"Green" policies are destroying this country

I'm not putting words in your mouth, you said this can be done for "practically free" and this is what I'm asking you to qualify. Thus far you've failed to outline how your idea comes at no cost to the farmer who otherwise would graze this land down before the winter (i.e. implicitly saving on silage and slurry storage capacity requirements). And until you can, I'm afraid it's all BS.

The reality is that leaving your lawn idle before winter is very different to a farmer bypassing his last grazing of the season.

Your last point is irrelevant to the discussion as you are advocating an extra month's storage requirement by default (even for those who can graze 10 months outside per year).

Yes. It's championed by many, Allan Savory being the main one who has advocated for this to try reverse desertification. How does that work in an Irish context where the ruminant animals do feed outdoors on grassland? Tramping of grasses isn't practiced much and that's due to the ability to grow more grasses with a different grazing management plan. To follow Savorys approach isn't cost effective in an Irish context.

What grazing practices aren't good. Bear in mind that in Ireland we can grow more grass with less inputs than nearly every country in the world. Irish ag are world leaders in grassland management. What can be done better while keeping it cost effective and as productive?

BTW, if ground can't sustain cattle outside, they are put in. Read the farming threads here and you'll see many with cattle housed not just now, but in periods during the summer in order to protect grasses and soils. There is a lot of higher land perfectly suitable for animals to be out year round. In fact, on of the best schemes was the Burren Winterage programme where animals were kept out and managed lands in the Burren. Newer schemes has put an end to that and the biodiversity gains as a result of the original programme are already starting to drop after just 1 year since the department introduced ACRES. organic farmers are also encouraged to keep animals out all year. And if ground can't support cattle, then it won't be much good for tillage or horticulture. What would it be used for then?

You're still not addressing how leaving grass long over the winter and shortening the grazing season comes at no financial consequence to the farmer, so I will take it at this stage that you're not able to.

October's growth is light and easily grazed to the stub, not even magic beans would solve this here. Also, not sure that video is looking at our systems as I don't see much of these around the place;

Renewable massacre continues... SolarEdge melts down after weak guidance.

The renewable energy industry is in full collapse mode this week. First, Orsted A/S, the world's largest offshore wind farm developer, abandoned two major US projects due to supply chain and interest rate impacts, and now solar stocks are being clubbed like a baby seal in US premarket trading on Thursday after solar equipment-makers SolarEdge and Sunrun reported dismal guidance amid waning demand. 

Holistic management and "mob grazing" is great, but not if you want to make a living.

However, you say you live in the Golden Vale and are criticizing grazing practices in one of the parts of the country where they are absolutely fantastic at grassland management. Your arguments aren't carrying much weight. Dairy animals are kept moving. They usually spend 24-36 hours on any parcel. then it's rested, usually for 21 days, depending on the rotation. Chemical fert use is collapsing across the board. More clover is being sown. More MSS is being sown. Very little *icides are blanket spread on grassland, apart from maybe after full reseeds for initial weed control and maybe to control docks periodically.

We do have feedlots in the country, but very few are standing on open land and fed grains. They would be fed forage based either directly from zero-grazers of ensiled products, with the organic matter being taken back to balance P & K offtakes. Feedlots in Ireland have nothing in common with elsewhere in the world apart from the name

Agreed. And lots of those would be on marginal land, and a high % would be now switching to organics to avail of higher supports.

This year it's tillage looking for the bailouts

But if bailouts are needed, then a) the market isn't returning enough or b) the weather has screwed usual management up to such an extent as requiring a bailout. Seeing as only 7% of consumers are willing to pay more for food despite a higher percentage saying they care for sustainability, market returns will always be lower than they should be. Furthermore, agriculture is one of the only industries where farmers buy at retail and sell at wholesale, in addition to being price takers and having no control over sales prices.

Grass is grazed to ensure it regrows with quality to again to produce more leafy grass with higher feed value than seedy/stemmy grass. Ideal height is 4cm and you'll see parcels grazed to that and then animals moved on. Zero grazing is doing the same as a cow and cutting to the same length. The negative is that the nutrients have to be brought back instead of going straight through the cow and back out.

Grassland reseeds are to encourage better grasses to grow. Like everything, after time the crop loses vigor and would need more fertilisers to get the similar yields. Reseeding is the most cost effective way to improve grasslands and can be done without ploughing/tilling which removes the risk of nitrate leaching when soil is turned and the N is exposed to the air. If it made more financial sense to sow tillage or vegetables or something then that's what many farms would do. Truth is, dairy is the most profitable and beef/sheep suits vast swaths of the counties soil types.

Cattle can be housed at anytime depending on the weather. And that's only done usually to protect the soil - not the animal. Cattle couldn't care less if it buckets rain as long as they have some shelter. That's why out-wintered animals do much better come spring time than those housed over the winter.

Everything does better with some rest. All land is nearly rested for 3/4 months each year over the winter. Or have you other ideas of what resting is.

Orchards and forestry don't pay, plus you are at the loss of the land which is devalued (there's also the added kicker that tax relief is list as it's no longer classed as agricultural). Pigs and chickens in Ireland are housed in intensive units. It's not a profitable business either except in small niche scale.

Exactly. And at the moment they've decided that what they have in grass makes the most sense to them

Fair bad that non farmers need an education in how a farmer goes about his job.it’s such a shame that the disconnect of how food gets to the table is so lost.one time if you asked a youngster where milk comes from they would say Tesco etc.now it would be that it comes from an app and it’s delivered to your kitchen in a delivery 🚚

Zero grazing is the same as grazing, except it's a machine doing it and not an animal. What about it don't you like? There are things like compaction due to the machine, time of doing so, increased diesel use, handling of the grass when it's brought in. All these add costs that aren't there by direct grazing, but the impact on the grass is the same as traditional grazing.

A bad spring is possible, and again that would lead to more forage being consumed instead of animals out grazing. A bad spring will rightly screw tillage where many a) didn't even get to harvest this year or b) harvest was poor. In addition to winter crops not being sown in the same quantities as previously owing to the weather, and any that was sown potential wrecked from excessive soil moisture. A bad spring would exacerbate this by impacting spring crop planting. With grasses animals "could" be let out to graze although it would lead to damage in fields from poaching (that's assuming a bad spring just means wet weather). That ground would recover and the grass regrow once conditions improved. This years feed tocks saved earlier in the year would be used first of course. Only then would there be an issue in trying to feed what would usually be out grazing. The hand will be out to get feed for animals and it's an animal welfare issue more than a begging opportunity to line pockets (some of course will game the system).

A recent Teagasc survey (though you can discount them as you don't like Teagasc!) have said 75% of farmers have surplus winter feed stocks this year. Others don't and up to 15% of farmers reckon they are short of feed for the winter. These plan to buy in extra, or reduce numbers. The farmers in the NW are suffering the most here which is to be expected as the bad summer meant a lot of the marginal ground in the region couldn't be harvested as it usually would. Note here however that the numbers in the initial survey in June were much better and the subsequent deterioration in the weather meant additional cuts weren't done, or were done but are poor quality.