Hamas strike on Israel - mod warning in OP updated 19/10/23

SafeSurfer · 23-10-2023 03:15AM

mode1990

Oct 23, 2023

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121272871#Comment_121272871
In a word "Abraham " , the father of the same monotheistic religions, that have fought tooth & nail over for centuries , each claiming their right and willing to commit terrible atrocities in the name Allah, yahweh or christ ! I'm not religious but I'd imagine "God" wouldn't get any glory from watching his most beloved creation mutilate each other in his name !

I don’t know, humans seem very capable of killing each other with out recourse to God for a reason. I don’t think religion features as a causes belli for any of the top 10 bloodiest wars in history.

amandstu · 23-10-2023 03:51AM

SafeSurfer

Oct 23, 2023

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121272890#Comment_121272890
I don’t know, humans seem very capable of killing each other with out recourse to God for a reason. I don’t think religion features as a causes belli for any of the top 10 bloodiest wars in history.

I think tit is responsible for most inter group killing and subjugation but tat also has a lot to be held accountable for.

It would be nice if we could isolate a factor or two that contribute to warfare between groups.

Perhaps if we examine trends, we may perhaps be able to discern the hidden hands behind the phenomenon.

Scarcity of resources seems like it might be a very big player.

BailenaMbocht · 23-10-2023 04:55AM

orangerhyme

Oct 23, 2023

Does anyone have any insight why the middle east has so many extremists and fundamentalists?
I know we'd the IRA but I don't think 2500 IRA members would've carried out the Hamas attack and be so comfortable martyring themselves.
I don't think it's racist to say that.
I'm guessing it's some combination of religion, culture, environment etc.
A book came out recently about why European society developed much faster than the middle east and Asia even though we were similar not too long ago.
I think it's called "The WEIRDest people" and WEIRD is an acronym for Western European Industrialised Rich Democratic. By Joseph Heinrich.
I think part of the thesis was that middle eastern people are very clan based. Whereas in Europe we were more society and individualistic based, I know that's a paradox.

The "fanatical terrorist arab" thinking is mostly due the news networks propaganda/social engineering. The constant repetition about evil arabs does a good job at convincing the ajority of the public.

hamass are a response to israels killing and abuse of the local people.

al-Qaida formed with USA help to fight russia.

ISIS are a response to US/UK's killing of millions of innocent locals.

The western war mongers/colonists are the real terrorists in this story. It would be interesting to see how history records this era of the people in power controlling all what the public consume for news, giving them free reign to wipe out millions of civilians while being celebrated by the public. Crazy world

Hoboo · 23-10-2023 05:20AM

Gatling

Oct 20, 2023

Shani Louk mother taking to priers Morgan, we all seen the horrific scenes where Shani's body was publicly desicrated by people in Gaza on the back of pick up stripped,legs broken and what looked like a gunshot wound to her head
The family are receiving text messages saying we spit on you from her boyfriends phone, somebody tried to spend her money in a Shop in Gaza
https://youtu.be/g8FjC7ObHF8?si=kKi7aSu-yC2qkg4r

Piers Morgan. That’s like quoting Wikipedia in a thesis.

Hoboo · 23-10-2023 05:30AM

Rosahane

Oct 20, 2023

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121263348#Comment_121263348
There wasn't an Israel until 1948.
...and there still isn't a "Palestine"

Something happened in 1988 that caused 138 out of 193 UN member states to disagree strangely enough. I also recall government elections, Hamas winning, civil war, the split between Gaza and the West Bank. There was even a flag.

Maybe I was dreaming.

23-10-2023 07:00AM

This post has 4.5 million views but you won't be surprised to know (well, Gatling and Rapidash might still be) that the translation is total b*llocks and is in fact calling for the girl to be released because she is a civilian.

https://twitter.com/davidpgoldman/status/1716068086649139340

SafeSurfer · 23-10-2023 07:39AM

amandstu

Oct 23, 2023

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121272901#Comment_121272901
I think tit is responsible for most inter group killing and subjugation but tat also has a lot to be held accountable for.
It would be nice if we could isolate a factor or two that contribute to warfare between groups.
Perhaps if we examine trends, we may perhaps be able to discern the hidden hands behind the phenomenon.
Scarcity of resources seems like it might be a very big player.

Colonialism, imperialism, slavery, fascism, communism.

If one examines the balance sheet in terms of killings and subjugation I don’t think religion has been the biggest cause.

circadian · 23-10-2023 07:43AM

mode1990

Oct 22, 2023

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121272797#Comment_121272797
So the fact that Israel had to fight two wars just to preserve itself is truly lost on you ! You probably think the Birmingham pub bombers should be eulogiesed !On the subject of acceptance, until Iran acknowledges Israel s right to exist and drop their "annihilation " mantra then "silly" people like me will speak the unpalatable truth !

Don't put words in my mouth. How you came to that conclusion is beyond me.

Gatling · 23-10-2023 08:10AM

[Deleted User]

Oct 23, 2023

This post has 4.5 million views but you won't be surprised to know (well, Gatling and Rapidash might still be) that the translation is total b*llocks and is in fact calling for the girl to be released because she is a civilian.
https://twitter.com/davidpgoldman/status/1716068086649139340

Lordbebo is one the biggest propaganda shills going.id suggest a better source for community notes

brickster69 · 23-10-2023 08:31AM

Gatling

Oct 22, 2023

Another Theory on the hospital involving the Israelis some how has been debunked
https://twitter.com/GeoConfirmed/status/1716113399728218618?s=20
And a War Crimes investigator Marc Garlasco whos investigated crimes several times in Gaza has his say about the scene and lack of evidence
https://twitter.com/marcgarlasco/status/1715858117789905099?s=20
https://twitter.com/marcgarlasco/status/1715858242868523044?s=20

He is actually debunking his very own theory that spread around the internet that it was falling debris from an intercepted missile. Now he is saying he has no clue what happened.

https://twitter.com/GeoConfirmed/status/1716123222142550167

This is the only footage of anything hitting the hospital. No one knows who fired it or what is was until evidence of the missile itself is released.

https://twitter.com/MiRyAM989/status/1714352669312139266

It is evidence from the hospital itself and the fragments of the bomb that is important. Pretty obvious if a kid was found on top of a roof 30 meters away and trees were snapped in half 3 meters up that anyone in those garden areas had no chance. If no evidence comes out you can be certain it was Hamas's fault.

Gatling · 23-10-2023 08:36AM

brickster69

Oct 23, 2023

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121271564#Comment_121271564
He is actually debunking his very own theory that spread around the internet that it was falling debris from an intercepted missile. Now he is saying he has no clue what happened.
https://twitter.com/GeoConfirmed/status/1716123222142550167
This is the only footage of anything hitting the hospital. No one knows who fired it or what is was until evidence of the missile itself is released.
https://twitter.com/MiRyAM989/status/1714352669312139266
It is evidence from the hospital itself and the fragments of the bomb that is important. Pretty obvious if a kid was found on top of a roof 30 meters away and trees were snapped in half 3 meters up that anyone in those garden areas had no chance. If no evidence comes out you can be certain it was Hamas's fault.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6034073/uploads/Q32KMI03FSNG/trees.jpg

Unfortunately not true.

Discodog · 23-10-2023 08:40AM

[Deleted User]

Oct 23, 2023

This post has 4.5 million views but you won't be surprised to know (well, Gatling and Rapidash might still be) that the translation is total b*llocks and is in fact calling for the girl to be released because she is a civilian.
https://twitter.com/davidpgoldman/status/1716068086649139340

So they released one girl but killed hundreds of other civilians & took 200 hostage.

23-10-2023 08:42AM

Discodog

Oct 23, 2023

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121272961#Comment_121272961
So they released one girl but killed hundreds of other civilians & took 200 hostage.

It's nothing more than a PR exercise.

Hamas understand perfectly well how to play the propaganda game when they want to.

Discodog · 23-10-2023 09:09AM

Israel are now saying 222 hostages

brickster69 · 23-10-2023 09:12AM

Gatling

Oct 23, 2023

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121273054#Comment_121273054
Unfortunately not true.

Unfortunately it is. No CCTV evidence or footage shows a missile hitting the hospital apart from one. You can see on CCTV, watch it two or three times and you can see no missile hitting just it landing.

https://twitter.com/ShayanX0/status/1714405856157057043

Gatling · 23-10-2023 09:13AM

brickster69

Oct 23, 2023

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121273064#Comment_121273064
Unfortunately it is. No CCTV evidence or footage shows a missile hitting the hospital apart from one. You can see on CCTV, watch it two or three times and you can see no missile hitting just it landing.
https://twitter.com/ShayanX0/status/1714405856157057043

It just landed .

Another word for Hitting the hospital

pjohnson · 23-10-2023 09:13AM

brickster69

Oct 23, 2023

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121273064#Comment_121273064
Unfortunately it is. No CCTV evidence or footage shows a missile hitting the hospital apart from one. You can see on CCTV, watch it two or three times and you can see no missile hitting just it landing.
https://twitter.com/ShayanX0/status/1714405856157057043

So are you finally admitting it wasn't Israel at last?

Tony EH · 23-10-2023 09:20AM

unkel

Oct 23, 2023

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121272837#Comment_121272837
You sum it up well. Israel simply has to annihilate Hamas. It's their only option. Hopefully most civilians have moved out of the areas where Hamas are hiding. Hopefully the number of civilians killed will be minimised. But I have a heavy heart and it is inevitable that tens of thousands of civilians will die.

They're not going about it terribly well are they? Indiscriminate bombing and wanton spoliation is only going to drive people into the arms of Hamas. Israel would do well to take a look at this Island and how support and the ranks of the IRA swelled after bloody Sunday. Israel aren't going to defeat Hamas with their current line of activity and I fail to see what strategic value it has for them. Murdering thousands of civilians in the pursuit of a revenge is only going to create a new generation of Palestinians who'll want to seek their own retribution further down the line.

Igotadose · 23-10-2023 09:26AM

Israel claims to have found a USB key with instructions on a cyanide dispersal weapon on the body of Hamas operative.

(https://www.axios.com/2023/10/21/israel-hamas-cyanide-weapon-instructions)

brickster69 · 23-10-2023 09:26AM

pjohnson

Oct 23, 2023

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121273154#Comment_121273154
So are you finally admitting it wasn't Israel at last?

What do you mean ?

Discodog · 23-10-2023 09:31AM

Israel has negotiated before & this only encourages further hostage taking.

Meanwhile Ghada Karmi a Palestinian academic is on Sky News claiming that Israel are too cowardly to invade Gaza & that they will run away.

Gatling · 23-10-2023 09:36AM

Discodog

Oct 23, 2023

Israel has negotiated before & this only encourages further hostage taking.
Meanwhile Ghada Karmi a Palestinian academic is on Sky News claiming that Israel are too cowardly to invade Gaza & that they will run away.

Israeli military now saying it could be months before they move in ,Hamas we're expecting they would Rush in head on into what they had set up , Israel now just had to sit back and bomb away until they are ready to go on there terms

Flinty997 · 23-10-2023 09:45AM

Tony EH

Oct 23, 2023

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121272845#Comment_121272845
They're not going about it terribly well are they? Indiscriminate bombing and wanton spoliation is only going to drive people into the arms of Hamas. Israel would do well to take a look at this Island and how support and the ranks of the IRA swelled after bloody Sunday. Israel aren't going to defeat Hamas with their current line of activity and I fail to see what strategic value it has for them. Murdering thousands of civilians in the pursuit of a revenge is only going to create a new generation of Palestinians who'll want to seek their own retribution further down the line.

I think driving people into Hama's is moot after one of their biggest attacks on Israel, and continuous rocket attacks from them. That ship has sailed.

They want to drive the population out, and strike all known Hama's resources. Soften the place up prior to invading it.

Unless the US can talk Israel out of it, they will occupy gaza fully this time.

Sudden Valley · 23-10-2023 09:49AM

Tony EH

Oct 23, 2023

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121272845#Comment_121272845
They're not going about it terribly well are they? Indiscriminate bombing and wanton spoliation is only going to drive people into the arms of Hamas. Israel would do well to take a look at this Island and how support and the ranks of the IRA swelled after bloody Sunday. Israel aren't going to defeat Hamas with their current line of activity and I fail to see what strategic value it has for them. Murdering thousands of civilians in the pursuit of a revenge is only going to create a new generation of Palestinians who'll want to seek their own retribution further down the line.

I think this is a good point on how exactly Israel is planning to get rid of Hamas. Hamas as government can be gotten rid of, I suppose, but the Hamas militants can just disappear amongst the civilians moving South. Also if they keep Gaza walled in and under blockade it is just a breeding ground for more terrorists. If you have a lot of young unemployed men it just leads to crime, or in this case terrorism.

23-10-2023 09:57AM

Sudden Valley

Oct 23, 2023

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121273175#Comment_121273175
I think this is a good point on how exactly Israel is planning to get rid of Hamas. Hamas as government can be gotten rid of, I suppose, but the Hamas militants can just disappear amongst the civilians moving South. Also if they keep Gaza walled in and under blockade it is just a breeding ground for more terrorists. If you have a lot of young unemployed men it just leads to crime, or in this case terrorism.

Israel can at least cut off the head of the snake.

Whilst you can readily replace ordinary fighters on the ground, inexperienced as they may be, you cannot readily replace commanders etc.

I don't think Israel can 100% eliminate Hamas, but they can eliminate it to the extent that it's unviable.

Nermal · 23-10-2023 09:57AM

BailenaMbocht

Oct 23, 2023

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121272871#Comment_121272871
The "fanatical terrorist arab" thinking is mostly due the news networks propaganda/social engineering. The constant repetition about evil arabs does a good job at convincing the ajority of the public.
hamass are a response to israels killing and abuse of the local people.
al-Qaida formed with USA help to fight russia.
ISIS are a response to US/UK's killing of millions of innocent locals.
The western war mongers/colonists are the real terrorists in this story. It would be interesting to see how history records this era of the people in power controlling all what the public consume for news, giving them free reign to wipe out millions of civilians while being celebrated by the public. Crazy world

Everything is the West's fault, isn't it BailenaMbocht?

Sudden Valley · 23-10-2023 10:05AM

[Deleted User]

Oct 23, 2023

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121273268#Comment_121273268
Israel can at least cut off the head of the snake.
Whilst you can readily replace ordinary fighters on the ground, inexperienced as they may be, you cannot readily replace commanders etc.
I don't think Israel can 100% eliminate Hamas, but they can eliminate it to the extent that it's unviable.

I feel they are like a Dublin drugs gang. You knock off one, another one just replaces it. They definitely need to kill the supply of rockets and other equipment to the Hamas replacement but the method of blockade just seems to make Hamas or a similar organization more powerful.

Danzy · 23-10-2023 10:54AM

Discodog

Oct 23, 2023

Israel has negotiated before & this only encourages further hostage taking.
Meanwhile Ghada Karmi a Palestinian academic is on Sky News claiming that Israel are too cowardly to invade Gaza & that they will run away.

Another few months of non stop and constantly eacalating air strikes it is then Ghada.

Obviously he didn't condemn Hamas. Didn't ask for the hostages to be released, didn't call for a 2 state solution , didn't say why can't we all just get along.

Danzy · 23-10-2023 10:56AM

Sudden Valley

Oct 23, 2023

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121273295#Comment_121273295
I feel they are like a Dublin drugs gang. You knock off one, another one just replaces it. They definitely need to kill the supply of rockets and other equipment to the Hamas replacement but the method of blockade just seems to make Hamas or a similar organization more powerful.

Limit their ability to reach Israel, don't have it bordering the country.

At the least turn North of the wadi in to an empty quarter and a mile from the border all the way down to be empty as well.

Going forward Gaza will have to depend on Egypt for electricity etc, the days of Israel keeping it going are over.

Sudden Valley · 23-10-2023 10:59AM

Danzy

Oct 23, 2023

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121273320#Comment_121273320
Limit their ability to reach Israel, don't have it bordering the country.
At the least turn North of the wadi in to an empty quarter and a mile from the border all the way down to be empty as well.
Going forward Gaza will have to depend on Egypt for electricity etc, the days of Israel keeping it going are over.

it is in their country though. it is not an independent country or part of Egypt. Egypt has to agree to accept it. And that make it even less able to stop to be stop the rockets being smuggled in. Also is the blockade going to stop then?

Hamas strike on Israel - mod warning in OP updated 19/10/23

Comments

The family are receiving text messages saying we spit on you from her boyfriends phone, somebody tried to spend her money in a Shop in Gaza

Welcome!