.

    I've been unimpressed with a lot of our performances in the league this year, which I think goes beyond the changing of personnel - something that didn't impact us as much in years gone by. That being said, I still disagree we "have to" change as much. We choose to several times as well and I don't think it is helpful. Perhaps the approach of this year wins the CC final and the URC final and I'll look silly. But I think we look a worse team in general, and I definitely think we look worse outside a few select big games.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,819 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    Chopping and changing has never been a problem before. In fact, the "b" side generally beat most sides. What's happening at the minute is strange. There's something not kosher.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,349 ✭✭✭✭Foxtrol


    When was damage done earlier in the season?

    The only game lost were they could field a decent side was the Christmas fixture against Ulster, even then key players were on enforced rest. For Warriors loss the Irish players weren't back from WC and then it was only the SA trip.

    You know well the Irish players have their minutes limited. Other provinces are getting away with starting their star players every match at the tail end of the season because they're sitting at home with their feet up during the CC knockouts.

    After next weekend, Leinster's first team players will have rested the same number of weekends since the first CC knockout match as each of the first team sides of the other provinces (3 weekends off each).

    It is fine that challenging on two fronts is hard - it is supposed to be and why doubles are so rare.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,368 ✭✭✭OldRio


    What has changed? The opposition have improved.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 5,269 Mod ✭✭✭✭Lost Ormond


    It isn't strange at all. Have thought ever thought that the opposition are maybe that bit stronger and it isn't something up with leinster or not right with them?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,721 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    We’ve lost to Glasgow in October, Ulster in January and Ulster in May. The trip to SA was meaningless because we had no intention of winning.

    Trying to piece together patterns and meaning from three matches spread over eight months is futile in the extreme.

    We’ll know where we stand at the end of our run in the URC, whenever that comes.



  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 36,369 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney


    What's the likelihood of playing a URC knockout in Pretoria?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,088 ✭✭✭Clo-Clo


    I said at the start of the season this might have to be a write off season, mainly due to Lancaster moving on, Nienaber only available post WC and the majority of the coaching team off working with teams in the WC and not available for Leinster

    Plus Leinster lost their captain and main players for the last 15+ years, a huge transition.

    We are doing a lot better than I thought we would be.

    People are judging this team and players based on the year Lancaster left, he had been a coach at that stage for 7 years wasn't it? he had every players full onboard with how he wanted the game played, no chance Nienaber was going to achieve that in a single season.

    The league of course has also got a lot stronger, back when Lancaster started it was turn up with whatever team you had available and it was bonus point before half time. The quality of the URC has certainly improved.

    At end of day, Ulster played well, Leinster played ok and make mistakes. Ulster won and based on the game deserved it, Leinster could and maybe should have won but for some errors.

    I think Stockdale comments said it all after the game. I do like Ulster, LIke Richie and hopefully they can kick on and maybe meet them in a final



  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 36,369 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney


    You're spot on to be honest. Leinster are in a better position than should have been expected given the changes. Winning nothing again would still be a kick in the balls at this point though.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,883 ✭✭✭LostArt


    I think we could be looking at a home quarter and then a trip to Thomond. Munster will win their game easily enough, Bulls have Sharks after their final and the travel back and Glasgow should eat up the points difference and overtake us.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,022 ✭✭✭✭Exclamation Marc


    Leinster will never have a "write off" season.

    They're in a Champions Cup Final and have looked good in Europe to date and they're in the top half of the URC play-offs.

    I appreciate that in the league we're clearly not at the same level as last year but this doomsday narrative is way overblown. We lost by two points yesterday and one point in January to Ulster. If we'd won either of those, we'd be top.



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