Hamas strike on Israel - mod warning in OP updated 19/10/23

Ridiculous stuff. "From the River to the Sea" as promulgated by Hamas and their apologists is genocidal. Pretending it is something else is completely disingenuous.

If you want an idea of what would happen were Hamas to succeed, take a look at Sudan.

"What he feared then would occur, has occurred and is continuing, he said.

"That is the mass killing of non-Arab civilians in Darfur. Nobody cares," he added."

The ideology of Hamas, of some Arab states, of some Muslim countries includes the elimination or enslavement of others. Not just Sudan, just look at places like Dubai, built on the enslavement of ordinary people from places like Bangladesh.

If that isn't enough for you, consider the approach to women and LGBTQ+.

How can Israel have a ceasefire and target Hamas?

Falls at the the first hurdle, contradicts itself repeatedly, wills the ends but not the means.

Eg Palestinians remove Hamas... how?

Eg what does Israel, US and EU do if Hamas ignore demands for elections and ceasefire?

Thats not a practical solution, it is a list of aspirations.

Seriously? No one will risk sending them in, the way the region is so unstable.

In fairness Hamas are attacking only Israel as far I can tell. May as well ask why didn't France try stop the IRA

I don't have an issue with Israel trying to defeat them . You mustn't have read my posts, if you believe i have any affection for them. But I don't think a third party should intervene in the conflict even if Hamas are killing civilians. Would you want Egypt to intervene now that Israel is killing civilians wholesale?

I am only against the barbaric way Israel is conducting their operation against hamas not their objective.

Do you actually believe that there will be no members of Hamas left when this is over? They've been bombing the place to bits night and day for 6 weeks and reckon that they have killed less than 2,000 of them. Yet over 15,000 have died and 6,000 of them children. Do you see nothing wrong there?

That is literally where peacekeepers go.

I'm not talking about right now as Israel bombs everything it can, but immediately after a permanent ceasefire is announced.

That's the problem, some people don't seem to care that 15,000 civilians have been killed and only 2,000 Hamas. Maybe they are ok with 375,000 dead civilians (150,000 children) based on the ratio so far. They need that magical 40:1 ratio first 🤷🏻‍♂️

That's your biased opinion

no they do not go to unstable regions.

It would be a long time after a long ceasefire

Ah apologies I thought you meant other countries should help stop hamas.

I cant suggest a way to stop a terrorist group like Hamas as I'm no anti terrorist expert. Any other way is better then killing multiple children for every enemy combatant. It's worrying that Israel despite these results have continued using the same methods and that the Israeli population hasn't objected to them.

That's why I reckon Hamas will be actually just as strong after all this ends. They will have more recruits every day the bombs rain down and innocent people die. If Israel treated the Palestinians like human beings instead of human animals they would do better. Stop brutalising them and maybe they will start showing more respect. You catch more flies with honey than you do with vinegar.

There's a fcuking gigantic difference between the indiscriminate dropping of 1000's of pounds of bombs and the focused targeting of individuals using special forces or the likes. We've had people on here today saying that the shooting of kids in Palestine by the IDF didn't constitute breaking the ceasefire because the terms of the ceasefire didn't specifcally say that that was included.

And if you're comparing targeting Nazi leadership in the 1940's with this 1/4 of the way in to the 21st century as Israel tells Palestinians not to resist using drones, I don't know what to tell you.

And the allies did attempt to assassinate Hitler, operation Foxley was one such plan.

I'm not doing the same thing again tonight in explaining every minute thing to you so you can take or leave my post as it is unless you want to offer reasonable counter points or alternative solutions.

That's why I don't buy the narrative that Israel is not trying to wipe out Palestine, but only target Hamas.

Even the ardent Israel supporters, Tommy Robinson and the likes make a living on the messaging that defending ones own country is the paramount calling. Same in US with right wing conservatives who talk about defending their culture from the invading immigrants. The implication being that fighting people they see as invaders is acceptable.

And yet here, they cheer Israel on just because their opponents are on a lower level on the Race Pyramid in their eyes.

I mean even calling it far from ideal is a bit pithy, though im sure you didnt mean it to sound that way. I wouldn't justify the hamas massacre because of perceived injustices against the Palestinians so why do Israeli supporters try to underplay the civilian deaths in Gaza, especially death of children by their operations.

There seems a lot of selective outrage at the killing of civilians depending on whose side they are on.

Israel compared the 7 October attack to their 911 but they should remember there was alot of anti American sentiment for a number of years among the general population in many friendly countries because of the brutality of their response. Israel will no doubt claim victory when this operation ends but this will colour international opinion of them for many years.