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Hamas strike on Israel - mod warning in OP updated 19/10/23

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,616 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    Yes, laying siege to because they are fighting human animals. Nowhere does he apply that term to all Palestinians.

    Well does he? Find us the line where he does so? You can't and you won't because you know he doesn't.

    During World War Two, the Allies blockaded the Continent. That doesn't mean their fight was with everyone inside the borders under Nazi control.

    The human animals being HAMAS. The siege is part of the military attack against HAMAS who are in Gaza.

    So you are just proving the point.

    You know the same HAMAS you refuse to acknowledge and condemn for executing babies and raping victims before executing them.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,147 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    Who are they laying siege to?

    The entire population.

    Can you not see that?

    Have you misunderstood like the last time? Confused again?

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,616 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    No confusion, I can spot clear and blatant misrepresentation when I see it. 

    Nowhere does he apply that term to all Palestinians does he?

    Find us the line where he does so? Should be easy to do. You can't and you won't because you know he doesn't.

    In the absence of you doing so, you discredit your own claim and prove it has no foundation.

    During World War Two, the Allies blockaded the Continent and laid siege to cities. That doesn't mean their fight was with everyone inside those borders under Nazi control.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,147 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    Show me where refers to Hamas as human animals. He doesn’t.

    He says we are blockading “GAZA” because we are fighting human animals. Why defend this?

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,747 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    Who said that's what they were doing?

    I see no HAMAS flags in that video.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 698 ✭✭✭TedBundysDriver


    The language is important. If he meant to say we are laying siege to human animals as a direct remark in regards Hamas he should have stated that and not said it in the wider context of the people of Gaza. If i'm Palestinian and i hear that i'm thinking it's directed at me and my people.

    Amnesty International’s new investigation shows that Israel imposes a system of oppression and domination against Palestinians across all areas under its control: in Israel and the OPT, and against Palestinian refugees, in order to benefit Jewish Israelis. This amounts to apartheid as prohibited in international law.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,678 ✭✭✭Multipass


    ..



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,147 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    Are captured Israeli soldiers POWs? Their government says they are at war.

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,616 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    Nope. It is your claim. So show me where he refers to all Palestinians as human animals. He doesn't.

    So after multiple times of asking, you are completely unable to show where he used it to describe all Palestinians. Claim rejected as false disinformation.

    It was clearly in reference to Hamas fighters:

    Israel’s defence minister on Monday announced a “complete siege” of Gaza, describing the Palestinian fighters who attacked Israel over the weekend as “human animals”.

    https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/israel-defence-minister-human-animals-gaza-palestine_uk_65245ebae4b0a32c15bfe6b6

    The same Hamas terrorists whose actions including execution of children and rape of victims which you refuse to accept and condemn.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,678 ✭✭✭Multipass


    My phone is not quoting posts everytime. Here’s my deleted one

    ‘No-one would be to blame in that scenario, war is responsible. 

    What a ludicrous comparison, the civilians brutalised and dragged away are not comparable to POWs.’


    why are you bringing up soldiers. It’s quite clear who I was referring to - we’ve all seen their bloodied faces and bodies, little children and elderly too. Their captors are savages.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,616 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    He never said we are laying siege to human animals though.

    He said we are fighting humans animals i.e. Hamas. Words which are completely understandable in the context of the atrocities carried out by Hamas in the last few days.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,147 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    This is your claim

    He said that HAMAS were human animals and declared a siege.

    You are incorrect. Not for the first time.

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,616 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    Nope. Follow the posts back. I was challenging an earlier false claim. It was never my claim in the first place.

    Strange you never seem to subject anti Israeli claims to the same level of scrutiny as posts like mine challenging misinformation about Israel. Or rather obvious example anti Israel agenda in your posts.

    And look, another post, another time where you refuse to condemn Hamas for executing children, for rape, and for other horrific crimes.

    Proof positive you are incorrect:

    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121224219#Comment_121224219

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 698 ✭✭✭TedBundysDriver


    And nobody is saying Hamas aren't human animals are they but the Palestinians aren't right?

    Also i'm pretty sure the remark human animals is pretty stupid anyway as most animals wouldn't conduct themselves in such a evil way.

    Amnesty International’s new investigation shows that Israel imposes a system of oppression and domination against Palestinians across all areas under its control: in Israel and the OPT, and against Palestinian refugees, in order to benefit Jewish Israelis. This amounts to apartheid as prohibited in international law.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,147 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    You are denying what you said in your own post now.

    Incredible.

    He didn’t mention Hamas. Own it.

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,313 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    Hold on, were you saying in other threads that the police in the US should beat Trump supporters off the streets?

    Off topic, but come on, at least be consistent.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    A day after 1,200 civilians were massacred, they came out against Israel in these marches, waving the flag of the territory whose leaders were responsible for that attack.

    That is crass and revolting, at the very least.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,616 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    I agree on the choice of words re: animals, but you could make the same argument though about any perjorative phrase used. We are fighting X, whether that be barbarians or whatever. It was clear it related to HAMAS fighters as the article I linked noted.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,616 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    Nope. He didn't mention all Palestinians. That is disinformation spread by you and others, which is what I challenged. I challenged the false claim, I was not the one who brought it up as a point. The onus is on those claiming it to justify it.

    Noted once again your refusal to acknowledge and condemn Hamas for the execution of children, for rape, for mass murder.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 698 ✭✭✭TedBundysDriver


    Their country/families/communities are being blown to bits by the IDF but yeah how dare they protest.

    They've every right to come out against Israel.

    Amnesty International’s new investigation shows that Israel imposes a system of oppression and domination against Palestinians across all areas under its control: in Israel and the OPT, and against Palestinian refugees, in order to benefit Jewish Israelis. This amounts to apartheid as prohibited in international law.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,678 ✭✭✭Multipass


    Why the distinction between Hamas and ‘the Palestinians’? Hamas are Palestinian, and are supported by a certain percentage of the population, including those living abroad who could speak out, but don’t.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,616 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    Well there's a difference between saying we want to eradicate Hamas in terms of its fighters and organisation and saying we want to eradicate the Palestinian people.

    Anymore than saying we want to eradicate Nazism versus say the German people.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 569 ✭✭✭Long Sean Silver


    posters are arguing in circles, and this thread has predictably descended into a "my atrocity is bigger than your atrocity" competition.

    Mods should shut it down before it becomes even more ghoulish



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,678 ✭✭✭Multipass


    Oh I agree. My comment is more to do with the criticism of Israel’s response, as if Hamas is some other entity that has nothing to do with Palestinians. I’m sure some civilians there hate Hamas, and I’m sure many others give them every help they can.



  • Posts: 7,272 ✭✭✭ Bella Slow Strawberry


    Nuance has been lost within the scramble to call each other anti semites or supporters of child murder.

    It is fascinating however to watch Palestinian supporters outright refuse to condemn Hamas, but will happily become belligerent if you don’t condemn Israel for everything, including what they had for breakfast this morning.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,747 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    Because when a terrorist organisation acts the way they did last weekend, it's vital that the distinction be made between people of that ilk and innocent civilians.

    HAMAS are NOT "The Palestinians". The same way ETA weren't "The Basques".

    Of course, to some on here, they want it to be the same thing.

    Post edited by Tony EH on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,692 ✭✭✭enfant terrible




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,841 ✭✭✭TomTomTim


    I was jokingly going to suggest shutting it down after reading the first part, but you actually said it. What's wrong with certain people on boards, where if they aren't happy with how a thread is going, they want it to be shut down? Leave the thread, no one is forcing you to be here.

    “The man who lies to himself can be more easily offended than anyone else. You know it is sometimes very pleasant to take offense, isn't it? A man may know that nobody has insulted him, but that he has invented the insult for himself, has lied and exaggerated to make it picturesque, has caught at a word and made a mountain out of a molehill--he knows that himself, yet he will be the first to take offense, and will revel in his resentment till he feels great pleasure in it.”- ― Fyodor Dostoevsky, The Brothers Karamazov




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,692 ✭✭✭enfant terrible




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,147 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    You know I have already condemned the barbaric Hamas attack. You know that. You are trying to distract from what you said that was incorrect. But I am not engaging with your errors anymore. Own them, disown them. I don’t care.

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



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