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Sinn Fein and how do they form a government dilemma

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74,083 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady



    What party have ever borne responsibility?

    It's not in any political party's nature to do that and they don't, so it's kind of a moot point.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,628 ✭✭✭Augme



    Like it's always someone else fault for Fine Gael. They've been in Government for over a decade and are trying to pin the blame on the housing crisis on SF for objecting to housing developments. You couldn't make it up. 😂



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,788 ✭✭✭✭maccored


    give them a fair crack at the whip. to be fair, we have no idea how SF would react in government in the republic. Im sure there'll be a 'blah blah blah the assembly' comments, but a handful of parties trying to run a small area with finance dictated by a different country is nothing like what we have here as a government. I'd go as far as to say the likes of the DUP would wipe the floor with either FG or FF so SF are already a grade above the competition. put them in government and if they **** things up, then there'll never be an argument for them again. call their bluff.

    If you find yourself disagreeing mainly because you wouldnt want them to succeed then you have to start asking yourself if you care about the general good or only about yourself.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 29,882 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    Of course the question will have to be asked of SF. It's pertinent to the thread because I don't think they are capable of the kind of compromise and hard choices necessary to form a coalition government.

    Efforts are being made to fix the system (and the status ABP was allowed to degrade to is entirely FF/FG's fault) but SF oppose those also. They clearly have no interest in the situation actually being fixed. I know disingenuity is rampant in politics but it still irritates me.

    But sure, they'll potentially get a chance to show differently but their lack of anything close to practicality doesn't bode well for stable governance



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,788 ✭✭✭✭maccored


    You are asking a question, then deciding yourself what the answer would be, and to this you make another assumption - but 'It's pertinent to the thread because I don't think they are capable of the kind of compromise and hard choices necessary to form a coalition government.' One of the main protagonists in the peace process and who helped negotiate and deliver the GFA - they cant make hard choices?

    Thats a mad way of thinking about things is it not? Its all what ifs and what abouts.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,008 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    One swallow doesn't make a summer.

    They have been barely able to remain in government in the North for longer than ten minutes.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 29,882 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    I'm asking a question and surmising based on the actions of those involved. That's also not an assumption, its a judgement.

    It is not unique to SF in terms of being in opposition. But to follow through on their promises they are going to have to confront the locals and their councillors who they have backed in their objections almost every time. Maybe they will be a complete about face in power but I have difficulty believing they will.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74,083 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    At least with SF in government here we will see a recognition that the northern experiment in partition has failed, everyone.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 480 ✭✭Ramasun


    I wonder if the latest Hamas v Israel horror show will affect Sinn Fein's popularity.

    It's not right that Micheal D Higgins has had more to say about it than a party hoping to lead the next government.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,642 ✭✭✭Francis McM


    Its also not right that SF has had links to Hamas in the past - the party which started the current cycle of violence in the middle east by invading Israel at 3 am on a Saturday morning, killing hundreds, setting babies on fire and beheading them in front of families, and kidnapping hundreds and bringing back to Gaza. The same Hamas who say they would and repeat this as often as they can, given any opportunity, until Israel is wiped off the map / every Israeli is gone.

    Not surprising SF linked to Hamas given they also unveiled and gave a commemoration speech at the Statue of Sean Russell in Dublin, the same Sean Russell who collaborated with the Nazis when they were also trying to wipe every Jew off the map.

    So Ramsum, in conjunction with the recent books about SF, not surprising they fell in yesterdays poll, as discussed in the papers yesterday.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,008 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    What do Russia, Hamas and the Kinahans have in common?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74,083 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    ?? Silent?

    That’s a strange one. One look at their twitter and the Dàil record would disprove that. Matt Carthy was on Morning Ireland too being asked what their position on it would be and if they would talk to Hamas if in government.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,310 ✭✭✭BlueSkyDreams


    Or you may feel that SF do not represent the best interests or "general good" of the state.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74,083 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Or you intend voting for SF because the incumbents are not representing the best interests or general good of the state.

    Isn’t that the norm in democracies and how they function?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 480 ✭✭Ramasun


    Fianna Fail used to be Sinn Fein

    Official Sinn Fein became the Workers Party

    Provisional Sinn Fein/IRA are supposedly in retirement.

    Who are these latest franchisees?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 167 ✭✭mode1990


    Sinn Fein is the rock that this country will perish on , their slick propaganda is up their with the Russians RT TODAY , ,ITS the snowflake generation that doesn't know or chooses not to know about their despicable history , women's rights have come along in our Republic unless you're MARIA CAHILL , or a kid called PAUL QUINN beaten to death in earshot of his friends by animals like "slab Murphy " , who Mary lou described as a " Good Republican " , evil !



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74,083 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    The main governing parties of the state were born out of the same environment and didn’t have the scrutiny and monitoring as SF have had as they morphed into democratic entities.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 167 ✭✭mode1990


    I think Arthur Griffith , a true icon would be abhorred at what has passed itself off in his name !



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74,083 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    We’ll never know so why worry about it?

    The past is another country and as long as FF FG SF etc never go back to what they did then what we have is the normality.

    You could pick any figure in history and make the case they would be ‘abhorred’.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,310 ✭✭✭BlueSkyDreams


    Yes, you can vote for whom you want, for whatever reason you want.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 167 ✭✭mode1990


    Not so ! Original Sinn Fein were decent men & women ! The swing to a hard left Marxist ideology flopped , now they masquerade as a middle of the road party ! What do you think about Maria Cahill & Paul Quinn ????



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74,083 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Political parties change. Were FG called blueshirts as they flirted with a different ideology and didn’t a FF leader call himself a socialist?

    I think the same of Maria Cahill and Paul Quinn as I do of any victim of abuse or violence.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 167 ✭✭mode1990


    Fair play for being straight regarding Maria & Paul ! MOD has blocked me so I don't know if you'll even receive this message ! Does Mary Lou call the shots or is she still answerable to shadowy men , that's just one thing that scares me & it's probably enough to frighten the electorate away from a Sinn Fein majority government !



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74,083 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Irish electorate seemed frightened to give anyone a majority vote and could you blame them.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 167 ✭✭mode1990


    Sinn fein will form the next government with a broad coalition from the left ! It's easy to sling **** from the opposition benches , backing up all those promises will see them found out , especially if they're relying on jokers like Paul Murphy for support , a Blackrock education isn't what it used to be & TCD Is no longer a top 50 rated university ! The Labour Party in this country sorely needs genuine people like Tommy Broughton ! Anyway let's see how Mary Lou does !



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 480 ✭✭Ramasun


    Sinn Fein and People Before Profit are lead by private school graduates.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,988 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    if Labour go in with SF and PBP and something dodgy goes down that shouldn’t, as I’d suspect it might…. That could be the end of the Labour Party in Ireland as a serious political entity.

    they have just 7 seats currently in Dàil Èireann. It would be a monumental risk for Bacik & co. They have ZERO room for manoeuvre.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 167 ✭✭mode1990


    True , and as history shows from previous Dail's its the junior party who's vilified next time round , the PD's , Greens under Trevor Sergeant ! However it's a punt Bacik will take , she's chomping at the bit , has been since her days in the seanad ! Or we get the same again !



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74,083 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    and something dodgy goes down that shouldn’t, as I’d suspect it might

    Such as?

    Are we talking, flouting SIPO regs, criminal inquiries, crashing the economy, facilitating Russian money movement, playing fast and loose with our neutrality, tents to wine and dine party backers, jobs for selected boys and girls and party people etc?

    What are you 'suspecting' might happen?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74,083 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Withholding information is a crime in both jurisdictions.

    Has anyone from SF been arrested for 'withholding information' about this case?

    Has anyone in authority said 'senior SF members' are withholding information?

    Are you aware that the PSNI and Gardai and the IMC have detailed information on who did this and who was there?


    4.3 In Section 3 above we do not attribute the killing to PIRA 10. This is for several reasons: the local and personal nature of its roots; the absence of indications either of organisational sanction or that it was in the interests of PIRA; and because it was contrary to the declared policy which PIRA has been following for over two years. We are reinforced in this view by the subsequent public remarks to which we refer above. The fact that some local members or former members or associates of the organisation were involved in the incident does not in our view justify attributing it to PIRA. 

    The IMC are also pretty clear on what they think the tragic killing was about.

    - We think that the attack on Paul Quinn was planned and carried out by local people and that it arose from local disputes. Whatever the immediate reason for the killing certain aspects of these disputes go back some time and were not unconnected with continuing illegal activity; 

    Surely the 'dark days for democracy' are already here if the PSNI, Gardai and the IMC are ignoring what you claim?



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