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Brexit Impact on Northern Ireland

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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,446 ✭✭✭Fionn1952


    How's that any different from the usual for Bryson? I'd imagine it is some combination of, 'jackboots', 'Unionist subjugating Protocol', 'No Surrender' and calling a few people Lundys.

    Do yourself a favour and ignore the gobsh*te.



  • Registered Users Posts: 67,598 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Too much entertainment tbh. The twisting snd turning is done with some aplomb, I have to give him that much.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,680 ✭✭✭serfboard


    Though I find myself less and less able to listen to the shrill voices, it's always interesting to know how the other side thinks. Jeffrey has to constantly watch his back for the knife that might be plunged into it both by those in his own party, or by those who might outflank him on the TUV side. So far, from his point of view, he's managed to retain and even recover some TUV votes, but people on the ground must surely be getting fed up with the shenanigans now and just want an Assembly back for all sorts of very practical reasons.



  • Registered Users Posts: 67,598 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Bryson will have to kick and scream from afar as he seems to have outlived his usefulness and been pushed away from the DUP.

    It will indeed be fascinating to see what Dodds, Wilson, Paisley etc do if Jeffrey capitulates on the 7 tests/Acts of Union/Sea border etc..



  • Registered Users Posts: 67,598 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    The rather limp sarcasm in this tweet shows the deal is done and the word is out on the political grapevine that none of the DUP's primary objectives has been achieved.

    .




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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,680 ✭✭✭serfboard


    Maybe Jeffrey was playing th'oul 4d chess after all. In which case the strategy was this - drag it out for as long as possible, getting the tiniest concessions, until his own voters get the message that no more will be forthcoming and to hold out for anything more means blocking the Assembly indefinitely. They are seeing the effects of no Assembly now, and given the choice between the effects of no Assembly, and rigidly sticking to the principles, they've decided to let it slide.

    And now that the voters have understood this, he can go back into the assembly without risking any great losses to the TUV. The few billion from the British government will also help.

    In a way, it's reminiscent of the Boris Johnson playbook which was to do nothing for as long as possible until, in the end, there was only one course of action left.



  • Registered Users Posts: 67,598 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    I'd consider that as a theory had Jeffrey shown any strategic nous or ability in the past. But he hasn't. I think he has blundered blind to this point.



  • Registered Users Posts: 67,598 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    3.3 billion on the table. Talks 'over' according to Chris Heaton-Harris.

    What's happens next is anyone's guess.




  • Registered Users Posts: 4,680 ✭✭✭serfboard


    You'd have to wonder are they going to roll the dice on another Assembly election, and hope that the Shinners don't get the most votes and qualify for the First Minister title.

    They also have to watch their back for the TUV knife:

    Yesterday, Mr Donaldson said he will not be intimidated or deflected after posters were put up across Northern Ireland accusing him of a "sell-out".

    The posters appeared overnight, including outside Mr Donaldson's constituency office in Lisburn. The DUP leader accused political rivals in the TUV of being behind the campaign.



  • Registered Users Posts: 67,598 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Jeffrey continues to maneuver into position to climb down.




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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,680 ✭✭✭serfboard


    [He] has told members in his New Year message that he wants to restore Northern Ireland’s place in the UK market – but also retain access to the EU market.

    Jeffrey again stating the irreconcilable. I don't think this is climbing down - more like going around in circles to me.



  • Registered Users Posts: 67,598 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    It's a fair point of criticism. Had the british been honest maybe Unionists would not have been so easily fooled by the DUP that 'progress was been made'.

    Basically we are arriving into another bung station and the DUP will try use that to cover their blushes.




  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,047 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    I see the strikes have kicked off today. Wonder what the sentiment is on the ground, having seen Stormont once again empty after a failed Speaker vote, the money earmarked to sort this Strike going begging thanks to the DUP.

    Today is also I believe when the Secretary of State calls for another election - will he? Cos the optics must surely look bad for everyone with a Tory or Unionist blue hue at this stage...



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,830 ✭✭✭10000maniacs


    It was never the case that Donaldson or anyone from the DUP was ever going to be deputy to Michelle O'Neill. This was never going to happen.

    The DUP can come up with every Brexit excuse under the sun, but this was always the underlying issue.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,047 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    Perhaps but where does it end? They can't indefinitely drag their feet, the cash bung doesn't seem to have persuaded them to return and I can't imagine the threat of joint UK/IE rule is gonna go down well either.

    It's just unclear where the end is for them. Not that I'm ascribing strategy to a party whose reason to be is to cross their arms and go "no".



  • Registered Users Posts: 32,326 ✭✭✭✭gmisk


    I would like to have both your cakes and my own cake and eat them all vibes



  • Registered Users Posts: 67,598 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Crunch time for the DUP

    Jim Allister upping the No Surrender ante too.




  • Registered Users Posts: 6,841 ✭✭✭Brussels Sprout


    Have there been any opinion polls recently? Last one I can see is from October where the DUP were at 28%. If they can maintain that kind of number I can't see them going back. If they were to take a hit on that though that would surely sharpen minds. Now that 150k public sector workers realise that their wages are tied to Stormont resuming that may translate to the polls.



  • Registered Users Posts: 68,197 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    There's basically one polling company that does the North and that's their last poll. And 28% is a recent (5+ year) record for the DUP



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,047 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    One wonder what has been said that this time the DUP are willing to climb down? What was said to them from Whitehall that made them realise this was as far as their little tantrum could go? Or do they realise the Strikes are perhaps a point of no return in terms of the public's patience for their intransigence? Cos a lot of folk will start drawing thick lines between public pay and the DUP's stunt in Stormont.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 67,598 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady




  • Registered Users Posts: 68,197 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    They might be able to try play that as a win to a certain type of fleg-hugger in their core vote base. Allister will never be happy with anything they do, and isn't great at convincing enough people to vote for him so he's not the threat he thinks he is



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,047 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    I don't mean to be smug, but if that report is true, it tallies with my prior sarcasm that they'd be given nothing more than a condencending pat on the head for being extra special unionists. But hey, if it got people back into Stormont, it's a pretty small concession that amounts to a hardcore feeling like the mainland gives a damn about them




  • Registered Users Posts: 4,489 ✭✭✭political analyst



    Prof Katy Hayward wrote:

    "At root, DUP demands to be asked for their ‘consent’ are a quest for more security in an increasingly uncertain context for unionists. This relates both to its protest at the UK-EU Protocol on Ireland/Northern Ireland (which introduced new post-Brexit trading rules and practices between Northern Ireland and Great Britain) and to concerns as to the significance of a nationalist party being the largest in the Assembly.

    Indeed that latter point may explain why not only strong unionists (88%) but also a significant portion of softer unionists (37%) disagree that the Assembly should be fully-functioning even now the UK has secured adjustments to the Protocol via the Windsor Framework. The wariness of that cohort of strong, anti-Windsor Framework unionists cannot be ignored. It stands at about 30% of the active electorate, even as Northern Ireland society is becoming less unionist as a whole.

    In making a decision about a return to Stormont, the DUP wants to keep as much of that strong unionist support, while recognising that functioning devolution is necessary to keep NI in the Union longer term. The intensity of this conundrum helps explain the reluctance of the DUP leadership to make a decision, or even to accept the Secretary of State’s assertion that their side-talks have come to an end."



  • Registered Users Posts: 67,598 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    The fact is they cannot be given anything near to what they want and nobody in the UK (based on the vote in WM) cares or is disposed to give it to them.

    What galls is that this hasn't been spelt out to them and that they were not sent packing.

    The British will faff around and around until the situation deteriorates so much it is crisis time.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,465 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    The SoS for NI should call new elections for Stormont. It is 2 years since the last election but Stormont still locked out.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,047 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    I've been confused: isn't there a requirement to do so since the deadline of Wednesday gone? Or is this all because of these supposed sops potentially thrown to the DUP?



  • Registered Users Posts: 67,598 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    He can defer them. And I think he has.

    Not sure what it would achieve to have another election.

    What really needs to happen is to stop pandering to the DUP and for the British and Irish governments to convene under the auspices of the GFA and agree proper reforms that can be put to the parties that have signed up to the GFA.

    The very idea that a single political party are in 'secret' meetings bartering with the futures of all the people of NI is not sustainable. The Irish government should be calling this out.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,465 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    If the DUP will not agree to anything, then it is time for the electorate to decide.

    The SoS for NI could load the dice by announcing that the public pay will only be increased following a functioning Stormont. Of course, Joint Authority is another angle to dangle.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,047 ✭✭✭Glaceon


    If they somehow come out on top as the largest party, then they don’t need to work under a Nationalist FM. In that case, running a fresh election could give them what they want, but they’d probably disguise it as “the people have spoken so let’s get on with it”.



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