General Premier League Thread 2023-24 Mod Note in op 27/6/23 And 21/05/24

I missed that, thanks.

Tomorrow night.

And yes, all coaches want a siege mentality. Pep does it all the time, for instance. Ferguson did it. Mourinho, obviously. they use things to create a certain mentality. nothing new.

We should all remember that this wasn't Klopp demanding a replay. As I've said, I wouldn't have even mentioned the word, because it's pointless and gets everyone jumping on it. He just said he'd like to see one. He shouldn't have said it, but it is not the same.

So let's not pretend that Klopp was in a press conference ranting and raving, as I know many are imagining.

Yes, I skipped a day by accident. i think you hit the nail on the head. Shouldn’t have said it. Had a reason for saying it. Whether it works or not is to be seen. But you are completely right, he wasn’t having a Kevin keegan ‘I’d love it ‘ moment. He did say it though, and have to expect laughter from opposition fans. Probably not to the same extent as seen though.

Probably not. But we'd hardly be their favourite club in the world given how we seem to beat them every season at our place and now and again at theirs. I'd say if they were trying to fix a game, it wouldn't involve us unless we were the screwees.

And let's be fair, none of the teams in the PL are really competing with City. They don't need to fix games to win trophies.

"Don't minimise what he said"

In other words...

"Let us make as big a deal out of this as we possibly can, because if we can make a massive deal out of this, even more than has been already, then it might have everyone laugh at Liverpool, because that's how I get my kicks..."

Of course not everyone is, and indeed most people are rational reasonable folks, but it's quite easy to see the few people who do have an extra bit of revelry in the subject through the sheer posting volume and content on the topic (and their own stated admissions of how much they're enjoying this...)

Nope, like I said, he wasn’t ranting and raving. I’ve never tried to say he was because that would be misrepresenting what he said and how he said it.

But he didn’t “just say he’d like to see a replay.” He said he thought that should be the only outcome.

Business is full of wanky phrases like that though. Football doesn’t need it and you don’t see that sort of language very often from clubs. There was an air of threat about it and when coupled with the “sporting integrity has been compromised “ phrase, it fed into a belief amongst elements of the Liverpool fanbase that “we’ve been screwed and we’re gonna bring this as far as we can.” I also think Klopp understands English well enough to understand the phrase and its usage. It was just a poor statement.

Let’s be fair. They issued it early on Sunday I think. You have to give PGMOL time to understand what happened and take action to correct which I fully believe they would have anyway. So a statement expressing disappointment with the events of Saturday, welcoming the admission of an error and “we’ll monitor developments” would have been better. If nothing happened after a few days, that would have been the time to go harder.

It was strong, but clear language. Again as I said before, I have zero issue with that statement, and to be honest using established industry terms is actually part of the solution in this case.

Like, I think using terms like escalate/resolve - being the literal industry standard terms for fixing problems - is far better than using "less wanky" more casual terms. Casual language is how we got into this mess. This isn't an emotive plea or something, it's a request for review and validation of a technical process.

As for the reference of sporting integrity, well, of course an error where officials know the correct outcome, but knowingly continue with the wrong outcome falls under the category - hence such a need for reform.

As for your second post - so in contrast to earlier saying; "don't minimise what he said", you're saying "don't minimise the bits I want to focus on, but ignore the other bits that were said to intentionally minimise the bits i want to focus on?". Klopp regularly gives his personal opinions on everything from racism to Brexit during press conferences. he always caveats that with it being his own opinion and not speaking on the club. He did the same in this case, literally stating it clearly so there could be no confusion. I don't particularly have a problem with him thinking in an ideal world the fairest thing is a do-over, while recognising it could never happen in reality. I don't exactly agree with it, but I don't have an issue with the opinion, stated as it was. I definitely don't want any official request for one.

That's fair enough - I wouldn't really agree with either yourself or Klopp on it I suppose. I don't think it's an entirely ridiculous personal opinion, but it definitely wouldn't be my opinion, and I don't think it's actually the right outcome.

His name is Darren England so not sure if the other fella you mention is too bothered:)

This is an issue of process and not towards an individual; the mistake was hard to fathom until you hear the audio. However, if that is how they manage these decisions then it is not hard to see how mistakes could happen again, it was like he was annoyed to be disturbed from something else and was just ya, ya, whatever it is fine.

The standard of referees in the PL is very average so there should be more openings for change be that from abroad or within England but it seems once you get the gig then often you keep the role regardless of your performance. This must be disheartening for other referees in the lower divisions.

So clubs can now have a say in who takes charge of their games?

Thats not problematic.

Since when have they? Or are you just trying to infer that Liverpool are now? Or how did you come to that conclusion from the article? It never mentions that clubs, or one in particular are.

The official in question is the centre point of an unprecedented error. Its not a subjective thing. It's not 'one of those' or 'just another example '.

Why do people think this is the worst incident ever to happen in VAR? It was a breakdown in communication rather than an actual completely incorrect decision. I’d be more bothered with an incident that they looked at, where it’s clear as day that it was a goal but chalked off as opposed to this incident.